spektrum two servo aileron problem (Full Version)

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pkassoc -> spektrum two servo aileron problem (3/18/2006 4:49 AM)

I am using 2 servos for my aileron control set up in the ail and flap channels as instructed. works fine except.....One servo has about 85% of the travel of the other one end to end, even tho everything is set at 100% travel. I reset to factory settings and redid my setup and checked all of the settings for all of the available configurations. I feel that the travel should be the same for both servos. I interchanged the 2 servos and thereby isolated the problem to the signal (either transmitter error or receiver error (if that is possible)). Has anyone else had this problem and did you find a way to fix it? Or is this a hardware/sortware/calibration problem with the trans.



NVSFlyer -> RE: spektrum two servo aileron problem (3/19/2006 9:23 PM)

Under the D/R are the settings both for 0 and 1 at 100?



pkassoc -> RE: spektrum two servo aileron problem (3/19/2006 10:11 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: NVSFlyer

Under the D/R are the settings both for 0 and 1 at 100?


They were not...I changed them both to a 100% setting and..........

did not help. still has slave servo not traveling as far as master servo.... cant seem to get good slaves anymore...

thank you for the suggestion, however, and i sure am willing to try anything anybody comes up with!!!!



pkassoc -> RE: spektrum two servo aileron problem (3/20/2006 5:41 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: NVSFlyer

Under the D/R are the settings both for 0 and 1 at 100?


Thanks for the clues NVS flyer. I have found the reason for the aileron to slave mismatch of travel amd the secret and solution is as follows:


I had the travel adjust set for 125% for both directions of the aileron (you can go as high as 150%.) I like the 125% because it gives a better mech advantage when the ail is hard over when there is the highest load in 3D flying. (150% would be even better but i want to stay away from the servo stops).

As i said before, the master servo had greater end to end travel than the slave servo when using a 125% travel adjust setup. The master went 90 degrees and the slave about 75 degrees (eyeball estimate).

I reset the travel adjust for both directions of the ail servo to 100%.

Lo and behold, the master and slave both now travel the same angle.

I think this is a flaw in the programming of this system.

I bet futaba does not have this problem.

This should be fixed by Spektrum before it becomes common knowledge.

BUT, I SURE LIKE THIS TURN ON AND FLY SYSTEM, ANYWAY!!!!! Have had no other problems including range or glitches and NO SHOOTDOWNS from other flyers.



LenAlessi -> RE: spektrum two servo aileron problem (3/20/2006 12:42 PM)

Just Curious.....

Did you inhibit the Flap function by setting the throws of the flap channel to zero as it indicates on page 33 under Flaperon setup? If not, this may cause the condition that you describe.

Len Alessi
Team JR



pkassoc -> RE: spektrum two servo aileron problem (3/20/2006 3:15 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: LenAlessi

Just Curious.....

Did you inhibit the Flap function by setting the throws of the flap channel to zero as it indicates on page 33 under Flaperon setup? If not, this may cause the condition that you describe.

Len Alessi
Team JR


OH yes, that was one of the first things i did.

I did try, as an experiment, to put the flap function at +/- 125% thinking there might an error in the instructions. However, when i did this the servos took completely haywire positions so i eliminated that as a solution.

If you are using seperate aileron servos without a y harness you might try as a quick experiment putting the travel to +/- 125 or 150% and see if you get the different travel on each servo like i did. That would confirm if it is a design problem and not just a defect in my equipment.

