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2006 MAAC NATS - 11/27/2005 2:32:45 PM   
extra300xs


 

Posts: 30
Joined: 10/29/2005
From: toronto, ON, CANADA
Status: offline 		I hear there is a lot bi.....ng on the other site - anyone hear if the 2006 Nats are on and where. I thought Chuck Smith had a win-win proposal for the Nats, what's happened?

quote:

Ok, let's cut to the chase here.

I thought Gerry Shaw and his organising group, which did the NATS last year, put a proposal through after it was declined by B.C. to do it again
in Chatham this year.

They did an excellent job, and those disciplines that DID attend had a great time. Those that did not - did not !!

It is also my understanding that they did the NATS without funding from MAAC, and are prepared to do it again this year the same way.

What's happening with that proposal?

Is there any other proposal?
What the heck is up?
Give us some kind of news at least!!

Get 'er done !!

Bob Hudson
       Post #: 1

RE: 2006 MAAC NATS - 11/27/2005 6:14:37 PM   
kenair


 

Posts: 492
Joined: 1/21/2002
From: winnipeg, MB, CANADA
Status: offline 		Yes, there is a lot of moaning and groaning over there,
the Nats must be hard sell for the obivious reasons............

now a week long camp at the field fly-in simliar to ther old Byrons Ida Grove or Joe Nall, now that would appeal to a lot more flyers.........................................

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(in reply to extra300xs)
       Post #: 2

RE: 2006 MAAC NATS - 11/28/2005 12:45:15 AM   
Jabba


 

Posts: 69
Joined: 1/27/2004
From: Windsor, ON, CANADA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: kenair

Yes, there is a lot of moaning and groaning over there,
the Nats must be hard sell for the obivious reasons............

now a week long camp at the field fly-in simliar to ther old Byrons Ida Grove or Joe Nall, now that would appeal to a lot more flyers.........................................



NO Kenair it's just the BOARD being A$$es!!

how can it be a hard sell with NO MAAC $$$

I was at the 2005 NATS and it was a week long event..(not all one SIG) but we are not the same size as the US.

That would be like thinking you could run a FULL NATS.... BUT then you would have to do something and just not criticize others.

_____________________________

Jabba

(in reply to kenair)
       Post #: 3

RE: 2006 MAAC NATS - 11/28/2005 12:39:50 PM   
j79


 

Posts: 37
Joined: 10/29/2005
From: To, ON, CANADA
Status: offline
quote:

NO Kenair it's just the BOARD being A$$es!!


Perhaps the board are seeing the Nats as they are, things are different now.

(in reply to Jabba)
       Post #: 4

RE: 2006 MAAC NATS - 11/28/2005 1:37:24 PM   
Jim_McIntyre



Posts: 2078
Joined: 4/5/2002
From: Claremont, ON, CANADA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: kenair
Yes, there is a lot of moaning and groaning over there,
the Nats must be hard sell for the obivious reasons............


What a piece of work .... 'obvious reasons'? Lame spin, if you can't substatiate, state as fact.

quote:

ORIGINAL: kenair
now a week long camp at the field fly-in simliar to ...


Yeah ... a bunch of ARFs pretending to be helicopters ... *yawn* ... sounds real interesting. I can hear the campfire conversations now;
Jim: "Hey Kenny buddy, I hear XYZ is coming out with another Yak ...
Ken: "Yeah .. sure hope they make this one available with that kewl yellow scheme RMV has."
Jim: "Yup, I saw that one .... mighty purty, I bet I could wedge a DA 150 in there..."
SNORE!

I'm sure they're well attended, as are stamp collector conventions ... just not my 'cup of tea' perhaps.
Maybe if I couldn't build, or had some compensatory need to brag about my credit limit, or was scared of a little competition.....

