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RE: WACO YMF - 11/15/2012 1:24 PM   
Dash7ATP



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Status: offline 		VOX,Your glass work is beautiful. But I have a question?  Of all of the WACO photos I have seen, I have not seen the large rivited enforcements on the cowl, other than the two smaller ones  on the parting seam.  Were these just on your subject plane? 

Joe

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RE: WACO YMF - 11/15/2012 2:51 PM   
skylarkmk1



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Status: online 		Joe,

VOX has the Cowl correct for the modern Waco Classic Cowls. The Cowl on NC 14031, a 1934 Waco YMF/UMF (the subject of Paul Matts drawings and Pica's kit) does not have any reinfocing on the cowl, it is smooth.

P1 - Side view on NC 14081, a 1987 Waco Classics YMF serial number F5-009
P2 - 3/4 view on NC 14081
P3 - Close up of P2
P4 - Cowl on NC 14031

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RE: WACO YMF - 11/15/2012 4:45 PM   
Dash7ATP



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Status: offline 		John,

I see what you are talking about on your photos, however, here are two WACO Classics that are smooth. The first one, N40116,  is based in VA Beach, and I have lots of photos of her.  Other than the normal ones along the seperation seam,  nothing. The second one with the polished blisters, is spanking new, made in 2011. That is N128L based in VA. Again, no re-enforcements. 

So that is why I made my comments.

Joe

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RE: WACO YMF - 11/15/2012 9:45 PM   
ceije


 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: VOX


quote:

ORIGINAL: ceije

VOX, nice work a few questions if i may. is she a kit or from plans, you say composit what type of materials. it looks like everything is interlocking, how much time is invested so far. thanks,

regards,
Chris Melhus, ceije 196


Hello Chris,
Work with the project lasts about a month. It is a fully independent work. At first I was planning to make a set of lightweight balsa and plywood. But then I decided to make a model of a fully composite. This will make them more technologically advanced production for me. I work with materials German company R & G. Model will be made ​​on a ''sandwich'' that ensures greater strength and light weight. As a filler, I will use the material Herex. Model weight is about 16 kg.

regards,
Albert


VOX, Albert, I do beleive your project just opened up PANDORA's BOX, congrats on becoming a brother and welcome to the brotherhood. I guess the next set of questions are, is this going to be a production item or strictly experimental, if production will it be cost effective and will kits be in the Barth and ARM price range. You've caught a lot of eyes and this is a high interest group. This is a great build to watch unfold, please keep it the photos and info. posted.

regards
V OX,

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RE: WACO YMF - 11/15/2012 10:19 PM   
rccrasher65


 

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Status: offline 		Vox, Welcome aboard, beautiful work being done there, you truely are a craftsman. best wishes ,George

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RE: WACO YMF - 11/16/2012 4:13 AM   
jymster



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[/quote]

Hello Chris,
Work with the project lasts about a month. It is a fully independent work. At first I was planning to make a set of lightweight balsa and plywood. But then I decided to make a model of a fully composite. This will make them more technologically advanced production for me. I work with materials German company R & G. Model will be made ​​on a ''sandwich'' that ensures greater strength and light weight. As a filler, I will use the material Herex. Model weight is about 16 kg.

regards,
Albert
[/quote]

Albert, how will you replicate the fabric areas with composite material? Not sure if I am understanding your project properly.

James.

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RE: WACO YMF - 11/16/2012 6:38 AM   
VOX



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Repeat the texture of fabric in the form of very simple! I'll show some pictures that explain better than my words ... I will write in detail and show you how I would do.

Albert

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RE: WACO YMF - 11/16/2012 8:10 AM   
VOX



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From: Feldkirch, AUSTRIA
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So look finished product from the mold. As you can see they are all copy original struktkru.
I clearly explained?

Albert

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RE: WACO YMF - 11/16/2012 11:49 AM   
Stickbuilder



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Status: offline 		NEW BROTHER ALERT !!!!

Guys, we have a new Brother among us, and what a Brother.

Let's all give Albert (VOX) a warm welcome.

Albert, you have the Brotherhood number 229. Hope you have fun with it.

Bill, Waco Brother #1

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Its easy, just glue all the pieces together, and sand off everything that doesnt look like an airplane.

