RE: BRIO Electric 10-size  
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RE: BRIO Electric 10-size - 6/1/2006 4:55:28 PM   
handglider



Posts: 694
Joined: 3/14/2005
From: Hotlanta, GA, USA
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Hi DS,

return it and buy the Quite Storm, it's a much better "pattern look" little plane....

there is nothing you can do to improve the plane, it flys like it's about 8 oz overwight even at 32 oz....

plus it dosen't hover and the build quality is not as good.

4 guys had the same experience, this is not a good trend....

and remember that this is only a "look-a-like" pattern plane. There is no way that it would be competitive even in sportsmans, flying against 2m ships - no way...

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RE: BRIO Electric 10-size - 6/1/2006 5:34:50 PM   
swlarcham



Posts: 392
Joined: 4/9/2002
From: DeQuincy, LA, USA
Status: offline
Well I've read this thread with serious apprehension.
I picked up a Brio10 at my LHS.
All surfaces are straight, covering excellent(no wrinkles) and the build quality appears as good as any ARF I've seen.
I'm going with the power 10, TP 3s 2100and a CC45 ESC(elfite40's were out of stock),Jr241's & 610ul Rx. My initial weight without servo leads & prop is 29 ounces.I'll give a total AUW when I get it finished.
The only thing I didn't like was the elevator setup. I installed the carbon reinforcement and it's impresively stronger. I would like to do pull-pull all around -but I am too impatient, so I'm trying the stocl setup with both servos in the tail.
I'll report on initial flights when I get it finished, hopefully next week.
Eddie

(in reply to handglider)
       Post #: 102

RE: BRIO Electric 10-size - 6/1/2006 7:03:04 PM   
thedude0901


 

Posts: 37
Joined: 1/19/2006
From: London, KS, USA
Status: offline
Greetings,


RE: CGRetired

It comes with the necessary hardware for a rudder pull-pull setup which is how I'm running it now. My elevator horn is dead center of the elevator and it's inside the fuse. It has a carbon fiber pushrod going to a forward mounted servo. (That was a joy to install.) I did brace the tail with carbon fiber rods as shown earlier in this thread.

I feel this plane is fine for what it is - a sport pattern plane. If you want to fly 3D then go get a foamy. I do believe instructions have the CG to far back and lists WAY to much elevator throw which is a bad combination.

I can post pictures of my rudder and elevator setup if you like.

Best Regards,
The Dude

(in reply to CGRetired)
       Post #: 103

RE: BRIO Electric 10-size - 6/2/2006 1:56:53 PM   
CGRetired



Posts: 4224
Joined: 9/14/2004
From: Galloway, NJ, USA
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I certainly appreciate all the comments and recommendations.

Handglider, thanks for the suggestions. I am going to stick with the Brio, though and see if I can follow through with some (if not most) of the suggestions for improvements made by several people in this thread. I hope I don't have to give you cause to say "I told you so".. but I'm gonna go forward. You have helped me by some of the issues you have brought up and by some of the fixes you proposed.

The Dude: Yes, could you post pictures of what you did and how you did it? I am especially interested in the carbon rod improvements you made to the elevator. If you can, let me know what size carbon rod(s) you used for the 'fix'.

As for the elevator control rods, I have a supply of Sullivan Composite precision rods (carbon) and will probably go with those.

I fly an Excelleron 90 with an OS 1.20 AX aboard. Flys just great, however, I DID have to make some changes in the throws even those recommended by the manufacturer. They were to radical, in my opinion, so I changed them. The CG was right on with that engine and it flys exactly as I would expect it to for a 90 size pattern plane.

I am NOT into 3D so I won't be doing anything radical like that with the Brio and will definitely take heed regarding the rudder/elevator/aileron throws.

Background.. I have a Tiger 60. It was my second aircraft after I got rid of my training wheels, and my first ARF. The trainer was an RTF NexSTAR. Anyway, I asked my instructor to maiden the Tiger 60 for me. He noted that the elevator was quite 'squishy' and soft to the point where it was almost ineffective at higher speeds, such as coming out of a loop. In fact, it almost crashed because it would not recover from the loop very well. He managed to land it and we looked it over very carefully. Well, as it turned out, the elevator pushrod would flex with the guide tube within the fuselage because I did not have enough support points along the tube. I was using Sullivan Golden Rods. The Tiger 60 has a flat bottom so I removed the covering all along the bottom which gave me direct access to the guide tubes for both the rudder and elevator, and I epoxied them in place at each of the formers. I also added a length of 2-56 wire inside the last several inches of the Golden Rods to the point where the rods went inside the fuselage a couple inches. This fixed the problem AND taught me a valuable lesson with regard to handling and sloppy elevator control rod (or any control rod for that matter), so I will be very VERY cautious with the Brio rods to the rear of the aircraft. I will also look closely at the control rods on the ailerons.