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(in reply to kenair)
       Post #: 5

RE: 2006 MAAC NATS - 11/28/2005 2:37:54 PM   
britbrat


 

Posts: 3299
Joined: 6/15/2004
From: Deep River, ON, CANADA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Jim_McIntyre

Yeah ... a bunch of ARFs pretending to be helicopters ... *yawn* ...
I'm sure they're well attended, as are stamp collector conventions ... just not my 'cup of tea' perhaps.
Maybe if I couldn't build, or had some compensatory need to brag about my credit limit, or was scared of a little competition.....





Jim, you're as predictable as Ken

(in reply to Jim_McIntyre)
       Post #: 6

RE: 2006 MAAC NATS - 11/28/2005 5:30:49 PM   
Sharpy01



Posts: 600
Joined: 9/9/2003
From: Kenora, ON, CANADA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Jabba


NO Kenair it's just the BOARD being A$$es!!

how can it be a hard sell with NO MAAC $$$

I was at the 2005 NATS and it was a week long event..(not all one SIG) but we are not the same size as the US.

That would be like thinking you could run a FULL NATS.... BUT then you would have to do something and just not criticize others.




......this is the junk that get's my back up. Again, according to Jabba, it's the Board fault that things are not going smoothly. Well, Jabbayadayada, your mentor is now on the board so why not let him do his job.

There is a definate projection of "entitlement" to this group's initiatives and it's way past old. If the board doesn't jump on que, they're being A$$es and the smearing begins. You know what, despite the fact that the 05 event appears to have been successful, doesn't guarantee 06 will go as well. Maybe volunteers are an issue, maybe venues are an issue, maybe weather is an issue, maybe participants are an issue, maybe a flying event it not at the top of the to-do list, maybe, maybe, maybe.

The board's job is not to commit to the past, it's obligated to assess each proposal individually and I'll bet the "bulletproof" proposal is the usual email or a couple of pages that essentially says............"trust us"............it worked before, it should work again and cut us a check for a few thousand to get things started......... no budget, no real business case. That's what it was last year. It apparently worked, but it's not the way to properly run anything of that magnitude. Murphy is always lurking.

As far as I am concerned, if there isn't a full AND COMPLETE business case in place at this point, they should be told to look at 07 or it will be just another regional event.

(in reply to Jabba)
       Post #: 7

RE: 2006 MAAC NATS - 11/28/2005 6:16:03 PM   
Sharpy01



Posts: 600
Joined: 9/9/2003
From: Kenora, ON, CANADA
Status: offline 		.......Is this why You think the board are bad people Palmer? Somebody exposing the facts instead of bending to the bashing?

quote:

On another topic, Keith and and Mike are right on regarding the larger picture of the Nats. My initial submission hit at the right spot and information is beginning to filter out. $7,800.00 of participation revenues plus $2,500.00 advanced by MAAC TOTALS well over $10,000.00 in gross revenues; thus, this is an amount that is closer to the $12,000.00 advanced by rumors. Add to this amount other revenues generated by various other sales, this could well surpass the posted amounts.

No one was suspecting misuse of misappropriation of funds. But persistant attempts to receive the final reports have not been heeded to.
What are we to think about this situation? What is a good business ethic to do in this situation?

It is well possible that the left over funds could have been considered dedicated funds reserved for future Nats. But I ca assure you that it was never intended to be held under the control of adhoc committees without MAAC knowledge. This would never have been authorized by the Board.

Mr. Palmer, it appears that you are close to those who are sitting on the final reports. Since you are speaking out on their behalf and, I would like to believe that you are interested at getting to the truth, could you find out for all of us the real reasons why the report is tarding and when we (the whole MAAC membership) can expect to receive it. Transparency would certainly dispell many thoughts about wild rumors.

Jean


I applaud the board for standing up for a standard of accountability and nobody should expect anything less.

....I posted this on RCCan and I'll do it again here:
-------
EVERY major controversy within this association since I began flying a dozen or so years back has circled around a few stupid flying events and a core group determined to get their way at all costs.

Maybe it's time for MAAC board to remove itself completely, both financially and organizationally from individual events. Provide the insurance and do the minimun to allow members to fly internationally and let the various diciplines look after themselves. I doubt there are very many out there who have, or intend, to fly in an event that needs MAAC board babysitting.

