RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco

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RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco - 12/1/2008 4:24 AM

hopkimf

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WacoNut,

I'll try to find the wife's digital and take a few shots. After soldering up all those little pieces and grinding in radii to match fuse curve, I think it might have been easier to lay the fiberglass over the windshield and cut it out. Or just paint several layers on the windshield material.

I have two cloth planes. Solartex is on the Monocoupe. Sig fabric sprayed with house paint (using an airbrush) is on the Stinson Reliant. I liked the way both coverings went on, but the house paint with the airbrush was a real pain. I never put a seal coat over the Solartex on the Monocoupe to fill the weave. It really needs it. Is it possible to brush on a coat or two of the water base poly and have it look good? If so, I'll clean it up and do it.

So now I'm faced with the fabric choice again on the Waco. It was going to be Sig fabric (or equal), but I don't have any convenient way to paint other than spray cans. My results with spray cans have been not so great. Is it possible to brush it and get a very good finish? I never have had too much success with the brush. I'm wondering how much it would detract from the effect if I cheated and just covered with Ultracote. I know the purists would say bad idea. I'm not looking to compete. Just want it to look decent.

Thanks,
Mike H

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RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco - 12/3/2008 12:47 AM

Ekim

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Just passing along some information which maybe some of you are already aware of. I've been following this thread for a while and finally decided to order the Pepino plans. I called "Scale Plans and Photo Service" (Ann Pepino) and she informed me she had just recently sold the business. Said the new owner is a guy in WV by the name of Henry Budzinski (sp?), phone number 804-769-3981. Advised me to wait a couple of weeks to let him get organized. In the meantime I'll keep following the thread. Great source of information & building tips!

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RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco - 12/3/2008 1:18 AM

Big_Bird

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Mike, welcome to the thread. Since you have read about the warts associated with these plans you should be able to use this information and build a good flying plane. I love mine and the way it flies. It does the best inverted flat spin of all the planes that I've flown.

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RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco - 12/3/2008 3:49 AM

Ekim

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Thanks Ken.

Random thoughts.......... Yes, it sounds like the errors in the Pepino plans will surely add to the building challenge, but to tell you the truth they won't be the first set of plans I've worked with that weren't skewed in one way or another. For example I recently completed a Balsa USA 1/4 scale Nieuport 28, and those plans could certainly use some re-drawing. One wing half a bit longer than its mate, stab halves not symetrical, fuse stringer notches in formers were off. However to give Balsa USA credit they do tell you up-front to build to the parts and not necessarily to the plans and that the stringer notches may need shimming or re-cutting, etc. The parts & wood, by the way, were excellent, which brings up this question about the Pepino plans. If you had a kit-cutter cut these parts from the Pepino plans then it sounds logical to me you may get some poorly fitting parts, correct? Like the fuse formers? I think I read where someone said the formers on the plans are not symetrical. I'll probably cut my own parts, but I was just curious about problems that might occur by using a kit cutter service. For instance, I liked the idea of initially making the formers without the stringer notches and cutting them on a proper line after installation.

At least I know that once I do get started there is a wealth of information, building tips, and problem solving within this thread that I can refer to. Also it is amazing to me how much information is interchangeable between this thread, the Pica thread, and the Barth thread, thanks to all the contributers.

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RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco - 12/3/2008 5:17 PM

hopkimf

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I bought the plans, kit cutter parts, cowl, etc. from one person. Before I started, I thought the cutter would have corrected known errors. WacoNut and Big-Bird cautioned me that the parts would probably be cut to the plans. They were right. I ended up keeping the front and rear formers and making all in between, notching as I installed stringers. This has been my most difficult build, but I am not an expert craftsman. It isn't done yet, but I think I will be happy with the finished product. This thread has been valuable and I really appreciate all the comments and information.

Mike H

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RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco - 12/3/2008 8:15 PM

Big_Bird

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Mike H, looks like you are making very good progress.

Mike 121, if you buy from a kit cutter, it is not difficult to cut a lot of little pieces from a strip of 1/8" balsa and glue them in the slots in the formers with thin CA. Probably take you 30 minutes. After the formers are in place use a tight string to mark the places for the new slots.

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RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco - 12/4/2008 6:08 PM

Ekim

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Yes Ken, if that's the only problem incurred with going the kit-cutter route then that's pretty easy to deal with. Right now I'm just trying to order a set of plans. I'm sure once I get a set of plans to check over I'll get a better feel of things. I'm having a bit of a problem in getting in touch with the new plans service owner, but I'm working on it.