I am going to try a smaller value like +/- 75% ,as a test, and see if i can go to the other side of the curve and still get the mismatch, but where the mismatch shows the slave servo traveling farther than the master. This would show that a linear offset exists thru a programmed null at 100%.



dsnyder -> RE: spektrum two servo aileron problem (3/20/2006 3:18 PM)

Instructions from the DX6:
Flaperon mixing is used with airplanes that have independent servos operating each of the two ailerons. When using flaperon mixing, two servos (one for each aileron) must be used. Once FPN is selected in wing type the following will help in setting up flaperons.
• Connect the left aileron servo to channel #6 (AUX) and the right aileron servo to channel #2 (AILE) in the receiver.
• In the travel adjust mode (see page 42) adjust the travel adjust values for flap to 0% in both directions. This will effectively turn off the flap switch for now, preventing the flaperons (both ailerons combined) from moving up or down when the flap switch is flipped. Latter by assigning a value in either direction the flap switch can be used to raise or lower the flaps.
Note: Individual functions (e.g., servo reversing, sub-trims, dual rates, etc.) are still available for each of the aileron and flap channels. Use sub-trims for individual neutral adjustment. Adjust the ailerons travel values by increasing or decreasing the aileron travel adjust. D/R and expo values, as well as differential, are also available in the appropriate screens.

My suggestion for setting up the flaperons is to set it up as described above. You can use sub trim on either the aileron or flap channel as needed for centering the servos. Set up the servo connected in to the flap channel (aux 1) mechanically first, setting it up to get the throw desired. Then set up the servo plugged into the aileron channel mechanically the same as the servo in the flap channel. Then use the travel adjust function on the aileron channel to make the movements match. You can use the dual rate function to increase or decrease the throw of both servos as needed as well. Key points, the flap channel travel adjust needs to be set to 0% in at least one switch position, the aileron travel adjust will only affect the aileron travel, and to increase or decrease the throw of both channels use the dual rate function.



pkassoc -> RE: spektrum two servo aileron problem (3/21/2006 12:06 AM)

From post 7 above re: servo travel differences at more that 100% travel adjust:

"Set up the servo connected in to the flap channel (aux 1) mechanically first, setting it up to get the throw desired. Then set up the servo plugged into the aileron channel mechanically the same as the servo in the flap channel. Then use the travel adjust function on the aileron channel to make the movements match."

If you read the second para carefully, you notice that the instructions are to set up the 2 servos MECHANICALLY to get the same travel . But this is exactly what i was trying to avoid--having the 2 servos with different moment arms with different loads. The next sentence says adjust the travel function on the ail channel to make the movements match..tried that, all that does for me is increase or decrease the travel of both servos the same amount. It doesnt change the fact that the servo arms are effectively already set up for different lengths. Anyway, it is a minor problem, i can live with the 100% travel.

BUT, I SURE LIKE THIS TURN ON AND FLY SYSTEM, ANYWAY!!!!! Have had no other problems including range or glitches and NO SHOOTDOWNS from other flyers. We have so many of them at our electric field that my buddy picked up somebody elses and tried to get ready to fly. I need to put a day glow orange tag on my trans!!!



dsnyder -> RE: spektrum two servo aileron problem (3/21/2006 2:54 PM)

The travel adjust on the aileron channel only affects the aileron channel. So you can use it to make the servo plugged into the aileron channel match the travel of the aileron in the aux 1 channel. If you follow the instructions I provided above, you'll be able to adjust the ailerons as you like.



pkassoc -> RE: spektrum two servo aileron problem (3/21/2006 6:42 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: dsnyder

The travel adjust on the aileron channel only affects the aileron channel. So you can use it to make the servo plugged into the aileron channel match the travel of the aileron in the aux 1 channel. If you follow the instructions I provided above, you'll be able to adjust the ailerons as you like.


Thanks for the clarification of both of our explanations.

If i adjust the ail channel to 150% travel, the slave channel will be at 100%. If I want to make the slave servo have the same LINEAR travel (linear displacement of the pushrod), i need to put the pushrod on the slave servo farther out on the pushrod so that the linear travel of both servos are the same.

This creates a mismatch between the servos with respect to servo load if the ailerons have the same deflection (and thereby air loads)

So i am better off just using 100% for the 2 ail application and just moving both the pushrods the same distance out on the servo arm to get more ail displacement.

I normally operate with max servo travel possible to maximize force at the aileron horn for max 3D rate. Then i mix in exponential to make the servos less sensitive near neutral. This way i get fine control near neutral and max force at extreme travel....best of both worlds.

