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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 10/8/2012 4:45 PM   
captinjohn


 

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Status: offline 		If toothpaste would damage a crome surface....I sure would like to see that....how about a photo ....from the guy that stated that!!!!!!

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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 10/8/2012 5:03 PM   
TexasSkyPilot



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Status: offline 		Maybe toothpaste delivered by way of some sort of a power tool. Otherwise, it would take you most of the day and WHOLE LOT of toothpaste. I think the rag or whatever you're applying it with would have just as much in the way of abrasive qualities, if not more.

There's a kind of toothpaste, used by Dental hygienists, called prophy paste. That actually has pumice in it. You could lap a valve with the heavier version of that stuff. That's why you have to rinse out your mouth (or why they rinse it out for you, depends on the dentist), and why you feel little bits of grit afterwards.

But regular toothpaste has not had pumice in it for decades now. Bicarb of soda, stuff like that. Nothing truly abrasive.

And yes, I am an expert witness when it comes to this.

~ Jim ~

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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 10/8/2012 5:35 PM   
blw



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quote:

ORIGINAL: captinjohn

If toothpaste would damage a crome surface....I sure would like to see that....how about a photo ....from the guy that stated that!!!!!!


The point is that nobody ever said that. Go figure.

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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 10/8/2012 7:55 PM  1 votes
SrTelemaster150



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quote:

ORIGINAL: TexasSkyPilot

Maybe toothpaste delivered by way of some sort of a power tool. Otherwise, it would take you most of the day and WHOLE LOT of toothpaste. I think the rag or whatever you're applying it with would have just as much in the way of abrasive qualities, if not more.

There's a kind of toothpaste, used by Dental hygienists, called prophy paste. That actually has pumice in it. You could lap a valve with the heavier version of that stuff. That's why you have to rinse out your mouth (or why they rinse it out for you, depends on the dentist), and why you feel little bits of grit afterwards.

But regular toothpaste has not had pumice in it for decades now. Bicarb of soda, stuff like that. Nothing truly abrasive.

And yes, I am an expert witness when it comes to this.

~ Jim ~



You apply the toothpaste to the valve face, insert the valve into the guide & use your fingers to rotate the valve from the outside in a pulling, spinning motion. I does not "grind" or "lap" the valves as much as it cleans/polishes the surfaces thouroughly removing stubborn varnish.

Water cleans up all traces of the toothpaste.

We used to use toothpaste to burnish brass gear cogs in slot cars way back when. You could get the gears meshing so smoothly that they were nearly silent. The noise from the raw gear teeth was energy lost. The quieter gears allowed more power to go to the wheels.

There are still mild abrasives in tooth paste. The harsh abrasives were removed way back in the '60s.

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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 10/8/2012 8:19 PM   
byjoe


 

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From: ROCHESTER, NY, USA
Status: offline 		I have a Saito FA 30 4c that has open rocker arms.Trying to find out how old it is . .It looks like it may be one of their first 4c engines.

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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 10/8/2012 8:53 PM   
TexasSkyPilot



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Status: offline 		Sr Telemaster 150,

My brother lives about ten minutes from you, in Potsdam. Nice spot to live.

~ Jim ~

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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 10/8/2012 11:56 PM   
SrTelemaster150



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quote:

ORIGINAL: TexasSkyPilot

Sr Telemaster 150,

My brother lives about ten minutes from you, in Potsdam. Nice spot to live.

~ Jim ~



Does he fly R/C?

Potsdam is more like 20 minutes away, 18 miles.

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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 10/9/2012 12:06 AM   
TexasSkyPilot



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From: San Antonio, TX, USA
Status: offline 		I haven't seen any buildup on any Saito seats I ever had. I had a couple of valves lock up during one winter when I forgot to use after-run oil late in the fall.

They weren't frozen, so much as sticky. I put after-run oil in and worked them for a while. I'm sure some scale had developed over the winter. Fortunately, no lasting effects.