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RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco - 12/4/2008 8:59 PM

WacoNut

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Ekim

Yes Ken, if that's the only problem incurred with going the kit-cutter route then that's pretty easy to deal with. Right now I'm just trying to order a set of plans. I'm sure once I get a set of plans to check over I'll get a better feel of things. I'm having a bit of a problem in getting in touch with the new plans service owner, but I'm working on it.

Mike,
I also changed the wing ribs on my Waco and I scanned them so I can supply you with a copy of the ribs if you wish. If you can't get ahold of the new owner and get you a set of plans I may be able to help you with that as well, I don't intend to ever build this beast again

. If you really want to build this plane and are willing to put up with all the headaches my hats off to you (you will understand what I mean about 4 months in)

Not trying to scare you off I just want you to know you are in for a long tough build. I have yet to fly mine, I just admire it sitting in my home theatre until spring. After 900 hours give or take I want to make sure I get to enjoy it for a little while anyways.
A few items to note,
Top view on the plans is not straight, do not build over it. Draw a center line and use that for reference.
Wing Panels are different length and chord from left to right, pick one side and cut your spars for both panels at the same time.
Stringer Notches(already mentioned)
Tail Surfaces are not even left to right, pick one side and make a template to cut your tail surfaces.
Jigging the top wing in place is a real pain, I spent a whole day just getting the wing in place. Patience is a must here.

These are just a few items that come to mind, I am sure Ken can give you some more input on what to look out for.
Later!!
Anthony

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RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco - 12/4/2008 11:27 PM

skylarkmk1

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Mike,

You might want to check out the Barth 1/4 and 1/3 scale YMFs from Proctor http://www.proctor-enterprises.com/products/barth/waco/waco.htm .
It will be more expensive than getting the Pepino Plans but will save you both time and frustration. Also check out the Barth threads here on RCU.

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RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco - 12/5/2008 12:24 AM

WacoNut

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To be honest if I were to build a 25% Waco again I would go with the Barth kit, you will not build the plane cheaper by going with the Pepino plans. Wood,hardware, fiberglass parts etc: really adds up $$$ quick. But it does take some of the fun and challenge away if that's what you are looking for. I wouldn't take $5k for my Waco, just don't offer me $5,001

Anthony

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RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco - 12/5/2008 12:57 AM

skylarkmk1

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Mike,

A couple of other points to consider;

1. The Barth kit has the wings in four removable panels for transportation, the Pepino does not and Anthony had to design his own method.

2. Barth has the scale tail wheel, rigging, Cowl, head rest, wheel pants, landing gear fairing, pre-bent wire parts and more included; The same parts for the Pepino need to be purchased or fabricated. I believe Anthony used the Barth Cowl on his YMF.

The English Version of the Barth website is http://www.fmbb.de/Englischhome/Scale.htm Most of the description is in the 1/3 scale YMF part of the site.

< Message edited by skylarkmk1 -- 12/5/2008 12:58 AM >

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RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco - 12/5/2008 1:18 AM

Ekim

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There's a certain amount of humor here

. You see, after spending quite a bit of time studying the three main Waco threads, what I call the Pica, Barth & Pepino threads, I made up my mind I was going to get the Barth Waco. This was a couple of weeks ago. I called Proctor and spoke with a guy named Joe who said he was the owner. I expressed my interest in a Barth Waco and he was anything but encouraging. He explained that it was very unlikely there would be a kit readily available from Peter Barth in Germany. He added that there have been times he has waited almost a year to have a kit shipped to him. I asked him if he would please check with Barth as to when he could send a kit and he said he would and that he would get back with me. Well, I've not heard anyything yet. One of the guys on the Barth thread gave me Peter Barth's email address abd suggested I email him direct as to when he might ship a kit to Proctor. I've emailed him twice and no answer from him yet either. That's when I decided that what the heck, if nobody wants to sell me a Barth kit then maybe I'll build the Pepino kit. I figured at least I could invest in a set of Pepino plans, look them over carefully, and go from there. So I called Scale Plan and Photo Service (Ann Pepino) to order the plans. She told me she had just sold the business to another person, gave me his name and phone number, and said it might be a while before he's organized enough to do any business. Well, I tried calling anyway and there's never an answer and his answering machine is all messed up so you can't leave a message. I did some searching on the Internet and did find his address so I mailed him a letter requesting the plans. We'll see what happens. If all else fails I figure I can try getting the 1/5 Pica plans from AMA and scale them up. I've done that before. It's a little work but I'm in no hurry. Besides I'm an old retired draftsman anyway. And who knows, maybe one of these days I'll hear from the Pepino plans guy, or Joe from Proctor, or even Peter Barth himself. I do know one thing, if I knew of any place I could buy a Barth kit I would jump at it. I know the price makes my wallett ache with pain, but it certainly is a beautiful kit.