BUT, I SURE LIKE THIS TURN ON AND FLY SYSTEM, ANYWAY!!!!! There are a lot of functions available including the dual rate option on rudder which is nice. Have had no RF problems including range or glitches and NO SHOOTDOWNS from other flyers. We have so many of these systems at our electric field that my buddy picked up somebody elses and tried to get ready to fly.

I put a day glow orange tag on my trans!!!



Pile-O-Wood -> RE: spektrum two servo aileron problem (3/21/2006 8:34 PM)

Adjust the slave channel to 150% on the ATV and they will both move the same amount.



pkassoc -> RE: spektrum two servo aileron problem (3/22/2006 1:25 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Pile-O-Wood

Adjust the slave channel to 150% on the ATV and they will both move the same amount.


Jusy tried that.......both ailerons went to maximum up position and all aileron control was lost. Tried the same thing with both positions of the flap switch...same result. willing to try anything ,however...thanks.



dsnyder -> RE: spektrum two servo aileron problem (3/22/2006 2:47 PM)

Set them up to move the same amount mechanically and by adjusting your aileron travel adjust. Then if you want more travel, go to the dual rate function and increase the aileron rate. This will increase the travel on both ailerons.



pkassoc -> RE: spektrum two servo aileron problem (3/22/2006 9:49 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: dsnyder

Set them up to move the same amount mechanically and by adjusting your aileron travel adjust. Then if you want more travel, go to the dual rate function and increase the aileron rate. This will increase the travel on both ailerons.



repeat of the heart of post #7



pkassoc -> RE: spektrum two servo aileron problem (3/23/2006 4:37 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: pkassoc


quote:

ORIGINAL: dsnyder

Set them up to move the same amount mechanically and by adjusting your aileron travel adjust. Then if you want more travel, go to the dual rate function and increase the aileron rate. This will increase the travel on both ailerons.



Actually, the most travel you can get out of this system with 2 seperate aileron servos (WITHOUT ending up with uneven servo arm travel) is to set the aileron travel at +/- 100% and then set the dual rates at 125% max. This gives about +/- 45 deg travel for the servos supplied with the set. This is as much as any other system i have seen out there has since they seem to all use 125% as a max aileron travel. The 150% spektrum aileron travel setting works great for a one servo application, but this is not applicable to the 2 servo setup due to the non-linearity that results.



cessnapilot5 -> RE: spektrum two servo aileron problem (7/31/2006 9:20 PM)

Hi,
I'm having the exact same problem with my DX6 dual ailerons. The major difference for me is that I AM using a Y-Harness. Could this be a defective harness, bad servo? I don't get it, I've been flying for 20 years and have never had dual aileron servos move non-porportionally while using a y-harness (I don't even see how it is possible!) Any suggestions?

Other symptoms:

1 servo moves slower than the other
1 servo has more range of movement that the other
If I reset the mechanical linkage to make them even, it works for about 10 seconds, then the endpoints begin to change and not recenter??

I know this sounds ridiculous, but Any Suggestions would be appreciated.
Thanks,
Brian



dsnyder -> RE: spektrum two servo aileron problem (8/1/2006 2:56 PM)

It sounds like a potential Y harness problem, servo problem etc. Do the servos move properly attached direct to the receiver rather than through the Y? If so, then the problem is likely the Y. If not, I'd guess a servo problem or similar. Also if using the BEC function of a speed control, be sure you are not exceeding the limit of servos used.



raginredneck93 -> RE: spektrum two servo aileron problem (9/25/2006 6:33 AM)

I'm having the same problem with my DX6, I think. I have the system installed in two other planes, one is a flying wing with elevons, the other is a Hyperion CAP232 with a single aileron servo. It works fine in both of them although the set up for the elevons turned out to be quite a hassle. The instructions in the manual said to do something quite different than what I ended up doing in order to make it work, however it's been a while since I built the plane and I don't remember exactly how I did it. Oh well, it works.

