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Opensource CDI ignition - 10/5/2005 1:27:46 AM   
jmj


 

Posts: 33
Joined: 2/17/2003
From: Tromso, NORWAY
Status: offline 		As some of you aleready know, i have a CDI project on my homepage.
Tonight i have made a big update to the pages, so please have a look at it.

Some info of my CDI:
-Runs from a normal 4.8V RX battery
-Programmable advance curve
-Built from easy to find parts
-Integrated strobe light, using a hi intensity LED
-Integrated test function - no need for a signal generator
-The advance control can be separated from the PCB and be used to upgrade other CDI's without advance control
-Low part count
-Can use a homemade coil

The CDI is tested and works, but there is still an issue with noise from the high voltage board reaching the advance board.
This should not be too hard to fix.

This project is totally open source, all the info you need can be downloaded from my pages.
I get a lot of email about this project, so it may be better to use this forum to share problems and ideas.

My homepage is at: http://home.online.no/~jon-mj/cdi_ignition.htm

Regards,
Jon-Magne Johansen

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       Post #: 1

RE: Opensource CDI ignition - 10/5/2005 1:38:00 AM   
blueberry


 

Posts: 202
Joined: 9/25/2004
From: saegertown, PA, USA
Status: offline 		Looks like a great project. I am very interested in the outcome.
I don't know much about this stuff but could you use something to filter the noise from the high voltage board?

Pete

(in reply to jmj)
       Post #: 2

RE: Opensource CDI ignition - 10/5/2005 1:49:39 AM   
jmj


 

Posts: 33
Joined: 2/17/2003
From: Tromso, NORWAY
Status: offline 		Yes, the next thing to do is to make a filter of some kind.
I have already made some tests, but i will try to keep it simple, so i will have to experiment some more..

Jon-Magne

(in reply to jmj)
       Post #: 3

RE: Opensource CDI ignition - 10/5/2005 2:20:54 AM   
blueberry


 

Posts: 202
Joined: 9/25/2004
From: saegertown, PA, USA
Status: offline 		Would any of the products from this company work for filtering?
www.wirelessdesignonline.com/ecommcenters/majrproducts.html

Pete

(in reply to jmj)
       Post #: 4

RE: Opensource CDI ignition - 10/5/2005 2:32:34 AM   
jmj


 

Posts: 33
Joined: 2/17/2003
From: Tromso, NORWAY
Status: offline 		Yes, probably. But i do not want to use 'exotic' components. I will need to make a filter by using diodes/capacitors/resistors.
The whole idea of this project is to keep it simple and low cost.

Jon-Magne

(in reply to blueberry)
       Post #: 5

RE: Opensource CDI ignition - 10/5/2005 2:42:09 AM   
blueberry


 

Posts: 202
Joined: 9/25/2004
From: saegertown, PA, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: jmj

Yes, probably. But i do not want to use 'exotic' components. I will need to make a filter by using diodes/capacitors/resistors.
The whole idea of this project is to keep it simple and low cost.

Jon-Magne


I understand, Just wondered as this company is just up the road from me.
I checked out your site, that is some spark on your video!

Pete

(in reply to jmj)
       Post #: 6

RE: Opensource CDI ignition - 10/5/2005 7:40:07 AM   
diablo_r



Posts: 67
Joined: 4/26/2005
From: Co Durham, UNITED KINGDOM
Status: offline 		couple of questions JMJ, I made the circuit last night but it does not work quite right. On the far right of your schematic there is a resistor and capcitor (C6 and R1) now it says on the diagram to use 4.7uF, but in the parts list it says 4.7nF. I'm just wondering if this is my problem. It makes enormous sparks, but the circuit free runs at about 1Hz, it sits there happily sparking to itself but I'm getting over 600v from the diode bridge

PS, your toroid pics, is that really 0.1 wire for the 450 turns, it looks a bit thicker? I gave up on 0.1 as my fingers are too big to wind it so used 0.2.


Cheers,
Rich

(in reply to blueberry)
       Post #: 7

RE: Opensource CDI ignition - 10/5/2005 7:56:56 AM   
jmj


 

Posts: 33
Joined: 2/17/2003
From: Tromso, NORWAY
Status: offline 		C6 is a electrolytic capasitor of 4.7uF/16V. Obviously an error in the parts list, sorry.
If you get 600V, at least the high voltage board is OK. This is a new record, the most i have got is 350V.

If it sparks by itself, it sounds like you have activated the test function, or have a problem with the PIC.
Try removing the wire bridge between the 2 parts of the board, and see if it stops.

The wire in the pictures is thicker than 0.1mm, it is not a picture of my torroid.
I used 0.1mm, but it is not important.

