RE: Glow-Plugs Recommended By OS Engines  
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RE: Glow-Plugs Recommended By OS Engines - 2/5/2006 2:16:08 PM   
Cyclic Hardover



Posts: 7221
Joined: 5/7/2002
From: New Mexico, USA
Status: offline 		I am curious as to why "Dar" is promoting OS plugs?

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       Post #: 26

RE: Glow-Plugs Recommended By OS Engines - 2/5/2006 3:22:14 PM   
DarZeelon



Posts: 7108
Joined: 4/9/2003
From: Rosh-Ha'Ayin, ISRAEL
Status: online
quote:

ORIGINAL: Cyclic Hardover

I am curious as to why Dar is promoting OS plugs?


Cyclic,


I am not! MVVS glow plugs are much better; cheaper too...

What I am saying is that many hobby shops, including Tower/Hobby Services, the OS dealer for the US, are doing us wrong by 'pushing' that cheap OS A3 plug, into any engine that would accept it, forcing it to use fuel excessively and causing it to misbehave in the mid-range.

...This, instead of just supplying the right glow-plug for the application in the first place.


...The right fuel too. The .91FX and all STs becomes better engines, when you run them on 5% nitro, but most Americans, for some reason, can see nothing but 15% nitro theses days...


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MVVS - Jett - Nelson - Bolly - Mejzlik

(in reply to Cyclic Hardover)
       Post #: 27

RE: Glow-Plugs Recommended By OS Engines - 2/5/2006 3:37:49 PM   
piper_chuck



Posts: 7896
Joined: 6/13/2004
From: Pittsboro, NC, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DarZeelon
...This, instead of just supplying the right glow-plug for the application in the first place.

Is it possible for OS to provide a plug that will work right for every end user?
quote:


...The right fuel too. The .91FX and all STs becomes better engines, when you run them on 5% nitro, but most Americans, for some reason, can see nothing but 15% nitro theses days...

Not THAT discussion again! Seems like it's time for Jan to add his commentary on castor versus synthetic and 18% oil versus the 10% that he asserts is so widely used in Europe!

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(in reply to DarZeelon)
       Post #: 28

RE: Glow-Plugs Recommended By OS Engines - 2/5/2006 3:47:20 PM   
DarZeelon



Posts: 7108
Joined: 4/9/2003
From: Rosh-Ha'Ayin, ISRAEL
Status: online 		Don't worry, Chuck....

We'll get to that too .

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       Post #: 29

RE: Glow-Plugs Recommended By OS Engines - 2/5/2006 4:11:23 PM   
DarZeelon



Posts: 7108
Joined: 4/9/2003
From: Rosh-Ha'Ayin, ISRAEL
Status: online
quote:

ORIGINAL: piper_chuck

quote:

ORIGINAL: DarZeelon
...This, instead of just supplying the right glow-plug for the application in the first place.

Is it possible for OS to provide a plug that will work right for every end user?


Yes!

If OS engineers decided that the A5 is the right glow-plug for the .61-.91FX, they must supply these engines with this plug; not with the A3, which is clearly the wrong glow-plug.

Please go back to the first post, for the link to OS' glow-plug page.

...Or, at least, they must sell (and have any and all their dealers do the same) you the A5 plug, when you buy a glow-plug for these engines. It is clear that using a hotter glow-plug will only make the engine run worse.


Even the so-called 'universal' #8 is a bit too hot for larger engines and a bit too cold for smaller ones.

You wouldn't just use a 'universal' spark-plug in your motor-car, would you?


If OS makes a range of glow-plugs, they should also make sure you use the right one for each engine.


< Message edited by DarZeelon -- 2/5/2006 4:12:52 PM >

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(in reply to piper_chuck)
       Post #: 30

RE: Glow-Plugs Recommended By OS Engines - 2/5/2006 4:47:27 PM   
Kostas1



Posts: 1230
Joined: 12/19/2005
From: AthensAthens, GREECE
Status: offline 		Dar i have to say that the OS 61 FX & OS 91 FX are supplied with OS #8 glowplug,NOT with the A3 that is supplied with OS 46 AX,50 SX, and LA series.

(in reply to DarZeelon)
       Post #: 31

RE: Glow-Plugs Recommended By OS Engines - 2/5/2006 4:50:21 PM   
piper_chuck



Posts: 7896
Joined: 6/13/2004
From: Pittsboro, NC, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DarZeelon

quote:

ORIGINAL: piper_chuck

quote:

ORIGINAL: DarZeelon
...This, instead of just supplying the right glow-plug for the application in the first place.

Is it possible for OS to provide a plug that will work right for every end user?


Yes!

If OS engineers decided that the A5 is the right glow-plug for the .61-.91FX, they must supply these engines with this plug; not with the A3, which is clearly the wrong glow-plug.

Please go back to the first post, for the link to OS' glow-plug page.

...Or, at least, they must sell (and have any and all their dealers do the same) you the A5 plug, when you buy a glow-plug for these engines. It is clear that using a hotter glow-plug will only make the engine run worse.


Even the so-called 'universal' #8 is a bit too hot for larger engines and a bit too cold for smaller ones.

You wouldn't just use a 'universal' spark-plug in your motor-car, would you?


If OS makes a range of glow-plugs, they should also make sure you use the right one for each engine.