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RE: WACO YMF - 11/16/2012 4:15 PM   
mrdhud



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Status: offline 		VOX,
Welcome to the Brotherhood. The work you are doing on your Waco is quite extraordinary. I’m looking forward seeing more as you progress along.
I wasn't sure how much 16 kilograms was so I looked it up little over 35 lbs is amazing.
Welcome again.

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RE: WACO YMF - 11/16/2012 4:34 PM   
mrdhud



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Status: offline 		Here are a few pictures of the progress. I have the new landing gear and engine installed. I mounted (epoxy) a small servo on the back side of the fire wall for the throttle seemed like a good idea at the time but now I think the vibration from the engine mite not be so good on the servo. Any thoughts on this would be appreciated.

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RE: WACO YMF - 11/17/2012 9:47 AM   
Stickbuilder



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Status: offline 		Dan,

I would never recommend mounting a servo or any other electronic device that close to the engine. There are tons of RF noise that might (key word is might) affect the operation of that device. You could always shield it and try it though.

Bill, Waco Brother #1

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RE: WACO YMF - 11/17/2012 12:44 PM   
Dash7ATP



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Status: offline 		VOX,

Your mold work is amazing, but I can't help but wonderif these are WACO parts. They don't look familiar. For instance, if i'm not mistaken, the rudder trim tab is ground adjustable on the YMFs and the white rear navigation light is part of the wing tips now. I thought it was on top of the vertical Stab on the older models. Of course, I've been wrong before................

Joe

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RE: WACO YMF - 11/17/2012 2:12 PM   
VOX



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From: Feldkirch, AUSTRIA
Status: offline 		Hello,
Such parts in Waco is not! I have shown how it will look on a model of tissue structure made ​​of composite material.
Now I'm busy searching for good photos of this aircraft. Brother skylarkmk1 (N26)suggested I buy a couple of CDs with him, but unfortunately he did not answer me on my three letters ....
Albert

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RE: WACO YMF - 11/17/2012 2:33 PM   
acerc



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Status: online 		Vox, give him time. He will respond. Probably busy.
Dan, I'm with Bill on the servo's not being in the engine compartment.


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RE: WACO YMF - 11/17/2012 4:05 PM   
Dash7ATP



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quote:

ORIGINAL: VOX

Hello,
Such parts in Waco is not! I have shown how it will look on a model of tissue structure made ​​of composite material.
Now I'm busy searching for good photos of this aircraft. Brother skylarkmk1 (N26)suggested I buy a couple of CDs with him, but unfortunately he did not answer me on my three letters ....
Albert


Ah, that makes sense now.  Some of the parts looked like P-47 parts!

I looked back at your posts and couldn't find the model of WACO you are building. Is it an early version, or one of the Classics? I have a lot of photos of several Classics I would be happy to put online here if that will help. What exactly do you need?

Joe

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RE: WACO YMF - 11/17/2012 4:19 PM   
VOX



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From: Feldkirch, AUSTRIA
Status: offline 		I'm doing a model NC 14081. Those photos that I showed concern for the aircraft Lavochkin La-7.

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RE: WACO YMF - 11/18/2012 10:13 AM   
Stickbuilder



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Status: offline 		I'd love to build a Lavochkin La-7. Probably the most unusual fighter from the time. One of the toughest too.

Bill, Waco Brother #1

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RE: WACO YMF - 11/20/2012 4:42 AM   
mrdhud



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Status: offline 		Kind of slow the last couple days so I’ll jump in and give an update on the build.
Since my last post I was able to build and sand all the tail section. I forgot how much I enjoy sanding balsa LOL. I will take some pictures tomorrow and post them.

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RE: WACO YMF - 11/20/2012 11:15 AM   
Stickbuilder



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quote:

ORIGINAL: mrdhud

Kind of slow the last couple days so I’ll jump in and give an update on the build.
Since my last post I was able to build and sand all the tail section. I forgot how much I enjoy sanding balsa LOL. I will take some pictures tomorrow and post them.


You could have come up. I'd have let you sand the wings for the Ryan.

Bill, Waco Brother #1

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RE: WACO YMF - 11/20/2012 11:52 AM   
RCplanman


 

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Status: offline 		Stickbulder, Bill, Hope you and yours have a wonderful Holday,

Bill

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RE: WACO YMF - 11/20/2012 9:09 PM   
Dash7ATP



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Status: offline 		Making a windshield frame - Part 1.