Jon-Magne

(in reply to diablo_r)
       Post #: 8

RE: Opensource CDI ignition - 10/5/2005 8:14:12 AM   
diablo_r



Posts: 67
Joined: 4/26/2005
From: Co Durham, UNITED KINGDOM
Status: offline 		Thanks for the reply! I think this might me my problem, I said 600v but thats all my volt meter goes up to you cans ee the voltage rise as it charges, it hits the 600v limit and JUST afterwards it self discharges, what I think is happeneing is the DC volts are so high it jumps across the thyristor internally, that dicharges the high volt capacitor and it makes the spark at the plug. I did not have the PIC board connected so there was no prob there. I'll change the 4.7nF for a 4.7uF tonight and try that. I was running off a 6v battery.

My home made coil did not work either, you can hear it sparking internally. I'm going to wind another with an insulation layer between each run of secondary.

Cheers,
Rich

(in reply to jmj)
       Post #: 9

RE: Opensource CDI ignition - 10/5/2005 8:25:31 AM   
diablo_r



Posts: 67
Joined: 4/26/2005
From: Co Durham, UNITED KINGDOM
Status: offline 		sorry, more questions.

In the early schematic there was no resistor in parallel with the high voltage cap, but R11 (10meg) is there now. Also R9 has been added (10k). Could you just let me know the function. I'm guessing R11 is to discharge the cap when the ignition is not turned on, and R9 is to limit the switching current through T1, but maybe I'm wrong!

Cheers,
Rich

(in reply to diablo_r)
       Post #: 10

RE: Opensource CDI ignition - 10/5/2005 8:37:50 AM   
Ben_C


 

Posts: 2
Joined: 10/5/2005
From: , AUSTRALIA
Status: offline 		I built a high voltage board which worked OK - though my voltmeter recorded between 500V-600V from 6V input. I had a few odd behaviours with the SCR triggering the spark: the spark would trigger, but only start to recharge when I earthed the trigger.

Also, I only triggered a spark when I used a 1.2V power source as the trigger, I tried connecting directly to a Hall sensor but it didn't work. I don't understand the requirements of the Hall trigger circuit to trigger the CDI system. Any clues?

My high voltage coil is wound on an E-core. I would rather spend $200 on a professional CDI than wind another toroid coil! The E-core coil only took about 20 minutes to wind.

Thanks for the informative page, Jon.

Cheers,

Ben

(in reply to diablo_r)
       Post #: 11

RE: Opensource CDI ignition - 10/5/2005 9:12:10 AM   
diablo_r



Posts: 67
Joined: 4/26/2005
From: Co Durham, UNITED KINGDOM
Status: offline
quote:

My high voltage coil is wound on an E-core. I would rather spend $200 on a professional CDI than wind another toroid coil!


HAHA, me too! have you any pics of your wound E core, I've got loads of E cores and as you say they are very easy to wind.

Cheers,
Rich

(in reply to Ben_C)
       Post #: 12

RE: Opensource CDI ignition - 10/5/2005 11:48:45 AM   
jmj


 

Posts: 33
Joined: 2/17/2003
From: Tromso, NORWAY
Status: offline 		R9 and R11 is not used, and should be left out.
The 7805 and its associated components is not needed, either.
These components is some leftovers from the previous design, and is not on the new PCB.
A new schematic will be uploaded soon, where these components are removed.

Jon-Magne

(in reply to diablo_r)
       Post #: 13

RE: Opensource CDI ignition - 10/5/2005 11:59:03 AM   
jmj


 

Posts: 33
Joined: 2/17/2003
From: Tromso, NORWAY
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Ben_C
I built a high voltage board which worked OK - though my voltmeter recorded between 500V-600V from 6V input. I had a few odd behaviours with the SCR triggering the spark: the spark would trigger, but only start to recharge when I earthed the trigger.

Reduce the value of R6 from 1K to 240ohm, and it should be OK.
The SCR need to be triggered quite 'hard' when it is switching high voltages.
This has a bad side effect - a hall device can not source enough current to trigger it directly.
It also place a big load on the output on the PIC, so maybe a transistor buffer will be a good idea.

Jon-Magne

(in reply to Ben_C)
       Post #: 14

RE: Opensource CDI ignition - 10/5/2005 10:23:45 PM   
diablo_r



Posts: 67
Joined: 4/26/2005
From: Co Durham, UNITED KINGDOM
Status: offline 		Hi Jon, another question. Changing the capacitor on the LV side fixed the voltage problems, it runs fine now at 380v DC. BUT.... I cannot get the thyristor to trigger the circuit. It works fine if you manually touch a wire to short the anode and cathode of the thyristor, but no matter waht volts I put to the gate I could not get it working. Could you tell me what voltage and current you give the thyristor gate please? I see fr the diagram you have a 470R resistor (R10) and C2 in the line from the PIC to the thyristor. I'm guessing the PIC puts out 5v and the resistor and capacitor are there to limit the volts and current passed to the thyristor gate?

What I'm trying to do it get the CDi part with fixed timing working for this weekend so I can go flying before I borrow a PIC programmer to do the PIC. I want to run the CDI circuit with a hall effect pickup as I already have a kettering circuit running on the engine off a hall sensor.


Thanks again in advance,
Rich

< Message edited by diablo_r -- 10/5/2005 10:25:48 PM >

(in reply to jmj)