Thanks again, guys. Hopefully I can make this thing fly like it is supposed to.

Oh, HandGlider, I may STILL buy a Quiet Storm, just in case..

DS.

_____________________________

Skylark 70 - OS 75 AX; Venus II - OS 1.20 AX; Tiger 120 - OS 1.20 AX; Protege - OS .75 AX. Airtronics - Spektrum. AMA 705964. Semper Paratus!

(in reply to thedude0901)
       Post #: 104

RE: BRIO Electric 10-size - 6/2/2006 6:50:56 PM   
handglider



Posts: 694
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From: Hotlanta, GA, USA
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Hi DS,

the elevator is not the problem, beef it up as you like but keep the weight down back there.

I would start by flying it at the forward CG position not the rear - like we all did.

Mine at 32 oz was somewhat overpowered with the big Tourqe motor I was using and still flew like a dog, brick or sack of sh*t....

just be carefull on downleg pulls or at the bottom of loops.... my situation was the I was pulling from a downleg into a downwind, I did a stall turn on the upwind side of the field. which I am sure added to the stall/snap....

just be prepared and give your self plenty of altitude.....





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RE: BRIO Electric 10-size - 6/3/2006 3:30:47 PM   
p0stal



Posts: 74
Joined: 11/16/2005
From: Orange Park, FL, USA
Status: offline
Not that happy with my Brio either. One slight bump on landing an the gear with crack the Fuse, I'm not talking slamming down here, just slight pop on ground. Balancing was a pain. I'm flyin a 480 with 2100 TP. flys nose heavy but not as bad as some are saying. Set up the first time with pull-pull but swapped it out for added rear weight of my servo on the tail. It help me with balance, also I'm sure everyone knows the e-flite servos wont fit 2 on the rear fuse with build out. I swapped out the e-flights on rear for futaba 3108 hi-torque. Tad slower than e-flites but have 22oz torque.

I'm no hotshot 3d guy, so my flight complaints are few. only other changes I made was 11x5.5 prop instead of 11x7, threw away that junk eflite 40amp ESC for Castle Creations 35amp.

With e-flite 40amp version 2 my peak watt power was just over 277 watts. With CC ESC I'm getting over 325 watts burst power with 11x5.5 prop. ( see pic for bench test results)

That pic is to small click here for better pic


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< Message edited by p0stal -- 6/3/2006 4:40:09 PM >


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RE: BRIO Electric 10-size - 6/6/2006 1:45:18 PM   
CGRetired



Posts: 4224
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From: Galloway, NJ, USA
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Hey guys. Just an update on my build progress with the Brio.

First of all, I definitely appreciate all the comments before I joined in on this particular thread. They have helped me in several ways. I realized that the Brio is a tad bit fragile, as most of the balsa electrics are. I took this as sort of warning to be extra careful in handling this plane. It is indeed fragile, but, from what I can see, pretty well built too. I say this because I have examined everything very closely before doing any of the build process. There were a couple of areas that I looked at that I think could use a bit more beefing up and have tried to do so without adding any appreciable weight.

I noted in at least one posting that the landing gear was a bit weak. I noticed, last night, that the ply that the blind nuts go into, could use some beefing up. I was thinking of adding some epoxy (a coating of 30 minute for strength) on and around the landing gear mounting pads. I don't think that will add much weight and could strengthen it a bit, especially if I laid down a thin coating of fiberglass. Any comments or suggestions with that? I know that I usually add two layers of fiberglass on the wing junction on my larger fuel planes that helps strengthen the center of the wing, perhaps a bit of that on the underside (actually the top) of that landing gear pad might help strengthen it??

Next was the elevator. I hinged it last night. The thing lookes and felt pretty strong. After hinging it, it seemed that it was pretty tough as it it. I don't (wouldn't) know where to reinforce it with carbon rod without some sort of drawing (never done that before). So, I proceeded with that part of the build. All seemed pretty strong.

