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RE: WACO YMF - 7/16/2007 8:00 AM

JoeAverage

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quote:

ORIGINAL: damifino

Joe Average: Looks like you've got your timeline mixed up there cowboy. Your post is the the sort we do not wish to have around here. Keep your average thoughts to yourself so this above average thread continues the way the majority likes it. Got it?

I am sorry. I'll try to tow the line better. I'm new here. No need to get all "Broke Back."

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RE: WACO YMF - 7/16/2007 8:09 AM

damifino

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I imagine no one here has seen 'Broke Back Mountain'. We have been around long enough to have some degree of decorum though. The subject you touched on has been re-hashed more times than is necessary. You are welcome to tag along and enjoy the journey.

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RE: WACO YMF - 7/16/2007 8:15 AM

skylarkmk1

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Jay,

Here are the stiffener photos I was able to get;

P-1 – End view with ruler in 64ths, vertical.
P-2 – End view with ruler in 64ths, horizontal. Stiffeners are just under 2” apart (1” mark is under the right stiffener).
P-3 – End view with caliper, vertical.
P-4 – End view with caliper, horizontal.
P-5 – Top view of crimp end, showing slit to allow forming. Aileron connecting strut base attach point on right.
P-6 – Underside of aileron showing a dent that indicates the approximate location of wood filler (red line) to support aileron strut base mounts (lower right). This filler strip is along the straight area of the trailing edge to allow the ailerons to be interchangeable. Note that the mount is between the 2nd and 3rd stiffener (aileron is from an YKS-7). Also the rivet pattern for the internal diagonal stiffeners (top and bottom).
P-7 – Location of strut mount on UPF-7, NC 173E, between stiffeners 9 & 10 and inline with the interplane (“N”) struts.
P-8 – Top view showing the location of the first stiffener is about 1-1/2” in from the end (tip is similar) and location of the aileron strut base on the YKS-7.

Overall length of aileron is 67-1/4”. Bottom tip taper starts approximately 27” from the tip of the aileron.

Caliper measurements are approximate (hand held).

Hope this helps everybody.

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< Message edited by skylarkmk1 -- 7/16/2007 8:27 AM >

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RE: WACO YMF - 7/16/2007 8:19 AM

damifino

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Way beyond the call of duty SKYLARK, THANKS on behalf of the Brotherhood.

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RE: WACO YMF - 7/16/2007 8:26 AM

Nightstalker

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Hey guys - Just got back from vacation in Michigan - they can have all that cool damp weather - nothing like a dry Arizona heat

Hughes - You "da Man"! EXCELLENT job for an 'ol motor sickle rider

... You had me fooled for all these months. Every post of your's I read, I was picturing you in bib overalls - smellin' like road grime - and getting glue in your grey whiskers - cussing every failed attempt to post a progress pic... youngsters... I swear!!! Well, I don't feel so bad now being a young'n myself. Again great job!!!

And John (JoeAverage) the post before this one was pretty good - as well as a lot of your 1/2A forum posts I've read over the last month or so - but the kit profit jab on Stickbuilder was not in the best interest of this thread, IMHDO (in my own humble doggie opinion)

. Keep it above average (to quote Jay damifino) if you can - you seem as if you're capable of that when you do.

Hey - I drink a lot too

Cheers!!!
Nightstalker

WACO Brotherhood #47

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RE: WACO YMF - 7/16/2007 9:03 AM

JoeAverage

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While the propabability of that given event occuring is inversely proportional to it's desirability, I will see what I can do.

Regards, John

edit: Nightstalker, you are, and others, good natured so I reply in kind and try to contribute constructively.

This is a retorical question and meant to invoke thought and not to provoke a reply, but when the kitting of the model and by who issue surfaces it gets shut down by a closing of ranks rather than a basis in fact? It seems to repeat itself. The responses to my unpopular query bring this to my attention. I'm not the first.

That's the last you'll here from "me" on the topic.

< Message edited by JoeAverage -- 7/16/2007 9:38 AM >

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RE: WACO YMF - 7/16/2007 3:47 PM

Skinny Bob

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Thanks John

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RE: WACO YMF - 7/16/2007 4:54 PM

Stickbuilder

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Joe Average,

The post that you referred to was the very first post on this thread. At the time, I thought that it might be nice to offer this model as a kit once more, since Cox does not wish to offer the model as a Kit...(only as an ARF). With what has transpired (The AMA has the plans, and they now have the parts templates which they offer with the plans), there is no need to offer this model as a kit, and the Brotherhood, as a group has decided not to offer a kit, since you can kit your own, and the model is once more a viable builder's kit.

I hope that this clears up the mystery for you, and that you will join us if you so desire.

Bill, AMA 4720
WACO Brotherhood #1

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Its easy, just glue all the pieces together, and sand off everything that doesnt look like an airplane.

