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RE: WACO YMF - 10/22/2007 8:23 PM   
vasek



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ORIGINAL: red1

Hi Guys

Is there some particilar reason why this lengthy thread is organized back-to-front (oldest-to-newest) ? I, for one, find it "strange" to have to go to the tail end to get to the most recent. But...I'm the new guy on the block, so...

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RE: WACO YMF - 10/23/2007 12:39 AM   
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Status: offline 		I am sure this question has already been addressed, but without having to look thru what has now become the Wacopedia, what type of engine powered the YMF? And where can I purchase one in 1/4 scale?
Thanks


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RE: WACO YMF - 10/23/2007 1:18 AM   
Stickbuilder



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quote:

ORIGINAL: mango12

I am sure this question has already been addressed, but without having to look thru what has now become the Wacopedia, what type of engine powered the YMF? And where can I purchase one in 1/4 scale?
Thanks

The original engine for the YMF was the 225 horsepower Jacobs 7 cylinder radial. As to where one can be had, I have no idea regardless of scale. I'm making mine from another radial engine who's cylinders look kinda-sorta like those from a Jake.

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RE: WACO YMF - 10/23/2007 1:45 AM   
skylarkmk1



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YMF-3 – Jacobs L4, 225hp, Even spaced Cowl Bumps
YMF-5 – Jacobs L4, 245hp, Even spaced Cowl Bumps
YMF-5 Classic – Jacobs R755B, Even spaced Cowl Bumps
YMF-5 Super – Jacobs R755B, Even spaced Cowl Bumps
Both the Classic and Super engines are available with fuel injection.
UMF-3 – Continental R-670, 210hp, Paired Cowl Bumps or Larger Smooth Cowl (Cuban UMFs for example)
Some were possibly refitted with the Continental R-670, 220hp engine

As far as I know, no one is making a true scale dummy Jacobs engine, although it is on the list for Williams Brothers according to the reply from Dan Brett, President of Williams Brothers;

Hi John,
oh boy, I hear you on that one! Once I get this business on it's feet, I'll be looking at what it takes to fill the gaps in the model engine world! The Jacobs was on the list for sure. Also, things like Continental for J-3 Cubs!
I'll be digging into the whole mold making process later this year.
I know some of those resin kits are actually casted from our cylinders when times got desperate after WmBros, Inc went out of business. I can't blame them, but the plastic injected type is really hard to beat for detail and durability.

This line needs to grow in order to survive, so I'll be looking at several items to add to the line!

Thank you for the input- I like to hear what people are after and on the wish lists out there!
I take it seriously!


Daniel J. Brett, President
Williams Brothers Model Products


Ken, Jim or Bill can probably tell where they got (or how they made) their engines.

Top flight has a vacuumed formed 9 cylider engine for their Staggerwing, and a couple of other places have resin cast engine but not a Jacobs or Continental.


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RE: WACO YMF - 10/23/2007 2:01 AM   
mango12


 

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Status: offline 		Bob Dively has a 1/4 scale P&W that I thought I might be able to modify, but I am not sure what I would have to do to convert it, as I am not familiar with either engine.
John , your input on this thread has been top notch, thanks.
Any input from the Brotherhood on this subject would be great !!
Scott


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RE: WACO YMF - 10/23/2007 2:48 AM   
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Look at the GP..PT-17 Dummy Radial Engine. 7 cyl. Just fits inside my Cox WACO Cowl....Part No. GPMA2806...
I think it will look good in my ARF.....

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RE: WACO YMF - 10/23/2007 2:57 AM   
khodges


 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: mango12

Bob Dively has a 1/4 scale P&W that I thought I might be able to modify, but I am not sure what I would have to do to convert it, as I am not familiar with either engine.
John , your input on this thread has been top notch, thanks.
Any input from the Brotherhood on this subject would be great !!
Scott


Scott, my dummy came from www.aerotecmodels.com

They have both 7 and 9 cylinder dummies in 1/7, 1/6, 1/5, and 1/4 scales. They look more like Wright or P&W, but they're passable. The 1/4 scale 7 cylinder is $65.00. These are resin cast, fairly basic, but details are easy to make. This is what mine looked like before and after:

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RE: WACO YMF - 10/23/2007 3:12 AM   
skylarkmk1



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The Williams Bros Cylinders P & W Wasp cylinders show the most promise to be converted to a Jacobs “sorta looks like” engine but you would still have to make your own crank case. The Williams Bros. site has a mini How-To on building a small crank case that might be of help.