Marc Sharpe

< Message edited by Sharpy01 -- 11/28/2005 6:18:33 PM >

(in reply to Sharpy01)
       Post #: 8

RE: 2006 MAAC NATS - 11/28/2005 7:15:39 PM   
Jim_McIntyre



Posts: 2078
Joined: 4/5/2002
From: Claremont, ON, CANADA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Sharpy01
Maybe it's time for MAAC board to remove itself completely....


IOW "cut off your nose to spite your face"?

... and britbrat ; dem's fighting words meester.

Let's be serious here (if that's possible). Other than one incident in Shary01's home zone, the Nats have not been a financial burden to MAAC (in fact, some profit has occasionally been seen).
Further, despite the fact that there are some 'personalities' involved in the organization (more visible with the advent of the Internet and a few who look to stir the pot), the Nats have been, and could once again be, a major public relations coup, as well as being a staple MAAC service to the various disciplines who aim a little higher than simply 'boring holes in the sky'.


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(in reply to Sharpy01)
       Post #: 9

RE: 2006 MAAC NATS - 11/28/2005 7:32:21 PM   
Sharpy01



Posts: 600
Joined: 9/9/2003
From: Kenora, ON, CANADA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Jim_McIntyre

Let's be serious here (if that's possible). Other than one incident in Shary01's home zone, the Nats have not been a financial burden to MAAC (in fact, some profit has occasionally been seen).



....or apparently not seen?

Besides, it's to a point where it's now ALL about the personalities and is generating bad feelings more than PR. PR is a pie in the sky wish. Nothing earth shattering in the PR department has ever come to the hobby as a result of an event. Locally, it helps if done right, but you'll never see a big national PR splash unless something dreadful happens......and obviously, in that case, it's not the PR we'd be looking for.

As widely reported, the US does a big NATS every year and living on the US/Canadian border for many years with universal access to media...........I've never seen any large PR bonanza down there either. I'm only reporting what I know from experience.

(in reply to Jim_McIntyre)
       Post #: 10

RE: 2006 MAAC NATS - 11/28/2005 9:32:54 PM   
j79


 

Posts: 37
Joined: 10/29/2005
From: To, ON, CANADA
Status: offline 		Doesn't Chuck Smith have experience in running of very large events and he is on the board so I expect the Nats to be a go and will plan my vacation accordingly.

Marc is correct too, accountability is needed. What a bunch of wild ones on that other site.

Could this idea work?

MAAC could sell the Nats franchise - like other groups could bid to host the Junos' etc, there could be the potential for a club to make a lot of money at this event as a lot of pilots attend and pay entrance fees, the hosting club could enter into a revenue sharing aggreement with maac.

(in reply to extra300xs)
       Post #: 11

RE: 2006 MAAC NATS - 11/28/2005 9:42:15 PM   
Jim_McIntyre



Posts: 2078
Joined: 4/5/2002
From: Claremont, ON, CANADA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Jim_McIntyre
Let's be serious here (if that's possible).


Sigh....


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       Post #: 12

RE: 2006 MAAC NATS - 11/28/2005 11:42:21 PM   
j79


 

Posts: 37
Joined: 10/29/2005
From: To, ON, CANADA
Status: offline 		http://www.rccanada.ca/bb/viewtopic.php?t=18603&start=60&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=
quote:

wow... you must have a crystal ball....

HOW do you know the chairman has not yet responded...
MAAC put out startup money which was paid back BEFORE the event even took place.

NOW your calling people thieves... you're about to get sued next.
WHAT males YOU think there was or is a mis use of funds.... time to get your crystal ball cleaned.

IF I was Gerry Shaw I would tell MAAC to KISS MY A$$.



MAAC was TOLD in the 2005 preposal what would happen with the left over $$$ and that will take place.


These are fun guys!

(in reply to Jim_McIntyre)
       Post #: 13

RE: 2006 MAAC NATS - 11/29/2005 12:14:31 AM