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RE: WACO YMF - 7/6/2007 7:33 PM   
Hughes500E



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Status: offline 		Many thanks on two accounts! My stitching looks just like that

Got my shirts too Jay, very nice, thanks!

< Message edited by Hughes500E -- 7/6/2007 7:34 PM >

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RE: WACO YMF - 7/6/2007 9:07 PM   
nine o nine


 

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Status: offline 		Thanks for the interior shots gentlemen. The brotherhood is a terrific resource!. Mitch WB 100

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RE: WACO YMF - 7/6/2007 9:23 PM   
JoeAverage



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quote:

ORIGINAL: Hughes500E

Many thanks on two accounts! My stitching looks just like that

Got my shirts too Jay, very nice, thanks!


That's a great photo of the rudder for another reason. Sorry if this is redundant info but not going to read the giant thread to find out.

Notice the first stitches in the rows at both ends anywhere on a fabric covering like this are half spaced, in other words there are 3 stitches in the span of the usual 2 without exception wherever there is lacing if done to proper procedure.

I have seen many flawless models, except for this little detail. Albeit cosmetic on a model it, without it you won't get a C of A on a 1:1.

Edit:spelling

< Message edited by JoeAverage -- 7/7/2007 6:42 PM >

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RE: WACO YMF - 7/7/2007 9:07 PM   
Hughes500E



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Forgive me guys, I am young!

All this talk about building has been great. There is a scale event I will be flying at with my Waco on July 20,21 and 22. I have to ask, What are some of the scale manuvers a guy should expect to see with the Waco? Seeing as it is a civilian sport plane I'm thinking a scale loop would be good, a wing over, descending circle, maybe a stall turn??

Anyone care to try and educate me a little?

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RE: WACO YMF - 7/8/2007 2:30 AM   
JoeAverage



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Status: offline 		Hughes, do not reproach yourself for something I learned yesterday. It just seemed like a good bit of info to add to such a comprehensive thread. The photos of those who can contribute are priceless. I'm going to guess that very few know about the stitching technique or use it if they do. I've stitched a bit. I have a complete set of NIT A+P mechanics manuals that I read as novels.

Cheers, John

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RE: WACO YMF - 7/8/2007 2:59 AM   
damifino



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Status: offline 		Let me throw this into the conversation. Often the pinking and stitching on models too obvious. Look at it this way: Stand 60 feet away from a full size fabric covered aircraft and take note of how much stitching and pinking tape can be easily seen. Now you've got an idea of how much should be seen from 15 feet away on a 1/4 scale model or 12 feet away on a 1/5 scale. Just an observation.

< Message edited by damifino -- 7/8/2007 3:01 AM >

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RE: WACO YMF - 7/8/2007 3:49 AM   
Live Wire


 

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Boy have you got that right. When we build one this size we are looking at how close we can get it to look like the real thing. The information we recieve here is a great help to achieve what we are looking for when we are building and achieving our goal.
One thing they all look the same after a crash at any distance have fun with what ever your goal and be proud of what you have

Not every one in this hobby has the big buck to fulfill their dream

< Message edited by RC Outlaw -- 7/8/2007 3:57 AM >

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RE: WACO YMF - 7/8/2007 4:27 AM   
JoeAverage



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quote:

ORIGINAL: damifino

Let me throw this into the conversation. Often the pinking and stitching on models too obvious. Look at it this way: Stand 60 feet away from a full size fabric covered aircraft and take note of how much stitching and pinking tape can be easily seen. Now you've got an idea of how much should be seen from 15 feet away on a 1/4 scale model or 12 feet away on a 1/5 scale. Just an observation.



A good example of perspective is the number of rivets on a high quality plastic model that make it look "Right" even though there are actually ten?? times as many on the real aircraft. Is the term "Scale effect" correct for the eyes rationalization of detail on a subconscious level?


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RE: WACO YMF - 7/8/2007 4:36 AM   
damifino



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Status: offline 		Yes, 'scale effect' fills the bill. We want an illusion of the real thing. IMO there can be too much detail, or should I say the details can end up as an overpowering element of the finished model.

