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All Forums >> Glow Engines, Gas Engines, Fuel & Mfg Support Forums >> RC Fuels >> Which will cost more?
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Which will cost more? - 10/28/2005 8:19:18 PM   
Ryan_rammstien


 

Posts: 457
Joined: 8/9/2005
From: Sheffield, UNITED KINGDOM
Status: offline 		Im thinking of making my own fuel. But which will cost more:

# 1/2 gallon of 20% fuel from my lhs - £11
# 1/2 gallon of 20% hommade fuel

Ryan.


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RE: Which will cost more? - 10/28/2005 11:25:29 PM   
guver


 

Posts: 8974
Joined: 3/7/2003
From: LaGrange, OH, USA
Status: online 		depends on the price and quantity you buy. If you figure your labor and equipment the hobby shop will be far cheaper.

If you do a drum then you willbe cheaper to home brew.

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RE: Which will cost more? - 7/10/2008 8:58:52 PM   
Trisquire


 

Posts: 339
Joined: 1/13/2005
From: Columbus, OH, USA
Status: offline 		I found this article on using alcohol as an alternate fuel source for cars:

http://www.taemag.com/issues/articleID.18976/article_detail.asp

About half way down, it says the following: "Ethanol can currently be produced for about $1.50 per gallon, and methanol is selling for $0.90 per gallon." Tower wants $62.99 for a 4 gallon container of FAI fuel. That's $15.75 a gallon. Since glow fuel is 75-80% methanol, why is it so pricey? The lubricant is not all that expensive.

Tom

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RE: Which will cost more? - 7/10/2008 9:13:22 PM   
guver


 

Posts: 8974
Joined: 3/7/2003
From: LaGrange, OH, USA
Status: online 		I suppose it's like anything. Storage, transport, tax, shipping, labor , testing , mixing cost all add up.

oops, I forgot most important one. Profit.

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RE: Which will cost more? - 7/10/2008 11:35:19 PM   
balsaeater


 

Posts: 204
Joined: 5/20/2005
From: p, ANDORRA
Status: offline 		When you buy a river barge full of methanol some few thousand gallons the price for methanol is ~$1.00 per gallon

when you buy a 55 gallon drum the price is often ~$3.00 a gallon

When you get a single gallon after its been shipped in small lots at high HAZMAT rates ~10 a gallon plus is easily possible

Also lubricant is very expensive
castor is often three times the price of Methanol and synthetic is double that again
lucky we often only use ~ 20% lubricant

balsaeater

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RE: Which will cost more? - 7/10/2008 11:44:26 PM   
XJet


 

Posts: 3462
Joined: 3/31/2003
From: Tokoroa, NEW ZEALAND
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: balsaeater
lucky we often only use ~ 20% lubricant

Some of us only use 12% :-)



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RE: Which will cost more? - 7/10/2008 11:59:17 PM   
Trisquire


 

Posts: 339
Joined: 1/13/2005
From: Columbus, OH, USA
Status: offline 		Interesting. Thanks for the responses.

Tom

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RE: Which will cost more? - 7/11/2008 4:09:51 AM   
Fuelman


 

Posts: 1039
Joined: 12/31/2001
From: Jordan, NY, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Trisquire

I found this article on using alcohol as an alternate fuel source for cars:

http://www.taemag.com/issues/articleID.18976/article_detail.asp

About half way down, it says the following: "Ethanol can currently be produced for about $1.50 per gallon, and methanol is selling for $0.90 per gallon." Tower wants $62.99 for a 4 gallon container of FAI fuel. That's $15.75 a gallon. Since glow fuel is 75-80% methanol, why is it so pricey? The lubricant is not all that expensive.

Tom

Trisquire,
Since you resurected this thread from ages ago, I will reply to your post.
That article you link to is more wishfull thinking than factual, especially regarding the alcohol prices. It is also a dated article. Ethanol prices are higher than that even after the government subsady of .51 per gallon. Methanol is more than double that in HUGE quantities, and in small quantities less than a thousand gallons is about 3-4 times that.

Next, an alcohol economey is a losing proposition unless every farmer in the US that grows corn for ethanol switches to sugar beets and or sugar cane. Not only does it require more energy to produce a gallon of ethanol than the ethanol itself contains, it has so many incentives at so many different levels of subsidy going all the way back to the CORN grower, that nobody probably can put an accurate figure on how much it actualy costs per gallon to produce. Most people do not realize what an insane idea it is to use ethanol made from food crops, especially corn. You would actually have a much better energy equation if using sugar beets, but still not greater than the input energy.


Methanol is cheaper to produce than ethanol if and only if natural gas is used as a feedstock, however methanol does not mix with gasoline as well as ethanol does so other co-solvents must be used to make gas-ahol when using methanol.

Bottom line is the world runs on oil and oil by-products.

As for why a gallon of fuel cost so much-
Methanol costs a lot more than what the article or Balsaeater mentions, even a few thousand gallons at a time. Castor is very expensive too and I wish it only costs three times as much as methanol, even at todays prices and lets not even talk about nitro. Bottles, caps, labels, boxes, shipping, overhead have all gotten very expensive. Yes, we need a little profit too.




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RE: Which will cost more? - 7/11/2008 3:13:09 PM   
Trisquire


 

Posts: 339
Joined: 1/13/2005
From: Columbus, OH, USA
Status: offline 		Thanks Fuelman. Very informative. I'll keep Cooper Fuels in mind.

Tom

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RE: Which will cost more? - 7/11/2008 3:46:12 PM   
Sport_Pilot



Posts: 7727
Joined: 1/21/2002
From: Acworth, GA, USA
Status: offline 		Typically methanol costs about 25% more than gas. When gas was about $2.50 a gallon I bought methanol at $3.00 a gallon and nitro was $50 a gallon, that was about two years ago.

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RE: Which will cost more? - 7/11/2008 6:53:47 PM   
gkamysz


 

Posts: 1593
Joined: 6/24/2003
From: Crystal Lake, IL, USA
Status: online 		There is a guy local to me that sells methanol. Bring your container for $4 USD per gallon. Last year he was selling it at $3.

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RE: Which will cost more? - 7/11/2008 8:05:18 PM   
Trisquire


 

Posts: 339
Joined: 1/13/2005
From: Columbus, OH, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: gkamysz

There is a guy local to me that sells methanol. Bring your container for $4 USD per gallon. Last year he was selling it at $3.


I've been Googling local race car drag strips, to see what they have to offer.

Tom

(in reply to gkamysz)
       Post #: 12

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