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RE: WACO YMF - 6/6/2007 6:08 AM   
damifino



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From: Winston Salem, NC, USA
Status: offline 		Just a note about the shirts.

I initially said they would be Hanes BEEFY-T's which are 6.1 oz. 100% cotton. What we are getting is better. They are Hanes Authentics Tagless Tees (no tag in the neck band) which are more comfortable. Same weight, same quality, same color, just 'more better' because there is no tag to tickle your neck while flying! Just leave that to the gnats and sweat bees!

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RE: WACO YMF - 6/6/2007 11:26 AM   
vasek



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Status: offline 		khodges, I do not recall the smoke setup you have. can you pls recap or direct me to the post describing it ? (couldn't find it)

Thanks, V.

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RE: WACO YMF - 6/6/2007 3:22 PM   
mrdhud



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John, sent you PM

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RE: WACO YMF - 6/6/2007 6:35 PM   
Nightstalker



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Status: offline 		Bill - Are you still with us??? Haven't seen you post (anywhere) lately. I know, you're probably selling "bowties" by the boat load... to pay for that brand spankin' new gee wizz 'puter . Hope everything's ok.

Out Here
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RE: WACO YMF - 6/6/2007 8:04 PM   
Stickbuilder



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Status: offline 		I'm here, still having puter problems.

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RE: WACO YMF - 6/7/2007 12:45 AM   
khodges


 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: vasek

khodges, I do not recall the smoke setup you have. can you pls recap or direct me to the post describing it ? (couldn't find it)

Thanks, V.


It's a TME Simple Smoke. I think it's the Deluxe kit, came with neoprene and Tygon tubing, check valve, and control module. I mounted a 14 oz tank piggybacked over the fuel tank; the module plugs into an AUX channel on the Rx, and automatically cuts the battery out of the circuit (the pump battery) when the Rx is off. I still put a separate switch with a charge jack in the system so I could recharge the battery the same way as the Rx battery. Plumb the tank the same way as a fuel tank; I did a 2-clunk, 3-line setup, with the pump between tank and muffler. The DX-7 Tx has two switches that have trim pots and I have the smoke on one of them, which allows me to fine adjust the pump flow with the trim switch. The flow is adjusted by adjusting the endpoint of the channel, it speeds up or slows the pump. This pump will feed a 150cc engine, so I had to turn it way down, to the point it would barely run, so I added a restrictor in the line (a wheel collar around the feed line with a set screw that compresses the tubing) which allowed me to turn up the pump so it would run well. I can also fine adjust by using the set screw in the collar, but don't think I will, it's much easier using the Tx trim. When you first turn the system on with the Rx, the pump runs about 5 seconds and automatically primes the system, then stops. The check valve goes near the muffler end and only allows the oil to flow toward the muffler keeping exhaust pressure from forcing air back into the line when the smoke is off. I have a Slimline Pitts muffler, which has the smoke feed built in.

I'm using Super-Dri smoke oil, it's supposed to smoke at lower temps. I get very dense smoke from just off idle through full throttle, and the tank will last just over three minutes continuous running. It's possible to mix the smoke channel into the throttle to increase flow with increased throttle, but it's not necessary on the G-26, at least with my setup. I'll try it out this weekend and see how it does in the air.

I should have said that it smokes like a 1972 Chevy Vega with 20,000 miles on it. I don't guess the Master Chief was selling Chevs back then ,though.

The pic below shows where I mounted the pump, behind and below the tanks, just above the wing saddle. the pump is rubber mounted to the rail. The module is velcro'd to the fuse above the pump (out of view)

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< Message edited by khodges -- 6/7/2007 1:06 AM >

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RE: WACO YMF - 6/7/2007 1:06 AM   
Didg


 

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Status: offline 		Hi all,

Excellent thread, I've only just found it.

I'm curently talking to Dany from Genesis re a 33% YMF that will have a Moki 150 fitted.
Just wondering if any of you guys had flown this combo.

How much of an unhealthy obsession with WACO's does one need to have, to be part of "The Brotherhood".

Didg.