Recently however, I've been trying to get it to work in my E-Flite J-3 Cub with dual aileron servos, and haven't had any luck when trying to set the endpoints on the ailerons. This isn't a 3D ship, and just using 100% throws is not acceptable. Also, there isn't enough mechanical adjustment available to reduce the throws to anywhere near the recommended amounts. When I try to set the throws by adjusting the aileron travel at the transmitter, I can reduce the travel of the right servo, (the one plugged into channel 2) but the left servo (plugged into the flap channel) still has full travel no matter what. I managed to get the travel of each servo independently adjustable by turning off the flaperon function and simply programming a mix between channel 2 and channel 6, but then my dual rates only effect the right aileron. I have the flap travel set to zero for both switch positions as recommended in the instruction manual, and I've even tried changing it with no positive results. This plane has barndoor ailerons so I have no desire to use the flap function, and I'd really rather not even have it programmed in thereby avoiding the chance that the switch gets bumped accidentally. I'd imagine that flaps being deployed that far out on a wing would be nothing more than tip stall generators.

I would assume, that if the radio was working properly then adjusting the aileron end points with the flaperon function enabled should adjust the travel of both aileron servos, but it doesn't, only the right one. Was this something that was overlooked in the design of this radio? Is Horizon planning on fixing this problem somehow if so? Am I just an idiot that likely couldn't set the clock on my darn microwave and therefore should just stick to non computer radio systems? Anything is possible, but at this point I feel that I've tried just about everything, and after reading this thread I'm beginning to think that it isn't just me since others are having similar problems.

At any rate, other than the problem just described, I've otherwise been quite happy with the system overall. I've read about others having receiver problems, but (knock on wood) so far so good here.




dsnyder -> RE: spektrum two servo aileron problem (9/25/2006 3:38 PM)

No, that is the way the system works. Travel adjust on the aileron channel only affects the servo in the aileron channel. If you want to adjust both servos at the same time, adjust the dual rate setting of the aileron.



raginredneck93 -> RE: spektrum two servo aileron problem (9/25/2006 6:34 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: dsnyder
quote:

No, that is the way the system works. Travel adjust on the aileron channel only affects the servo in the aileron channel. If you want to adjust both servos at the same time, adjust the dual rate setting of the aileron.


Yeah, I figured that out this morning after talking to the owner of the LHS where I bought the system. He said he knew of another guy that was having the same problem and as we were discussing what to possibly do about it, you could have probably actually seen the light bulb come on as we both thought of it at the same time, LOL. Anyway, my ailerons are working fine now, but I'm scared to fly the thing since I'm obviously such a moron for not figuring it out sooner, DUH. Thanks for the prompt response though! I've really got to quit working on my planes late at night.

I'm happy, now I can go back to loving my Spektrum radio instead of cursing at it. [:D]




sails1880 -> RE: spektrum two servo aileron problem (10/2/2006 6:12 AM)

Danny,

I have a slope glider with rudder, elevator, and two spoilers. [RES] Each spoiler has it's own servo. There is no motor or ailerons.

I'd like to have the spoilers controlled by the throttle stick; i.e., forward throttle position lowers both spoilers, back raises them.

In addition, I'd like the aileron stick to control the rudder and lift the appropriate spoiler.

I can get everything to function as desired with the exception of the flap switch, which I'd like to reverse. When I have the throttle correctly moving the spoilers, if I move the flap switch to the opposite position, both spoilers will raise no matter where the throttle is positioned. I'd like to reverse this action and have both spoilers lowered no matter what the throttle position.

I can reverse the action of the flap switch but then the throttle reverses the spoilers.

What is the proper way to do this?

Thanks,

Dave



dsnyder -> RE: spektrum two servo aileron problem (10/2/2006 3:55 PM)

How do you have it set up currently, what channels are you using, and what mixes do you have set up? Having that information might help to determine what might be able to be changed to reverse that.



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