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RE: WACO YMF - 7/8/2007 5:05 AM   
Live Wire


 

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what number are you

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RE: WACO YMF - 7/8/2007 5:50 AM   
Hughes500E



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Status: offline 		Well, the issue I am having right now, can't see all the details I spent hours on unless you look real close LOL.



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RE: WACO YMF - 7/8/2007 7:09 AM   
Live Wire


 

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I kow right where you are coming from , when you build for hours and can not see where you have made any headway Only thing I build for other people and the project is a Ziroli P 38
When will I have time for my WACO
Larry K

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RE: WACO YMF - 7/8/2007 8:01 AM   
khodges


 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Hughes500E



All this talk about building has been great. There is a scale event I will be flying at with my Waco on July 20,21 and 22. I have to ask, What are some of the scale manuvers a guy should expect to see with the Waco? Seeing as it is a civilian sport plane I'm thinking a scale loop would be good, a wing over, descending circle, maybe a stall turn??

Anyone care to try and educate me a little?


Loops, rolls (axial and barrel), split esses, Immelmans, Cuban Eights, wingovers, stall turns, hammerheads, are all possible with YMFs, and UPFs, and probably other similar types. Just remember that the power to weight of the full-scales required entering loops from a dive to build airspeed, and that more than one roll at a time would cause a big loss in altitude, as the planes don't roll very fast. Vertical maneuvers aren't really vertical, at least not for long. One way to make them scale is to avoid full throttle on your model, try to keep the power to weight similar to the full scale. Loops usually are egg shaped instead of round, and sustained inverted flight is a no-no, as the carburetors on those old radials don't feed very long upside down. Outside loops aren't scale, either, for the same reason, plus the airframes aren't stressed for much negative G. The UPF was stressed for +5, -3, and I think the YMF is the same. Also, "round" everything off; the crisp, sharp edged stuff like Wagstaff and Chapman isn't scale on the old ragbags, as they just aren't that responsive.

Get some pics at the fly-in, maybe some video.

< Message edited by khodges -- 7/8/2007 8:03 AM >

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RE: WACO YMF - 7/8/2007 9:10 AM   
skylarkmk1



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Status: offline 		Hughes,

Just to add a little to Ken's post, if you check the Aerofiles listing of the Waco History by model, the UMF was the forerunner of the UPF-7. When the UPF-7 was used as a Primary Trainer (YPT-14/PT-14), it was reported to turn better (inside the PT-17) and basically out perform the Stearman PT-17, so similar maneuvers are appropriate. As Ken mentioned, the control authority, especially the aileron, was/is much less than today’s Caps, Extras, Edges, Pitts, Ultimate Bipe’s and the like


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RE: WACO YMF - 7/8/2007 11:55 AM   
Hughes500E



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Status: offline 		Nice, thanks for the input. I have narrowed my choices to this:

5 Mandatory
Take Off
Figure Eight
Fly Past
Landing
Overall Flight Realism

5 options
barrel roll
360 degree descending circle
stall turn
vintage loop
touch and go

Now I just have to get the Waco finished

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RE: WACO YMF - 7/8/2007 5:25 PM   
damifino



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Status: offline 		Hughes- Got any pictures?

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RE: WACO YMF - 7/8/2007 7:36 PM   
Hughes500E



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Status: offline 		I am hoping tomorrow or later tonight I can take some pictures of her. Maiden is this Wednesday evening


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RE: WACO YMF - 7/8/2007 8:05 PM   
khodges


 

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Status: offline 		Sounds like a good performance coming up. My favorite maneuver with my little UPF (haven't tried it yet with the UMF) is a barrel roll; it looks really good with a WACO. Hope I'm not talking out of school here, but remember, on your stall turn, the plane should pivot at the c/g. If it turns at a point out on the wing, it's a wingover.