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RE: WACO YMF - 6/7/2007 2:03 AM   
trlambsr


 

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Status: offline 		hi
Great plane to build. With the new parts it is even better. The kit is improving every day. Still has some minor problems but they are easily changed with scale pictures and a careful build. I have a DA 150 and it is way more power then necessary. I fly at slightly above 1/4 throttle. Unlimited vertical at just above half throttle.
TR
WACO Brotherhood # 69

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RE: WACO YMF - 6/7/2007 3:00 AM   
skylarkmk1



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Status: offline 		Oh Heck TR, your pilot bailed on you. You really need a pilot in there

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RE: WACO YMF - 6/7/2007 5:21 AM   
skylarkmk1



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Status: offline 		TR,

Even non-Wacos look better with a pilot. This pilot, Glen Peck, was giving the DH-4M2 a check ride after installing a new radiator for the Liberty 12 Cylinder Engine. The flight was a success, no leaks, no over heating, engine running fine, sounding like a half a dozen Harley’s. This plane is part of the Historic Aircraft Restoration Museum collection at Creve Coeur Airport.

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RE: WACO YMF - 6/7/2007 6:19 AM   
khodges


 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Didg


How much of an unhealthy obsession with WACO's does one need to have, to be part of "The Brotherhood".




That's a contradiction in terms, Didg, a WACO obsession is the healthiest kind. Consider yourself a member. The Master Chief (Stickbuilder) can give you a number, unless you have one in mind; just so it's past whatever the current membership is. You can look back and see the list somewhere. The Master Chief is having 'puter problems, his hard drive got soft, or something like that

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RE: WACO YMF - 6/7/2007 9:30 AM   
vasek



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quote:

ORIGINAL: khodges

It's a TME Simple Smoke. ...



Thanks for the info khodges. Nice setup! I did consider buying the TME but finally bought the Sullivan Skywriter. It's my first smoke pump so I have no idea how much smoke oil i need, but your 14oz tank is huge! I was hoping to install a 8oz for about 6 min of smoke (i read it somewhere while researching the pump) I'm not sure if smaller engine needs less oil for the same effect (?)

Cheers, V.

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RE: WACO YMF - 6/7/2007 2:35 PM   
trlambsr


 

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Status: offline 		Boy this is really getting over the top. This old marine Gunny can't even test his Biplane without a pilot. The pictures are old. They are from the early days and I was worried that the pilot was not checked out in the WACO so he stayed on the ground for static only. He is there now but don't have any pictures of him or at least I can't find them.
When you are over 70 things are a little slow and thats why I fly WACO's. My WACO was in the First group and now is almost 4 years old. Many, Many successful flights and some not and the plane has survived some ground loops and pilot errors in the early days. It took me probably 30 flights and the help of a full scale WACO pilot to learn how to land it. Its more like a Warbird than my Sukio. I bring it in Hot (high Idle). No three pointers for me because if you miss its big trouble.
TR
WACO Brotherhood # 69



TR

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RE: WACO YMF - 6/8/2007 12:13 AM   
khodges


 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: trlambsr

Boy this is really getting over the top. This old marine Gunny can't even test his Biplane without a pilot. The pictures are old. They are from the early days and I was worried that the pilot was not checked out in the WACO so he stayed on the ground for static only. He is there now but don't have any pictures of him or at least I can't find them.

TR
WACO Brotherhood # 69



TR


TR--That's a damn fine WACO, absolutely gorgeous. The reason the pilot can't be seen is that he's up in the cowl, spinning the prop by hand. Marines don't need no engines!!