The Bob Dively 7 cylinder P & W (p/n DE-502) is the right diameter (10” for ¼ scale) and may be the cheapest ($22) and easiest conversion. No crankcase to build. Maybe not, they are vacuum formed and would need some backing (epoxy w/microballoons or similar inside) before any cutting could be done.

In the meantime here are a few pictures of a real Jacobs engine (L 245hp);

P1 Overall View
P2 Cylinder #1 Front view, note the fins turn up on the exhaust side rocker tower and no fins on the intake side, the different diameters of the fins on the upper (natural) section with slightly wider spacing then the smaller diameter fins on the lower (black) section. Rocker housing/covers are different than the P & W.
P3 Cylinder #7 Top view
P4 Jacobs R 755, 275 hp mounted in an YKC.


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< Message edited by skylarkmk1 -- 10/23/2007 3:24 AM >

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RE: WACO YMF - 10/23/2007 3:50 AM   
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Status: offline 		$19.95, No pushrods, or sparkplug wires yet...

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RE: WACO YMF - 10/23/2007 4:34 AM   
skylarkmk1



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Who makes it?


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RE: WACO YMF - 10/23/2007 5:35 AM   
Jim Henley


 

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That is what I have in my WACO, the Great Planes pt-17 radial, you can not beat the price and by the time you get it inside the cowl you have to be VERRRYYY close to see that it is a vacuformed engine. Put the (included) push rods and plug wires on and your good to go !!

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RE: WACO YMF - 10/23/2007 5:51 AM   
Live Wire


 

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Nice looking plane won't be long now and up she goes.

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RE: WACO YMF - 10/23/2007 6:57 PM   
mango12


 

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Status: offline 		Thanks guys. I am ordering the Bob Dively engine today. I'll let you know how it turns out!!!
Scott


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RE: WACO YMF - 10/23/2007 9:03 PM   
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Status: offline 		I guess everyone has their own way of doing this, but through the info you guys so kindly provided, I came up with this method. (Pix #1).
I like the thought of being able to replace a burnt out bulb or LED so I made the unit removable. The lights are from a small clip-on reading light and have the spring at the back of the LED still attached. I put a removable balsa strip behind them so the spring holds them tight into the frame but allows removal if necessary. (Pix#2) A clear plastic cover on the wing will hold them in place.
Two LEDs each side on a 3 cell pack give enough light to see fairly well even in the daylight. (Pix #3).
Overall effect is satisfying if not overly dramatic! (Pix#4) but I'm happy with the effect - now for the wing tip lights!! I have that nearly solved with a flashing white LED that I will use as a strobe and a non-flashing coloured LED all squeezed together in an aluminum tube. Some work yet to do on it, but it looks promising!

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RE: WACO YMF - 10/23/2007 10:34 PM   
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Status: offline 		Hey Jim,

that looks great, good job. I´m doing the same just now on my Waco. I will take two high power Led´s emitter
with 240 lumen light stream each and reflectors.



Regards
Bernie

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RE: WACO YMF - 10/23/2007 11:51 PM   
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Status: offline 		Hi Guys,

I´m searching for a scale prop in 32x18", who knows, where to buy?
It should look like this:




Bernie

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RE: WACO YMF - 10/24/2007 12:32 AM   
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Status: offline 		Bil and the rest of the gang,

I just talked to Darrell at Precision and he has recieved the pictures I have sent him. We discused a few points on mounting to the fuse, making the inner strut adjustable, tail wheel streering, incorporating a wheel pant mount on the lower gear, and how to keep the lower section from rotating (he already has that figured out). He will be doing some drawings and talking to his welder about some of the parts and doing a mock up. The thought is that the Main Upper section for the 1/5th Pica will be 5/8th OD (a little larger than scale) and will be under the fairing so it should not matter. The inner strut will possibly be just a round section, but similar to full size, you can cap it with wood to get a airfoil section. He does have a few projects he is working on that he needs to finish up before he can get going on our gear, so be patient, it may be a couple of weeks before he starts.

< Message edited by skylarkmk1 -- 10/24/2007 12:40 AM >

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RE: WACO YMF - 10/24/2007 12:43 AM   
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quote:

ORIGINAL: BigBoy99

Hi Guys,

I´m searching for a scale prop in 32x18", who knows, where to buy?
It should look like this:

Bernie


Bernie, I doubt you'll find one like that, but it's easy enough to make one. First, find a nice wood prop about 34 inch diameter; the chord of the longer prop is likely a tad wider than a 32 prop would be. Cut the tips square, bringing the prop down to the required 32" diameter. Sand the prop to bare wood, removing the factory finish, or at least most of it. Using the picture you posted, take measurements of the leading edge cladding and transfer them to the scale prop, pencilling in the shape of the cladding. Then use some metal tape like heating and a/c ducts are taped with and trace the shape onto it, cut it out and apply to the prop. Burnish it down with a piece of dowel or a Sharpie cap, mask and paint the tips, and then clearcoat the entire prop. If you want to try flying the prop, check the balance at every step, and then when you clearcoat it, achieve final balance with the clear coat.