Compared to auto and motorcycle heads, the Saitos I work on are always pristine in comparison. I suppose a lot depends upon the conditions under which it was run. Cowled in without a lot of air, running hot for that reason or some other reason. The glows can get buildup from heat, that's for sure.

I'm all but out of the Saito club these days. One .72a, in my little Sig Sundancer Bipe. Powerful for a small 4-stroke!

I've gone to gassers for the rest. But my flying buddies will see to it that I still get to work on plenty of them! Phil brought a radial over the other day to troubleshoot. Once we took that dust cover off the venturi, it ran pretty good!

~ Jim ~

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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 10/9/2012 12:28 AM   
TexasSkyPilot



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Status: offline 		No, he's a sports nut and does it from his armchair.

He works at the college there.

~ Jim ~

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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 10/9/2012 1:20 AM   
rowdyjoe


 

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Status: offline 		I want to put new bearings in my FA-80GK but, Boca offers 5 different types.  Which one do you guys recommend?

SAITO - FA-80, 80 Econo Power RC Engine Bearings

SAITO - FA-80, 80 High Performance RC Engine Bearings

SAITO - FA-80, 80 Stainless Steel RC Engine Bearings

SAITO - FA-80, 80 Ceramic Lightning Performance RC Engine Bearings

SAITO - FA-80, 80 Ceramic High Performance RC Engine Bearings


Thanks,
RJ



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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 10/9/2012 1:28 AM   
alan0899


 

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From: AttungaNSW, AUSTRALIA
Status: offline 		G'day RJ,
I always prefer Stainless bearings, a lot less rust to worry about, & I know someone will disagree,
but with a 4 stroke, the revs are a lot less than a 2 stroke, so high performance is not an issue.
Just my 2 cents worth.

Cheers

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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 10/9/2012 1:29 AM   
barry wetherell


 

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From: port hedlandwestern australia, AUSTRALIA
Status: offline 		Rowdyjoe, ...I look at these factors ; 1 - how much am I going to use that engine
2 - what size model am I going to put it in
the econo bearings are ok, I have them in several engines, and at the other end of the scale, I dont believe there is anything gained from using the most expensive ones, so it really is a matter of choice
A.A. Barry

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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 10/9/2012 3:28 AM   
rowdyjoe


 

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Status: offline 		Thanks guys. I went with the stainless bearings.  I figure they will outlast me and the plane. 

RJ



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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 10/9/2012 4:33 AM   
Ernie Misner



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From: Tacoma, WA, USA
Status: offline 		Just curious, I haven't heard of anyone ordering from RC Bearings lately. Aren't these FA 80 prices considerably cheaper?

http://www.rcbearings.com/saito-80-bearings/ Ask for Paul

Thanks, Ernie

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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 10/9/2012 4:48 AM   
rowdyjoe


 

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Status: offline 		Ernie,
     Wasn't aware of RC Bearings until now.  Everyone recommends Boca so, that's where I bought mine. 
Yes, the price does appear to be much cheaper at RC Bearings.  Assuming the quality is the same, it's a deal you can't refuse ....about 1/2 price.

RJ



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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 10/9/2012 4:50 AM   
Ernie Misner



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Status: offline 		Well keep Paul in mind. He used to be more active here at RCU but is keeping a lower profile now I guess. The bearings should be the same quality, ... hey ask Paul!

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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 10/9/2012 7:40 AM   
frets24


 

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From: charlotte, NC, USA
Status: offline 		Paul is just busy lately, it seems. Uptick in business? I still get promotional emails on a regular basis. Great people there at RCB and the bearings are all from high end, quality MFG's.

I like the SS bearings with the open phenolic cages...no worries on corrosion or pitting to slow them up and plenty of open space for the lube to get everywhere it needs to easily.




Club Saito #770

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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 10/9/2012 1:35 PM   
Old Fart


 

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Status: offline 		You guys have got me worried,heaps of other folks too i'm bettin.Who says bearing quality beats how carefully you fit them?