Vasek-- This is from the TME manual, regarding "wet testing" of the pump and adjusting flow:

"Fill the smoke tank and turn the pump on while timing the amount of time it takes to empty the tank. Adjust the valve for about a 2 oz/minute flow for .90 or smaller glow engines.........1.2 cubic inch engines require about 3 oz/minute. Larger gasoline engines from 1.8 to 4.2 cubic inches can burn from 4 to 8 oz/minute. At TOC in Las Vegas, 8.8 c.i. glow engines were burning up to 15 oz./minute...."
I figured that a 14 oz tank, at about 3- 4 oz/minute would give me around 3-1/2 to 4 minutes of smoke, since the G-26 is 1.5 c.i.
The hotter the exhaust, the more smoke you get from a given amount of oil at a given rpm. Gas engines do best, then 4-stroke glow. Hope this helps. The Sullivan smoke pump is very good, I've seen several pattern/3-D planes with them. I suppose the setup is very similar in terms of where the pump goes, adjusting flow, etc.

< Message edited by khodges -- 6/8/2007 12:14 AM >

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RE: WACO YMF - 6/8/2007 12:25 AM   
Didg


 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: khodges


quote:

ORIGINAL: Didg


How much of an unhealthy obsession with WACO's does one need to have, to be part of "The Brotherhood".




That's a contradiction in terms, Didg, a WACO obsession is the healthiest kind. Consider yourself a member. The Master Chief (Stickbuilder) can give you a number, unless you have one in mind; just so it's past whatever the current membership is. You can look back and see the list somewhere. The Master Chief is having 'puter problems, his hard drive got soft, or something like that


I too consider my obsession to be healthy, my missus on the other hand would disagree.

It's an honour to become a member, am I too late to order a T shirt or two?

Just so you know a bit about me:
I live in southern Scotland, I'm 45 and work at the National Museum of Flight - East Fortune Airfield (1915)
Flying models for 2 1/2 years (late starter ).

Hi to all,
Didg.

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RE: WACO YMF - 6/8/2007 2:26 AM   
Stickbuilder



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quote:

ORIGINAL: Stickbuilder


Okay, Here is the roster to date.

WACO BROTHERHOOD MEMBERSHIP:

#1 stickbuilder
#2 Hughes500
#3 Jim Henley
#4 mmattockx
#5 CTflyboy
#6 michaelj2k
#7 Ronj10
#8 gwulle
#9 jim schroer
#10 Skinny Bob
#11 Bart5495
#12 Pimmnz
#13 HarryJ
No. 14 Old Git
#15 ChrisMH
#16 Nerevar
#17 Ricatic
#18 Clay H.
#19 Tripp2Loo
#20 KHodges
#21 Bill Hogue (WACO One)
#22 Mangolo (Waldo)
#23 av8ter
#24 yel914
#25 damifino
#26 skylarkmk1
#27 Jacque
#28 Edwin
#29 AROPLANE
#30 CubNut (Anthony)
#31 BQuartucy (Bob Q)
#32 AERORON
#33 funkymusic
#34 RCOutlaw
#35 obo (Bob)
#36 Jackk36 (Jack)
#37 fatherrooster (Jim)
#38 Ilikebipes
#39 Kestrel0222
#40 CROWMAN17 (Marc)
#41 redcesar
#42 S. Christensen (Scott)
#43 Bill Deidrich
#44 Mike Barbee
#45 mrdhud (Dan Hudson)
#46 SoCalSal
#47 Todd (NightStalker)
#48 argon (Bob Gonzalez)
#49 mango 12 (Scott)
#50 skyjet 1
#51 ZIG
#52 Didg
#53 MarvinE255 (DOC)
#54 Joe Norris (Full Scale WACO Pilot)
#55 vasek
#56 SuperCub Man (Jim)

#60 doc zinger

#64 stifts (Steve)


#66 Mobyal

#69 trlambsr

#77 tomcraig


#100 nine o nine (Mitch Epstein)



WACO Sisterhood Roster:

S-1 Janelle (Lady Stickbuilder)
S-2 Sissy Nightstalker
S-3 Barb Barbee
S-4 LadyMango (Lynda)


Bill, AMA 4720
WACO Brotherhood #1






< Message edited by Stickbuilder -- 6/21/2007 4:10 PM >

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RE: WACO YMF - 6/8/2007 5:53 AM   
khodges


 

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Status: offline 		Master Chief, you have both ZIG and didg as #51. Would Didg not be #52?