I had already decided to not use the windshield that came in my Pica kit, as it didn't match the windshield on a local Waco.  I had made one of a much thicker plastic that was the dimemsions of the local Waco, but it had no frame. The frame of the rear cockpit seems to be pretty heavily constructed as you can see in the last photo below. It appears to be fiberglass.  So I decided to make one to match.  This was a first attempt. I have had lots of experience with fiberglass, and I think I went about this pretty much correctly with a few exceptions. So, if you decide to make one of these, do as I say, and not as I did.


The first few photos show the windshield as I prepped it for the fiberglass work. I was using the windshield as the form to lay up the glass, and it needs a release agent. I covered it with Frisket Film, a very low tack vinyl used to make stencils (This worked as planed). Then I covered the fuselage in the cockpit area with a plastic film such as sold to cover plans to protect them during building. It appears to be the same stuff as Monocoat backing. Of course this was to protect the fuselage. I added some masking tape to the rear edge of the windshield so the glass could lay on it, and keep resin from running back under and onto the windshield. This also worked as planned. Next step was to try to position the windshield in the correct location for a perfect fit when all was done. This didn't go as easily as I had hoped for as I was trying to keep the edge of the windshield in contact with the fuselage without having to tape it down. The white blocks on the center window pane are magnets (with one under, for weight) to help hold it down.  With a small piece of tape on the front edge, it worked just Ok.

The next steo was appling the glass. At first I wsa going to use some fiberglass tape I had, but soon discoved I didn't have enough. And it was too heavy.  This was my biggest mistake. I was hoping to use just a few pieces on each edge, but the heavier cloth would not take the folds at the edges and stay attached to the windshield. The results are obvious in one of the photos. I finally ended up cutting small strips of a much lighter and flexable fabric which worked great, but the heavier stuff was already causing the problems. 

My suggestions, and what I'll do on my next layup:  Once I have the windshield prepped,, I'll tape it down to the plastic film with thin scotch tape. This will ensure a good fit all around AND prevent the resin from creeping under the windshield. I have decided to forgo the Friskit Film and just use PVA  release agent all over. .  For the cloth, I'll use a much lighter material, about a one ounce fabric, and just use more layers.  One other suggestiion is to try to keep the glass to resin ratio as high as possible, which I did not do on this first attempt. And I knew that. It's just the the heavier cloth made a lot of resin neccessary to wet it out.  It didn't work......  By keeping the resin to a minimum, you also keep your sanding to a minimum for a good finish.

I'm going to give this another try in a day or so and I'll post my results again.

Joe

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RE: WACO YMF - 11/20/2012 11:21 PM   
Jaybird


 

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Status: offline 		Off topic, sorry...I wanted to thank Bill for sharing some time with me while I was in Florida last week. It was great to meet you and talk planes and work and grandchildren. I also wanted to thank Robert for helping me get in touch with Bill as I needed updated phone numbers! I'm sorry I didn't get to meet Robert due to a mix up and change in plans later in the week. You gentlemen are very kind to help and share your time with others.

I did get my fourth flight in the N2S-3 Stearman with Rob Lock (Waldo Wright) at Fantasy Of Flight last Friday. It was scheduled for Thursday but the weather didn't cooperate which is why I missed visiting Robert. It was a great flight and I was at the controls from take-off to landing...thrilling. Not a WACO, but still a biplane...steep turns, lazy 8's, stalls and slow flight...heaven! I have a half hour long video of the whole thing too.

Here is a link to the YouTube video. http://youtu.be/Eq8rFSJ_OCQ

Jaybird

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RE: WACO YMF - 11/21/2012 11:26 AM   
Stickbuilder



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Status: offline 		Jay,

I'm to assume that you made it back to Maine with no problems, other than the colder weather. Glad to have met you in person, and sorry I could not visit longer, but duty called. I finished the other wing for the Ryan last evening, and will be starting to cover in the next couple of days. Come back down and visit again soon. I'll get you and Robert (Dan too) together.

Bill, Waco Brother #1

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RE: WACO YMF - 11/21/2012 10:53 PM   
VOX



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From: Feldkirch, AUSTRIA
Status: offline 		Hello,

Working with the model going on ... I think it took me a long time. Now I have completed all the necessary parts of polystyrene. This was necessary for further work. Tomorrow I will cover this polystyrene fiberglass epoxy resin.

Albert, Waco Brother 229

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