The hub can be done with a fender washer, 2-56 threaded rod (or proper proportion for the scale you're using) and nuts to fit. Then a big prop hub to top it off.

Here's the picture I used and the scale prop I came up with, using a 20 inch Zinger prop, cut to 18 inches:

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RE: WACO YMF - 10/24/2007 1:18 AM   
trlambsr


 

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I would like to thank you for what you are doing to Help Darrell At Sierra Giant Scale design landing gears for the WACO. Without your help it would not have come to were it is. We will now, because of your efforts be able to have the Best scale landing gear made by who I think is the best vendor in the business.
Thank you again for all you have been doing and I hope the group appreci
quote:

ORIGINAL: skylarkmk1

Bil and the rest of the gang,

I just talked to Darrell at Precision and he has recieved the pictures I have sent him. We discused a few points on mounting to the fuse, making the inner strut adjustable, tail wheel streering, incorporating a wheel pant mount on the lower gear, and how to keep the lower section from rotating (he already has that figured out). He will be doing some drawings and talking to his welder about some of the parts and doing a mock up. The thought is that the Main Upper section for the 1/5th Pica will be 5/8th OD (a little larger than scale) and will be under the fairing so it should not matter. The inner strut will possibly be just a round section, but similar to full size, you can cap it with wood to get a airfoil section. He does have a few projects he is working on that he needs to finish up before he can get going on our gear, so be patient, it may be a couple of weeks before he starts.

ates your efforts as much as I do.
TR
WACO Brotherhood # 69

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RE: WACO YMF - 10/24/2007 1:51 AM   
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Glad to do it, Darrell stated that for the big 1/3rd scale planes that weigh 40-50 lbs, he normaly uses a 7/8th tube main tube, just a hair under scale and has not had any problems with the gear. So you guys with the big 'uns will be covered, but again, please be patient.

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RE: WACO YMF - 10/24/2007 3:43 AM   
Stickbuilder



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quote:

ORIGINAL: skylarkmk1

TR,

Glad to do it, Darrell stated that for the big 1/3rd scale planes that weigh 40-50 lbs, he normaly uses a 7/8th tube main tube, just a hair under scale and has not had any problems with the gear. So you guys with the big 'uns will be covered, but again, please be patient.

John,

Everyone,

A little off topic here, but Dick Watz is building the first two Wendell Hostletter Cessna 195's from Wendell's plans. Dick needs any documentation that is available on this plane. Anyone who has some information on this plane, please send it to me, and I will see that Dick gets it.

Bill, AMA 4720
WACO Brotherhood #1

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RE: WACO YMF - 10/24/2007 4:13 AM   
khodges


 

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Status: offline 		John (Howard) probably has a ton of stuff on the 195. There were two at CCA. I only got pics of one, and few of it. Whatever else I can find, I'll send, or link. Three tidbits: Cessna's first all-aluminum airplane, it used a NACA 23012 airfoil instead of the Clark-Y that other Cessna models used, and had free castering main gear to lessen likelihood of ground looping.

Just gotta love those Flash Gordon wheelpants.

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RE: WACO YMF - 10/24/2007 5:55 AM   
Stickbuilder



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Status: offline 		Thanks, Ken. I'm sure that Dick will appreciate these two pic's. I can't wait to see what all John has.

Bill, AMA 4720
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RE: WACO YMF - 10/24/2007 6:08 AM   
skylarkmk1



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Status: offline 		Bill,

I have a few pictures of the same Cessna 195 (Maroon over Natural) that Ken has, plus a couple of the other 195 (Dark Red over Red) at the Fly In. I also made arrangements to photograph a nice 195B (Orange over Yellow) NC 9833A this Sunday (28 Oct). He even offered to roll it out of the hanger to do a walk around if it is not raining and take as many pictures as I want.

P1 Ken at work photographing 1948 Cessna 195, N 195DS (I think his first picture above)
P2 1950 Cessna 195A, N 369JJ
P3 1950 Cessna 195B, NC 9833A, the one I will be photographing

I’ll send you a PM.


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< Message edited by skylarkmk1 -- 10/24/2007 6:40 AM >

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RE: WACO YMF - 10/24/2007 6:12 AM   
Stickbuilder



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Status: offline 		Thanks John.

Bill, AMA 4720
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