RE: WALKERA 60  
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All Forums >> RC Helicopters >> Electric RC Helis >> Walkera Helis - Dragonfly, etc.. >> RE: WALKERA 60
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RE: WALKERA 60 - 5/27/2008 5:46:19 AM   
P-Diddy


 

Posts: 676
Joined: 12/12/2005
From: Eugene, OR, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: vega2614

I don't know if you guys remember me from before the winter, but I also have a Walkera 60. I'm trying to fix a tail rotor authority problem that I just recently decided to take a look at again. Here is what describes the problem more thoroughly (with pics): http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_6544491/tm.htm

You guys aren't having any issues with quick yaw to the right? My slider hits the tail boom with barely any right stick, and there's plenty of slider room to the right on the shaft (which yields left yaw). Like I said in the other forum, I would think that the slider would be mid-tail rotor shaft to yield head hold (approximately, depending on main rotor blade pitch values), rather than being so close to the tail boom and leaving so much room at the end. At this midpoint position on the tail rotor shaft, the tail rotor blades are pitched to give left yaw, rather than the right yaw required to counteract main rotor leftwards torque.

Do you guys have pics of where your tail rotor shaft slider sits for heading hold? Also, do any of your have vids of your chopper making a quick right turn? Mine turns at a snails pace, simply because the slider hits that tail boom and the pitch doesn't get high enough for more tail rotor authority.

Thanks in advance for any help, and sorry if I'm being redundant.


I scratched my head about this problem with a .50 size glow heli when it occurred to me that I had installed the tail blades backwards and, in fact, when I turned them around, they were giving just a little bit of nose-right input with the slider centered. Make sure your tail rotor moves counter-clockwise and the main blades move clockwise when viewed from above. Then, make sure that all of the blades are pointed the right way. If there is still an issue, something has been installed incorrectly, since the tail assembly is designed to be as you thought it should be with a heading hold position for the slider being somewhere very near to the center of the tail shaft.

-Pat

_____________________________

Currently:Aviation/SD Yak 54 33%(3W70),UltraRC GilesG202(BCMA 40cc),T-Rex600N(O.S. 50 Hyper), MSH Protos 500

(in reply to vega2614)
       Post #: 7001

RE: WALKERA 60 - 5/27/2008 5:55:30 AM   
vega2614


 

Posts: 573
Joined: 7/23/2006
From: Morton Grove, IL, USA
Status: offline 		I read what was posted a while back a few minutes ago and the most feasible solution seemed to be to move the tail blade holder further out on the shaft. I tried again just now, and I can't get that single grub screw loosened (the one that holds the tail axis connector to the tail rotor shaft). I can't even get the two hex screws that are covered by the blades. I tried heating with a soldering iron and rinsing with a small amount of acetone. I've ruined a hex wrench trying to get that grub screw loose (the metal is stripped off of it).

Can you guys easily remove that grub screw?

(in reply to oilyamps)
       Post #: 7002

RE: WALKERA 60 - 5/27/2008 8:20:53 PM   
robtangie


 

Posts: 123
Joined: 1/17/2008
From: albia, IA, USA
Status: offline 		I too am convinced that the trouble is pitch as well as possibly throttle curve. You can rip those hex screws out if you want but the simple fact is that everyone elses 60s fly with them right where they are at.

(in reply to vega2614)
       Post #: 7003

RE: WALKERA 60 - 5/27/2008 8:49:09 PM   
consultjdm


 

Posts: 5572
Joined: 8/26/2005
From: Canyon Country, CA, USA
Status: offline 		most of my helicopters are set up so that they have no (real close to none) negative pitch to the tail blades. so all the pitch travel is to stop or fight the main blade torque. And yes when running at speeds just below lift off the slider is in about the middle of the travel on the tail rotor shaft.


I don't know if this is right but it works for me.

Jd

(in reply to robtangie)
       Post #: 7004

RE: WALKERA 60 - 5/27/2008 8:54:02 PM   
vega2614


 

Posts: 573
Joined: 7/23/2006
From: Morton Grove, IL, USA
Status: offline 		Yeah, that's why I'm confused as to why only I am having the problem. I just ordered the aluminum tail upgrade, which hopefully will permit me to give enough pitch. I was going to buy a new tail rotor that I could remove the hex screw, but I figured I might as well upgrade while I'm spending the money.