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RE: WACO YMF - 7/16/2007 6:54 PM

Stickbuilder

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I'm sure glad that John is our historian, I personally don't know what I'd do without his endless supply (hopefully) of information. Great job again. Jay, how soon will you have the skins done? I'd like to buy a set from you.

Bill, AMA 4720
WACO Brotherhood #1

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RE: WACO YMF - 7/16/2007 11:30 PM

khodges

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quote:

ORIGINAL: skylarkmk1

Caliper measurements are approximate (hand held).

Gee, John, I was hoping you could be a little more precise. I mean, really, using a caliper that's only calibrated to 0.001? let's see, in 1/5 scale that would be..............0.00020, not nearly close enough

YOU DA MAN ! This will come in handy on the UPF, if it ever gets here.

< Message edited by khodges -- 7/17/2007 1:22 AM >

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RE: WACO YMF - 7/17/2007 2:00 AM

trlambsr

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I was still there and saw The B 17's fly. That flight was really cool. Hope you were not the one that had the wheels up landing. David Fepelstein lost his P47 just after you guys flew. I believe that most of the reason for his loss was caused because both of us had no !!!! I really mean no sleep because of a hord of Students running the walk ways all night long at the quality Inn. He looked away then back and flew the wrong plane. So his went into the ground. Nothing left. We were going to stay until he went in.
Thats why I did not fly.
TR
WACO BrotherHood # 69

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RE: WACO YMF - 7/17/2007 3:28 AM

damifino

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STICKBUILDER- Re: Skins. With vacation and other summer things going on I'd be afraid to say at this point. I'd like to think there will be some usable pieces by mid-August.

< Message edited by damifino -- 7/17/2007 3:32 AM >

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RE: WACO YMF - 7/17/2007 11:49 AM

Hughes500E

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There's not enough hours in the day guys

I sure appreciate all the kind words, adds to the motivation, thanks.
I have logged 6 flights on my Waco. Turns out I'm not only a rookie at building scale, I'm a rookie at flying scale as well

Most important thing for me to remember, it's a hobby, it's suppose to be fun

The Saito 170 3 cylinder gets everyones attention, it truly matches this scale of craft. I'm running a 16-8 prop at about 1/3 throttle to 1/2 on 15% fuel with a 16 ounce tank and I can run for 19 minutes before I get tired

I have yet to run it out of fuel, I don't want it to go lean! I would add a degree or two of right thrust if my cowl was off. Trimmed in flight, rudder is offset quite a bit.

We're feeling temperatures in 98 to 102-3 degrees right now, no troubles other than the Reynolds numbers being low. I have noticed some bumpy flights, the turbulence and winds affect the Waco. One of the key areas, rudder first then aileron to keep the wing in check followed by elevator to keep altitude. Wing overs, figures eights, lazy eights, chandelle's, barrel rolls, descending circles etc look really nice. It is a definite scale flying craft.

Take offs are really nice and it lands like a big trainer. Actually it lands like a butterfly with wounded feet, very very nice. I'm hoping if I loosen my overalls

, I'll actually be confident enough for my first scale competition, in 3 days

My camera just won't take a good picture with this orange color, I have tried several times. I also buggered up my landing gear a bit when I first bent it. I had no template to use or experience so it sits rather low. I plan on changing it after I get over this event. Maybe my camera will work better then

Loving it!
Steve

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RE: WACO YMF - 7/17/2007 5:27 PM

jagnweiner

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Gentlemen-

I humbly request permission to join the Brotherhood. I am currently in the process of resurrecting a 1/6 scale WACO that appears to have been built from plans in either the late '70s or early 80s. It was a freebie. A friend was helping a friend clean out a storage unit. It was the friend's friend's dad's plane and he was just going to throw it away.

It came with a frozen up K&B .60, but I am repowering with a Saito .91. I assume that will be sufficient? It had a pretty nice paint job over silk or Koverall, but there were quite a few broken stringers and a few other broken pieces, so I am recovering with Coverite iron on fabric. I am also converting to dual aileron servos and installing new cowl and wheel pants. I will try to post before and after shots once it is done. It will be "sport scale" at best.

-Scott

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WACO Brotherhood #61

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RE: WACO YMF - 7/17/2007 6:10 PM

Stickbuilder

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Scott,

Humbly???? No one in the Brotherhood ever does anything, "Humbly."

If you will look back at page 150, you will see that you are Brother #61. Welcome to the brotherhood, and we wish you well with your 1/6th scale bird. It must be nice to have friends who give you neat stuff. We all want to see pics of the plane both before and after, so burn some pixels.

Bill, AMA 4720
WACO Brotherhood #1

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Its easy, just glue all the pieces together, and sand off everything that doesnt look like an airplane.

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RE: WACO YMF - 7/17/2007 6:43 PM

jagnweiner

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WOW! I don't even remember making the request the first time around! Senility is setting in at age 38. Thanks for the welcome.

I'll try to post some of the before pics when I am home from work tonight.