Dar, you missed my point. If everyone used the same fuel and prop size and ran at the same altitude, temp, and humidity, it might be possible for the manufacturer an engineer to recommend a single glow plug. However, as you're well aware of, we don't all use the same fuel, or fly in the same conditions. This is why there is a range, and why no one plug will work for everyone.


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(in reply to DarZeelon)
       Post #: 32

RE: Glow-Plugs Recommended By OS Engines - 2/5/2006 5:41:54 PM   
DarZeelon



Posts: 7108
Joined: 4/9/2003
From: Rosh-Ha'Ayin, ISRAEL
Status: online 		I do get your point, Chuck.

However, about 97% of the world's population live below 2,000 ft. So S/L conditions are in effect.


This is why OS should supply the .61-.91FX with the A5; not with the #8 (Kostas...) and for sure, not with the A3.

It may be possible to use even the hottest A3 plug, at a rich mixture setting, but even the medium #8 will require a richer mixture setting than the correct A5.

With the cold plug and 5% nitro, a 10-12 ounce fuel tank should be enough for a 10 minute flight, even with the .91FX, yet with the hot plug and 15% nitro, even 16 ounces are often consumed before 10 minutes are up.

If you do live at a higher altitude, like Cyclic, or run very high RPM and 11" props on your .91FX, you can always opt for a hotter glow-plug, but then you are about as rare as a one-eyed owl... Definitely not the 'general population' material, who will do 'very well, thank-you' with the A5.

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(in reply to piper_chuck)
       Post #: 33

RE: Glow-Plugs Recommended By OS Engines - 2/5/2006 6:00:30 PM   
Hobbsy



Posts: 10688
Joined: 12/2/2001
From: Colonial Beach, VA, USA
Status: online 		I bought an OS LA .46 and a .65 about a year ago and neither came with a plug which is the way I prefer it.

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(in reply to DarZeelon)
       Post #: 34

RE: Glow-Plugs Recommended By OS Engines - 2/6/2006 2:19:12 AM   
TimC



Posts: 2257
Joined: 1/7/2003
From: Lone Pine, CA, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DarZeelon

For the .61-.91FX, .65LA, 1.40, 1.60, BGX, Etc., the right glow-plug is the cold A5; not the hot A3.



This could explain some of the problems experienced by .91FX users.

(in reply to DarZeelon)
       Post #: 35

RE: Glow-Plugs Recommended By OS Engines - 2/6/2006 3:01:04 AM   
downunder



Posts: 3198
Joined: 10/10/2002
From: Adelaide, AUSTRALIA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DarZeelon
With the cold plug and 5% nitro, a 10-12 ounce fuel tank should be enough for a 10 minute flight, even with the .91FX, yet with the hot plug and 15% nitro, even 16 ounces are often consumed before 10 minutes are up.

That's a ridiculous argument. With 20% oil (to keep things simple) the ratio of 5% nitro to the remaining 75% methanol is .0666, in other words the nitro content is 6.67% of the actual fuel. Go to 15% nitro and methanol content drops to 65% so now the ratio of nitro to methanol is 23% or about 3.5 times more of a fuel that an engine drinks like it's going out of style! The huge increase in consumption will far outweigh any small difference a change in plug might make.

(in reply to DarZeelon)
       Post #: 36

RE: Glow-Plugs Recommended By OS Engines - 2/6/2006 3:13:35 AM   
TimC



Posts: 2257
Joined: 1/7/2003
From: Lone Pine, CA, USA
Status: offline 		What Dar said made sense to me. With a glowplug of the right heat and less nitro, a longer flight would be possible. I can't argue with that.

(in reply to downunder)
       Post #: 37

RE: Glow-Plugs Recommended By OS Engines - 2/26/2006 2:31:53 AM   
Kostas1



Posts: 1230
Joined: 12/19/2005
From: AthensAthens, GREECE
Status: offline 		OK DAR here it is.
After a few e-mails into OS engine support mail,
Nick A.
Product Support,
wrote to me these.

quote:

Hello,

Thanks for your email!

You can use an OS #8, #A3, or the #A5 glow plugs. All mentioned will
fit your engine.

Which one you pick will depend in the nitro percentage of the fuel
you're using.

Here are the recommended uses . . .

#8 plug - for use 10-15% fuels
#A3 plug - econo-type plug, 10-15% fuels
#A5 plug - for use with 20% and up fuels

. . . Thanks Again,

Nick A.
Product Support


So,it hasn't anything to do with the engine(so the manual is correct),but with the percentage of fuel.
Enjoy.
Kostas

(in reply to DarZeelon)
       Post #: 38

RE: Glow-Plugs Recommended By OS Engines - 2/26/2006 6:29:50 AM   
DarZeelon



Posts: 7108
Joined: 4/9/2003
From: Rosh-Ha'Ayin, ISRAEL
Status: online 		Kostas,


I am not saying it cannot be done; just that using a plug which is hotter than OS recommend in their own Japan web site (A5), would force you to richen the mixture setting beyond what is optimal, for best performance and economy.

The page at the OS web site does not tell you the nitro percentages you should use with each glow-plug; just what glow-plug to use in each engine.

With an A3, your engine would empty the fuel tank within about 2/3 of the time, compared to the A5... If you want this, just go ahead...

I stand by my primary claim; the