There was one point of "flight realism" I used to have down pat with my DR-1; that was a ground loop and/or flip at the end of my landing Let's not go there

Speaking of UPF's, I got an e-mail from Aaron at Ikon. He said he's finishing up the kit and should be shipping it on Monday. Can't wait to see it, I'll give a full report.

< Message edited by khodges -- 7/8/2007 8:10 PM >

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RE: WACO YMF - 7/8/2007 9:11 PM   
damifino



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Status: offline 		KHodges- Any progress on your arf-not gear?

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RE: WACO YMF - 7/8/2007 9:24 PM   
khodges


 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: damifino

KHodges- Any progress on your arf-not gear?


Just a little, I got a piece of piano wire in the tailwheel, and made a brass sleeve to go over the shaft. I haven't done anything else; I wanted to finish the plastic plane and see how it flew. I took it to the field yesterday. After two tanks to break in the .61, I got it leaned out and flew it three times. All I had to do was add some up trim to the elevator and it flew hands off. It's a cool little plane to throw in the car; the ABS is relatively ding-proof. It will haul arse at full throttle, but will mosey along at 1/3.

I've got to clean up my shop next, then finish the UMF gear and get it back in the air. By then the UPF should be here, and I'll get started on it. I've GOT to figure a way in my limited space to lay out 6 foot wings. I demand to build the entire wing at once, rather than half now, half later. The way I change things, I want to be sure each half is identical.

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RE: WACO YMF - 7/9/2007 5:58 AM   
ctflyboy


 

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I have often wondered if I would ever get to meet another member of the brotherhood,
well today I can put my wondering at ease,I attended The "DAWN PATROL FLY-IN" here in Ellington, Ct. An IMAA event and I was wearing my WACO T shirt, Had this man come up to me an introduce himself as Mitch, " WACO Brotherhood # 100", a regular down to earth 1st class man. and naturally we spoke the WACO Language

George
WACO Brotherhood # 5

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RE: WACO YMF - 7/9/2007 6:30 AM   
damifino



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Status: offline 		The power of a simple tee shirt. You two would have passed by each other had it not been for that. Thanks for sharing.

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RE: WACO YMF - 7/9/2007 7:41 AM   
khodges


 

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Status: offline 		Jay, I got the tailwheel done tonite; all I have to do is paint it. I did it pretty much the same as it originally was, except on the bottom bearing I pressed a brass sleeve into the nylon block, and polished the steel shaft of the gear fork where it slides through the brass sleeve. I figured the wear would be less than having the brass slide in the nylon. A little lithium grease, and it's as smooth as can be. The set screw for the piano wire insert acts as a travel limiter, it hits against the bottom nylon block at max compression. I have a tad more than 1/4 inch travel, which is plenty.

Damn it looks good.

Attachments
Click to see fullsize image.
Click for fullsize


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RE: WACO YMF - 7/9/2007 8:58 AM   
pimmnz


 

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Status: offline 		Damifino,
Tees arrived today! Thanks from windy, cold and damp New Zealand, if there's anything I can do...
Evan, W.B. #12.

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RE: WACO YMF - 7/9/2007 4:08 PM   
Stickbuilder



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quote:

ORIGINAL: ctflyboy

To All,
I have often wondered if I would ever get to meet another member of the brotherhood,
well today I can put my wondering at ease,I attended The "DAWN PATROL FLY-IN" here in Ellington, Ct. An IMAA event and I was wearing my WACO T shirt, Had this man come up to me an introduce himself as Mitch, " WACO Brotherhood # 100", a regular down to earth 1st class man. and naturally we spoke the WACO Language

George
WACO Brotherhood # 5



George,

I'm happy to hear that you met up with nine o nine....Looks as though the Tee shirt thing really does pay off...I wore mine to the NASCAR races at Daytona this weekend, and to Disney World too. I got a lot of comments on the shirt (and the WACO hat) seems as though lots of folks know what a WACO is... However, there were no other persons wearing the shirt....

Bill, AMA 4720
WACO Brotherhood #1

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