Didg, we're kindred somewhere along the line. My mother is a genealogist and has traced our families a long way back. I'm a Campbell on one side (and a member of Clan Campbell USA), and Callaway on the other, and have relatives from the McKenny and MacDonald Clans, and I married a McDaniel. One of my dreams is to visit your fine country before I depart this mortal coil.

If you will contact damifino by PM, or here on this thread, he can set you up with ordering T-shirts.

Welcome to Clan WACO

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RE: WACO YMF - 6/8/2007 6:13 AM   
khodges


 

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Status: offline 		On another note, I got two great flights in today on the UMF, about 15 minutes each. I got the rudder input on takeoff about nailed, the tailwheel adjustments are working perfectly. My first landing was spot on, came in about 1/4 throttle (this thing really slows down when you back off the gas) and did a great wheel landing with a 100 foot rollout. Second landing I got too slow (actually was almost downwind) and bounced the touchdown, pulled the spring loaded gizmo on the landing gear struts out of the mounting block. An easy fix, I need longer mounting screws and a longer travel on the gizmo. I did a loop and couple of rolls, it's beautiful in the air.

One thing ticked me off, I couldn't get the smoke system to work. I heard the pump run, but it either wouldn't prime or ???. And the last time I tried it before pumping the fluid back out, the pump wouldn't run (battery read 5.24V). I wanted the smoke for this weekend, but fixing it means removing the wings and I just don't feel like it right now. I'll just fix the gear problem and fly it without smoke for now. next time I need to adjust or repair something else, I'll figure this thing out.

Gosh, this thing is fun to fly

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RE: WACO YMF - 6/8/2007 7:10 AM   
damifino



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Status: offline 		VASEK: I have the Sullivan pump on a YS 110 powered Super Skybolt. Makes great smoke. I need to play with it some more. I have only a 6 oz tank and I've seen that it makes as much smoke at low pump speed/low engine speed as it does at high pump speed/high engine speed. I've made a flow restrictor to try out. My reasoning is that 'lean' on the oil mixture will do two things: conserve oil (more time) and not cool the exhaust with excessive flow. All in all I really like it. One thing to be carefull about- The Sullivan pump's nipples have no barbs and the supplied plastic clamps will allow the tubing to slip off. It makes a REALLY big mess! After the big mess I secured the lines with the supplied clamps AND an arrangement of nylon zip ties around the tubing and then to the mounting holes on the pump base itself.

WACO TEES- Samples were printed today and the logo and background did not have enough contrast. Simple fix but will delay printing until tomorrow (Friday). If everything goes as planned they will still be on schedule.

For those of you have just joined: I did get extra shirts just for your situation. Please send me a Private Message with your real name, address, e-mail address, and sizes of shirts desired. I will advise you of availability and the total cost which will include shipping. The quanities are limited so speak up!

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RE: WACO YMF - 6/8/2007 8:25 AM   
vasek



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Status: offline 		khodges & Jay, good info THNX!

I'm planning to use a ST G2300 >1.4 (it's for a CMP Sukhoi) so according to the TME manual it's about 3oz/min
i'll run some tests once the engine has been broke in

Jay, please post some test data once you have some, i'm still hoping for a 8 to 10 oz tank. I would hate to load up a aerobatic plane more than necessary. BTW i'm converting a pitts style muffler for the smoke, will use some copper tubing "wrap" to get the oil as hot as possible before feeding it into muffler.

V.

PS. for the printing of the tees

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RE: WACO YMF - 6/8/2007 8:33 AM   
mobyal


 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: trlambsr

Boy this is really getting over the top. This old marine Gunny can't even test his Biplane without a pilot. The pictures are old. They are from the early days and I was worried that the pilot was not checked out in the WACO so he stayed on the ground for static only. He is there now but don't have any pictures of him or at least I can't find them.
When you are over 70 things are a little slow and thats why I fly WACO's. My WACO was in the First group and now is almost 4 years old. Many, Many successful flights and some not and the plane has survived some ground loops and pilot errors in the early days. It took me probably 30 flights and the help of a full scale WACO pilot to learn how to land it. Its more like a Warbird than my Sukio. I bring it in Hot (high Idle). No three pointers for me because if you miss its big trouble.
TR
WACO Brotherhood # 69