It is nice to get the occasional gift out of the blue. When my friend called me to ask me if I wanted the plane, he just said "It's red white and blue," no other description. I figured it was probably someone's old trainer, but I would never turn down a free plane. You can image my delight when I saw what I was getting.

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RE: WACO YMF - 7/17/2007 7:04 PM

skylarkmk1

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Scott,

Welcome aboard. You will also find a copy of the original plans, less templates, for the 1/6th version in PDF format on our auxillary site - House of Moy http://www.houseofmoy.com/waco/ along with lots of other information. Looking at the 1/6th plans it would appear that your friends dad built the Waco according to the plan with the .60 engine.

Remove the glow plug, drop the engine in some alcohol or fuel and let it sit for a bit to let the varnish desolve. Maybe it will loosen up enough to take apart, clean, inspect, replace any bearings/other parts, re-assemble and run for another engine for your fleet. Or you could try the Crockpot with Anti freeze method to loosen it up.

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RE: WACO YMF - 7/17/2007 7:52 PM

jagnweiner

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John-

I already found the auxiliary site. You guys are great! I probably will be reviving the K&B at some point, but not for this plane. I have the Saito sitting around from a deceased Cub and figured this would be a good fit. Given that I took at least a half a pound of lead out of the nose, I don't think a little added weight will hurt.

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RE: WACO YMF - 7/17/2007 9:03 PM

Stickbuilder

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You did not make the request the first time around. I only bring the roster forward every 10 pages. If I brought it forward every time someone joined the brotherhood, we would now be on page 200 or so. The thing takes up almost an entire page.

I just update it, and then scoot it up on the 10th page.

Bill, AMA 4720
WACO Brotherhood #1

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Its easy, just glue all the pieces together, and sand off everything that doesnt look like an airplane.

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RE: WACO YMF - 7/17/2007 10:02 PM

jagnweiner

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I get it. I'm a little slow on the uptake.

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-Scott
WACO Brotherhood #61

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RE: WACO YMF - 7/18/2007 12:31 AM

old git

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Bill,

The following book on eBay may interest the Brotherhood. Decide who is bidding if you want it. I don't advise bidding against each other.

WACO - Symbol of Courage and Excellence - Vol.1
Item number: 290119148170

WACO Brotherhood No. 14.

old git - - - - - - -aka John L.

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RE: WACO YMF - 7/18/2007 12:51 AM

khodges

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Hughes500E

Trimmed in flight, rudder is offset quite a bit.

Sounds like you're having too much fun. It's killing me to get mine back in the air, I just haven't had time to really get in there and finish up this landing gear replacement, but, its coming along.

John and I noticed something at CCA on several UPF's; the entire vertical tail on at least four was offset to the right, to counter the torque reaction and P-factor. Even the headrest extension was offset to meet the extended centerline of the V stab. Oddly enough, there were others (majority) that had no offset. When we asked the owners, noone had a really good answer about why the difference. Our Brother WACO Joe's UPF was not offset, and he was interested to look at the ones we saw that were. His comment was that they wer apparently rigged that way to counter the torque, etc. Another owner siad that the airframe structure determined the angle the V tail mounted at, that it was not something that could be changed.

I noticed that mine also flies with a bit of right trim to keep the tail straight, otherwise it looks like you're in a bit of crosswind. I try to just fly it, and lean on the rudder a tad to straighten it out, rather than crank in a lot of trim, because the trim screws me up on approach and when doing loops. But you're right about one thing, it's a real sweetheart otherwise.

Don't know if you can see the offset in the right side view, but you can in the left side

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Club Saito #2, WACO Brotherhood #20. What other trouble can I get into?

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RE: WACO YMF - 7/18/2007 12:52 AM

WacoJoe

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quote:

I flew my Waco last night

It's a gorgeous plane. Congrats!!

Joe

WB #54

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RE: WACO YMF - 7/18/2007 1:14 AM

Stickbuilder

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Ken,

Did these two planes with the offset vertical stabs have the trim tab on the rudder as well? I'm planning to make the rudder trim tab completely adjustable on this one. Not in flight, but statically. Seems as though this would preclude having the entire tail skewed>

Bill, AMA 4720
WACO Brotherhood #1

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Its easy, just glue all the pieces together, and sand off everything that doesnt look like an airplane.

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RE: WACO YMF - 7/18/2007 2:26 AM

hillbillynamedpossum

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I hate to butt in, but you might try calling around to the different hvac places around your town. Im a tin bender myself and it wouldnt be any problem at all for me to make a tank out of copper and sweat it togather. in fact im probably going to build a tank for my 4 star 40 this weekend. Im kinda dumb so if I can do it shurely there are other tin benders who can.

Possum

(didnt realize the way this forum worked. this post was meant for a guy named chris who had a tank question)

< Message edited by hillbillynamedpossum -- 7/18/2007 2:28 AM >

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