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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 10/9/2012 5:18 PM   
Frank Schwartz


 

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From: Hendersonville, TN, USA
Status: offline 		Well, I only have a couple of Saitos, but found them to be superior engines. Some many years ago when they first came out with the .30 with exposed rockers, I bought one and put it in a swizzle stick and used it as a trainer. I ran it on stock 10% fuel which had some castor in it. I ran it many many hours. Finally I fouind the valve stems so worn that they looked like they would break if you touched one. I had to buy a complete head which had the valves etc in it as a unit.
When I took the engine down, it was clean inside and when I reassembled it with the new head/valves the compression was as new...I could not find any wear in the sleeve or piston....don't know what they used but that baby had many hours of running and still was as tight as new....
They make one fine and long lasting engine....the best!!!! I have an 80 of theirs in a Bruce Tharp Flyin' King and it pulls it with authority....

Regards to all,
Frank Schwartz AMA123
87 years young and still building and flying...........happiness, for sure.....

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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 10/9/2012 5:38 PM   
JNorton



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From: Coopersville, MI, USA
Status: offline 		You have to fit them carefully no matter what type of bearing you use. Ceramics are especially fussy when it come to installation. I like standard high performance steel bearings myself. I believe SS is softer than normal steels. Just my two cents.
John

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Ultimate Brotherhood #11, Ultra Sport Brotherhood #90

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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 10/9/2012 5:53 PM   
blw



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Status: offline 		Frank, we had a crazy club member who had a red Flying King and the 80 pulled it with stump pulling authority. I saw several dozen imminent crashes saved literally at the last second only by the sheer grunt power of the 80.

I also saw that this Flying King would fly perfectly fine with all of the covering peeled back from the whole fuselage side. Flapping back in the breeze like a streamer. Flight after flight.

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"It doesn''t take but one Auburn man to be a majority" -
Coach Pat Dye

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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 10/9/2012 7:11 PM   
lopflyers


 

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Status: offline 		What!!! , you are 87 and your AMA # is 123? I admire you and wish I will still be flying at that tender age. Keep it up sir.

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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 10/9/2012 10:00 PM   
rowdyjoe


 

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Status: offline 		Stainless is harder but, more brittle than other steel alloys.  I went with stainless to reduce the chance of corrosion. 





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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 10/9/2012 10:09 PM   
rowdyjoe


 

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From: Arlington, TX, USA
Status: offline 		I ordered a gasket kit and a few other small items from Advantage Hobby.  They had everything I needed at a better price than Horizon and they are Saito parts ...not after-market.  I've called my experienced friend who has rebuilt many, many glow engines and he agreed to help me with my FA-80GK.  We'll do the deed as soon as the parts arrive.

OOOPs ....almost forgot to mention the results of the carb kit installation.  The engine is running much better now but, still haven't found the sweet spot.  I haven't been able to get the idle below 2400 and the max rpm is around 9100 with a 13x6 prop.  However, it's not running a steady rpm at full throttle.  It will vary by as much as 200 to 300 rpm when peaked. Before installing the kit, I saw as much as 10k rpm at full throttle with the same size prop. 
Any ideas or opinions on what may be causing this variation at full throttle?
I'm getting a good transition now where I couldn't get one at all before.  I need to get the low end and high end tuned now.




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RE: Welcome to Club SAITO ! - 10/10/2012 12:50 AM  1 votes
SrTelemaster150



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quote:

ORIGINAL: JNorton

I believe SS is softer than normal steels. Just my two cents.
John




quote:

ORIGINAL: rowdyjoe

Stainless is harder but, more brittle than other steel alloys.  I went with stainless to reduce the chance of corrosion. 





JNorton was right. SS is softer than carbon steel, but it is tougher. It resists corrosion & in rifle barrels, it also resists errosion in the throat from hot gasses. It can also be harder to machine.

High carbon steel is harder & more brittle than SS. I much prefer high carbon steel to SS if knife blades. SS is harder to get a good edge on & it doesn't stay sharp as long . When corrosion is an issue, like razor blades, SS cutting edges last longer.

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