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RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco - 12/5/2008 1:39 AM

Big_Bird

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Mike that sounds like a great idea. Get the plans from AMA and scale them up to 1/4 scale. You can get a 1/4 scale cowl from the guy in Garfield Arkansas. If interested I'll look up the name of the company. If you really want to get a nice kit buy a 1/3 scale from www.amr-rc.com This is one like Anthony is building.

You certainly won't go wrong with a scaled up Pica. I built 3 of the Pica 1/5 scale Wacos. I really hate to see you start the Pepino unless you really enjoy pain and suffering.

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RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco - 12/5/2008 5:24 AM

hopkimf

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Scaling up the Pica could be good. I had the kit but never built it. The Pepino came along about then, and I sold the Pica kit. But I did study the Pica plans. Much better. If the wings on the scaled up plane come apart, I like tubes better than the Sig wing joiners (just a personal preference). If you can find the Barth, it would be probably less expensive and a lot easier. But then there is the satisfaction of doing the whole thing. I've built two Wacos; this one and an Icon UPF-7. I don't think I would do either again.

Mike H

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RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco - 12/5/2008 3:18 PM

Ekim

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Wow! I checked out that AMR 33% kit. That would surely be the largest, and most expensive plane in my stable. I have a few 1/4 scale models but no 1/3 scale. I do like how all four wing panels can be removed, as well as the stab, for transport. It even got my wife's blessing. However, I think for the time being I'll try and focus on a 1/4 scale version. I invested the $50 and orderd the Pica plans. That'll give me something to look over and ponder the scale-up idea. In a couple of weeks we'll head to Florida for the holidays. After my return maybe I'll have heard from Proctor or Barth. I did hear from a couple other guys who built the Pepino version. They said the plans weren't all that bad, BUT..........like Mike H. said, they'd never do it again.

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RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco - 12/5/2008 3:41 PM

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Mike,
The 33% is a very impressive kit, the laser cutting and the parts fit is excellent. I have been working on mine for about a month and have the wings framed up and the fuse box structure assembled as well as the cabane wires installed for mounting the top wing. It has been a pleasure to build so far. The size of the kit is a bit intimidating when it shows up, there are 2 very large boxes containing the kit and when you pull the contents out you will literally fill a room. I spent one day just removing all the parts from their sheets and sorting the parts into sub kits.
Here is a link to my build thread. AMR 33% Build If you have your wifes blessing go for it

Later!!
Anthony

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RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco - 12/5/2008 8:25 PM

Big_Bird

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Mike, I think Michel is giving a $200 discount on the 33% Waco until the end of the year. I think it is a good buy.

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RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco - 12/6/2008 2:00 AM

hopkimf

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A couple pix. Windshield from brass strips. Aileron covered with a scrap of Ultracote to see how it felt. That's when I found I put a radius on TE and need to rework it make it straight to get ribbed sheet to lay down. I'm leaning towards easy way out of covering with plastic instead of cloth. A few other shots Plus a G26 BUSA CUB and a G38 ICON Stinson just for grins. One Ultracote. The other cloth.

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RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco - 12/6/2008 2:13 AM

WacoNut

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Your getting there,
I really like your Stinson

Anthony

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RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco - 12/9/2008 6:57 AM

mango12

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Nice windshield.

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RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco - 12/10/2008 3:12 AM

hopkimf

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The windshield still needs a little trimming where it contacts the fuse. In the picture it's sitting on my homemade drill guide for Robart hinges. Small hole for bit and large to sight scribed line. Probably obvious to world, but I used to use the Robart guide and always misses a little up and down or side to side.

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RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco - 12/12/2008 3:17 PM

RICKSTUBBZ

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Anthony,

I recieved my first RC Report magazine yesterday. Low and behold Bill got the pictures of you and your WACO in there. Of coarse, as magazines are good for, the captions are all screwed up. Anyway, congratulations on having some pictures in a magazine.

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RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco - 12/13/2008 2:02 AM

WacoNut

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Cool,
I will have to search out a copy

Anthony

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RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco - 12/13/2008 2:47 AM

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Anthony,

Get a subscription, it is one of the best bargins out there and cheaper than the others (that are mostly advertisements).

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RE: Jim Pepino's YMF-5 Waco - 12/13/2008 12:44 PM

WacoNut

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John,
I have been meaning to subscribe but never remember too, I checked their web page and I will not get this issue when I subscribe but I can order it for $3.
Anthony

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