RobTangie,
Are you having any tail rotor authority issues?

Anyone have pitch values for their tail rotor blades at each extreme? If you position the midpoint of the slider in the midpoint of the tail rotor shaft (the exposed region between the blade holders and the actual tail boom), what pitch are you getting? Would the pitch produce right or left yaw, assuming rotation into the downwash of the main rotor?

(in reply to robtangie)
       Post #: 7005

RE: WALKERA 60 - 5/27/2008 9:22:21 PM   
robtangie


 

Posts: 123
Joined: 1/17/2008
From: albia, IA, USA
Status: offline 		Vega,
No I don't have any problem with my tail btu let's concentrate on yours. First, with AVCS off and revo mix off, is your tail slider in the center of travel? Next, let's worry about the pitch on the head, not the tail. What is your pitch set at? Throttle 0%, 50%, and 100%? Also, what motor and pinion are you useing?
Work with me here man, there's method to my madness.

(in reply to vega2614)
       Post #: 7006

RE: WALKERA 60 - 5/27/2008 9:26:15 PM   
robtangie


 

Posts: 123
Joined: 1/17/2008
From: albia, IA, USA
Status: offline 		Vega,
You can order a new tail but oyur going to find that it has the same amount of throw as the tail you have now. Also if you have a straight 60 your going to find that your boom is too short and you will need the 60B boom, there is a 12mm difference in length.

(in reply to robtangie)
       Post #: 7007

RE: WALKERA 60 - 5/27/2008 9:45:07 PM   
robtangie


 

Posts: 123
Joined: 1/17/2008
From: albia, IA, USA
Status: offline 		Vega,
I just looked at your other post and you said you have 8 deg at 50%, 14 at 100%. That's way too much. You should be off the ground and hovering at about 75% throttle.
You are running too much pitch, resulting in too low of head speed causing the tail to have to over compensate for the drag on the head.
This is why it's doing what you describe.

(in reply to robtangie)
       Post #: 7008

RE: WALKERA 60 - 5/28/2008 4:31:11 AM   
vega2614


 

Posts: 573
Joined: 7/23/2006
From: Morton Grove, IL, USA
Status: offline 		That sucks about the tail boom issue. I would think the tail steering set wouldn't require the longer boom though.

I've lowered my pitch since then, giving me slightly more tail authority. I thought my pitch values were -10 to 10 degrees now, but I'll double-check that. I was experimenting with a bunch of different values. I'm pretty sure I tried +10 at some point. I have a pretty high headspeed.

Based on what consult said, there's something weird about my slider's effects on the blade pitch. For a majority of the slider path on the tail rotor shaft, the pitch yields left yaw. I would think it should be the exact opposite. As consult said, the torque simply due to the spinning rotor head should allow left turns, so right yaw is primarily what's needed.

P-Diddy,
Sorry, I didn't see you had posted right after me. I'll check that out. When you say spinning clockwise from above, what does that mean for the tail rotor? From above, you can't really see spin direction for the tail rotor.

(in reply to robtangie)
       Post #: 7009

RE: WALKERA 60 - 5/28/2008 6:31:08 AM   
P-Diddy


 

Posts: 676
Joined: 12/12/2005
From: Eugene, OR, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: vega2614

P-Diddy,
Sorry, I didn't see you had posted right after me. I'll check that out. When you say spinning clockwise from above, what does that mean for the tail rotor? From above, you can't really see spin direction for the tail rotor.


Sorry, looking from above, the main rotor should move clockwise. Looking from the right side of the heli, the tail rotor should move counter-clockwise.

_____________________________

Currently:Aviation/SD Yak 54 33%(3W70),UltraRC GilesG202(BCMA 40cc),T-Rex600N(O.S. 50 Hyper), MSH Protos 500

(in reply to vega2614)
       Post #: 7010

RE: WALKERA 60 - 5/28/2008 6:35:57 AM   
vega2614


 

Posts: 573
Joined: 7/23/2006
From: Morton Grove, IL, USA
Status: offline 		So P-Diddy (and Orion1024 from another thread) was correct in this case, although all the other pointers definitely could be a cause of poor tail authority in other cases. In fact, when I got the chopper, the max pitch was 30-freakin