I used 30 minute epoxy for the aileron horns rather than 3 minute. That added cure time can't do any harm, and it is straight and flush. Came out good.

I used some CA on the wood where the wing servo's went to strengthen that area and provide some 'meat' for the servo screws to hold on to.

I hope I'm doing everything right with this. I guess the truth will come when I fly it for the first time, hopefully this weekend.

Ok, thanks again for your imput, and, if you have more in the line of comments, please whip them on me!!!

DS.

_____________________________

Skylark 70 - OS 75 AX; Venus II - OS 1.20 AX; Tiger 120 - OS 1.20 AX; Protege - OS .75 AX. Airtronics - Spektrum. AMA 705964. Semper Paratus!

(in reply to p0stal)
       Post #: 107

RE: BRIO Electric 10-size - 6/6/2006 9:36:30 PM   
thedude0901


 

Posts: 37
Joined: 1/19/2006
From: London, KS, USA
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Greetings,

Well the crash damage has been repaired and now I'm in the process of getting the OS .25 mounted. (Yea, I know it's an electric forum. ) Anyway, here are the pictures I promised CGRetired

Best Regards,
The Dude



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RE: BRIO Electric 10-size - 6/7/2006 4:12:13 AM   
Heironymous


 

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From: , ON, CANADA
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I can't imagine why anyone would want to take the retrograde step of putting a noisy dirty glow engine in a nice electric model but if that's what turns you on then go for it!

One thing you should be aware of is that a reciprocating engine produces a lot more vibration than an electric motor. That is why for example you can get away with thinner and lighter propellors on electric motors. You do not need the heavy flywheel effect of a heavier propellor on an e-motor. It is also why they often include a lot of ply in a model designed for glow. I can well imagine a glow engine shaking the poor Brio to bits. Also you might find it quite difficult to fuel proof the framework at the nose unless you have made quite drastic modifications.

Do let us know how you get on though. Its the first time I have heard of anyone doing an electric to glow conversion.

Rod

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       Post #: 109

RE: BRIO Electric 10-size - 6/7/2006 4:44:03 AM   
hemituda


 

Posts: 36
Joined: 3/24/2006
From: TORRANCE, CA, USA
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Sounds like i'm not the only one that only one whos a little angry about how lousy this plane really is. I tell you what though, it sure looked and luckily still does as it didn't pile in that hard at all. just bent landing gear and cracked the cowl. Was looking at some other threads the other day and saw a foam profile pattern plane called the mobius and they actually have video so you can SEE IT FLY. NOT JUST PICTURES. Boy it flys a great bit like a pattern plane but still will do 3d. Isnt that what the brio is supposed to do. I dont specifically care for foamies so i'm in the process of making some plans for myself to take the wings from the brio and build my own profile fuse to achieve this same flight charicteristics. At least this way it'll be light and hopefully perform as good as it appears to in the video.

by the way i braced my stab one on the forward bottom and one on the rear top and the stab was so strong i coulndt flex it all. Good luck to all and i'll post some pics as they become available Keith

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RE: BRIO Electric 10-size - 6/7/2006 3:01:43 PM   
swlarcham



Posts: 392
Joined: 4/9/2002
From: DeQuincy, LA, USA
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My Brio 10 has flown.
I can't imagine what anyone can find wrong with this little flyer.
I went with the power 10 setup and it is fast with an 11x7. I hope to get some props and attempt to slow it down BUT the power is insane. The AUW is 32 ounces and it just flew great.
Eddie

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       Post #: 111

RE: BRIO Electric 10-size - 6/8/2006 1:40:32 PM   
CGRetired



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From: Galloway, NJ, USA
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Thanks for the pix. I see now how and what you did. Good stuff.

I finished my Brio last evening, just prior to our club meeting where I brought it in for a show-'n-tell. Went over well.

The thing has awsome power with the Power 10 outrunner I used, I can imagine it will have much more with that .25 you are using

DS.

_____________________________

Skylark 70 - OS 75 AX; Venus II - OS 1.20 AX; Tiger 120 - OS 1.20 AX; Protege - OS .75 AX. Airtronics - Spektrum. AMA 705964. Semper Paratus!

(in reply to thedude0901)
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