TR


Thank God, Gunny --
Finally another Marine on here. Doggies, Squids and Airdales all over the place. Maybe you'll square this rabble away! LOL Actually, so far they've done a pretty good job of keeping the Company Area policed and the troops in hand.
Where are you in Bethesda, and where do you fly up there now? We lived in Bethesda in the 70's, first on Madison and then on Hoover Streets, off Old Georgetown Road behind Suburban Hospital. I was a member of DCRC and we flew at the County Landfill off Gude Drive in Rockville. Had a really nice scale contest out at Bealeton -- the Flying Circus Aerodrome -- for several years. I didn't compete in it, but did judge static and flight for three or four years. Oftem thought I'd like to run up there one day and see if there's anyone still around I'd recognize.
Welcome aboard!
Moby Al

(Cpl E4, 0331, USMC Ret)


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RE: WACO YMF - 6/9/2007 2:39 AM   
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Status: offline 		well, after a long time of sitting on the shelf I broke open my 1/5th kit today. I got it on Ebay over a year ago. You guys are real inspiration for building these. I am lucky to have access to a real Ymf-5 for scale reference. I just hope I can build this one in less than the six years it took me to build the Skybolt I just finished. At this point I am considering using a Saito 170 radial. Any advice on this?

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RE: WACO YMF - 6/9/2007 3:37 AM   
skylarkmk1



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Status: offline 		Ag,

Go back to page 7, post # 155 by Hughes500, that's the engine he installed. I don't remember hearing how it flew his plane (if its finished), so you might want to PM him to find out.

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RE: WACO YMF - 6/9/2007 5:08 AM   
Live Wire


 

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All you have to do is make up your mind I am going to get it done Then you can't stop working on it


And would you believe look ho is typing and had better get in gear.

< Message edited by RC Outlaw -- 6/9/2007 6:35 AM >

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RE: WACO YMF - 6/10/2007 12:10 AM   
khodges


 

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From: newton, NC, USA
Status: offline 		Just got back from an IMAA fly-in in Statesville NC, about 45 minutes from home. I don't know if it's the heat, gas prices, or what, but not a great turnout, although those who showed up flew a fair amount. the breeze was light most times, but occsionally would get fairly strong. I fretted over whether or not to crank up the UMF, and when I did, noticed the tailwheel had come apart, a solder had broken. I cobbled it back together with some epoxy and a tie wrap, and then flew my other gasser. Jay showed up (damifino) with his co-pilot (son) and we sat around talking, and I decided to go for broke, so I fired up the WACO and Jay spotted for me. The flight was great, and I set up for landing, brought it in, and when I touched down, the main gear broke; the wheel, wheel pant and end of the axle on the left side went bouncing one way, and the stub dug in and the plane nosed over. No damage other than the gear. When we examined the broken wire, it had snapped where the rear piano wire was welded (not brazed or soldered) to the front wire, which becomes the axle stub. Not repairable, and not a failure of one of my mods . I'll have to get another gear from Cox, or copy it and make my own (what an Idea )

Jay and I talked for some time about my scale tailwheel and making one out of steel instead of brass and piano wire, and also talked about making a set of main gear with the oleo main struts, as in the full scale. Wasn't this discussed before in this thread? If we can come up with something that worked well, how interested would you builders be? At 1/5 scale, it's more difficult than doing it in a larger scale because tolerances get very close, but Jay has the know-how. I'm going to doodle with some designs and try to draw out a prototype and see what we can do with it. I'm getting tired of working on an almost new plane every time I fly it . It reminds me of my first motorcycle, a 1972 Daytona Triumph. I loved it, it was a great motorcycle, and ran like stink, but I had to adjust or tighten or repair something every time I got on it.

Maybe it's just me

_____________________________

Club Saito #2, WACO Brotherhood #20. What other trouble can I get into?

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(in reply to Live Wire)
       Post #: 2725

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