Seagull Edge 540 - 68" (60-90) ARF New v2- Building

Seagull Edge 540 - 68" (60-90) ARF New v2- Building
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Seagull Edge 540 - 68" (60-90) ARF New v2- Building - 5/22/2006 4:11:49 AM

Tesla1856

Posts: 239
Joined: 7/31/2004
From: San Antonio, TX, USA
Status: offline

I need a little help with my first 60 to 90 size 3D plane.

I’ve been flying for a couple of years now. My electro-mechanical building skills are good, but as far as the air-frames go, I can put together a 80%-90% ARF, and that’s about it (but I can make small balsa-MonoKote repairs) … Plus, with work, I don’t really have the time to build a plane from a kit (I would never get to the field to actually fly anything) … The ARFs take long enough for me. After 2 high wing trainers (.46) and a Four Star 40 (.46), I think I’m ready to move up to a bigger 60-sized airplane. I bought the Seagull Edge 540 – 68”.

http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=SEA4000

Especially at first, I’ll be flying the Edge real easy … basic sport flying. I can do the basic aerobatics on the Four Star 40 and not crash, but that’s about the extent of my skill level. I guess I’m finally at an Intermediate skill level, but the Four Star is still challenging at times, especially in gusty conditions. I’ll keep practicing and pushing myself on the Four-Star all summer until the Edge is ready.

I don’t want the Edge to be under-powered (and you can always throttle back … right?) so I’m thinking about buying a OS .91fx 2-stroke for it (but I’m still open for suggestions on the engine). I would like to cut the cowl as little as possible to keep the sharp scale look of the plane. I had originally thought about getting a OS .91 4-stroke (because of the small exhaust tube and impact on the cowling), but after I saw the price with built-in fuel pump and the lower b-hp, I think I have decided against getting my first 4-stroke, and stick with the 2-stokes that I’m more familiar with … I just wish the stock 2-stroke mufflers were smaller.

< Message edited by Tesla1856 -- 5/22/2006 7:46:27 PM >

_____________________________

Vince (Tesla) ... http://www.vlsdynamics.com/rc
FourStar40 .46 / P51 Mustang .46 / Edge540 Saito1.25

Post #: 1

RE: Seagull Edge 540 - 68" (60-90) ARF - Building - 5/22/2006 4:22:11 AM

Tesla1856

Posts: 239
Joined: 7/31/2004
From: San Antonio, TX, USA
Status: offline

For the radio, I’ll be using my existing Futaba 6EXA-S 6-channel (with standard R127DF receiver and 4.8 volt 600mAh battery). I also have (6) S3004 ball bearing servos. From what I’ve been reading in the forums about this plane, I’m pretty sure these servos and battery are not a good match to this plane. Maybe with a 6 volt battery, the S3004s at 6v = 57 oz-in might cut it … I’m not sure. Or, do I need something like the S3305 all around (except throttle) at 4.8v = 99oz-in torque
http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXDWF8&P=ML

or, maybe the even cheaper S3010 at 72 oz-in @ 4.8V .
http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXDTB3&P=ML

I didn’t really plan on buying new servos for this plane, but I must have no flutter problems and dependable response (even when I get more confident with it and eventually start pushing the plane to its full capabilities).

Any help will be greatly appreciated.

< Message edited by Tesla1856 -- 6/18/2006 9:01:05 PM >

_____________________________

Vince (Tesla) ... http://www.vlsdynamics.com/rc
FourStar40 .46 / P51 Mustang .46 / Edge540 Saito1.25

(in reply to Tesla1856)

Post #: 2

RE: Seagull Edge 540 - 68" (60-90) ARF New v2- Bui... - 5/22/2006 12:40:21 PM

Zippi

Posts: 3092
Joined: 6/29/2004
From: Evansville, IN, USA
Status: online

Hi Tesla1856, I'm currently flying the Skyshark Edge 540 which is the same size as the Seagull Edge 540. I am running a Saito 100 only because the Saito 125 was not out when I put my plane together. I think you should take a look at the new Saito 125 and you wont be sorry you spent the extra money. Don't look at the Bhp ratings as they tend to be misleading. A 4 stoke has less hp but it has more torque and can swing a bigger prop and you'll just love the sound. A 4 stoke will also burn less fuel and you can still run 2 stroke fuel in them as long as you run a high oil content around 18%. I'm using Hitech HS-635 servos and a HS-645 on the rudder.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tesla1856

I need a little help with my first 60 to 90 size 3D plane.

I’ve been flying for a couple of years now. My electro-mechanical building skills are good, but as far as the air-frames go, I can put together a 80%-90% ARF, and that’s about it (but I can make small balsa-MonoKote repairs) … Plus, with work, I don’t really have the time to build a plane from a kit (I would never get to the field to actually fly anything) … The ARFs take long enough for me. After 2 high wing trainers (.46) and a Four Star 40 (.46), I think I’m ready to move up to a bigger 60-sized airplane. I bought the Seagull Edge 540 – 68”.

Especially at first, I’ll be flying the Edge real easy … basic sport flying. I can do the basic aerobatics on the Four Star 40 and not crash, but that’s about the extent of my skill level. I guess I’m finally at an Intermediate skill level, but the Four Star is still challenging at times, especially in gusty conditions. I’ll keep practicing and pushing myself on the Four-Star all summer until the Edge is ready.

I don’t want the Edge to be under-powered (and you can always throttle back … right?) so I’m thinking about buying a OS .91fx 2-stroke for it (but I’m still open for suggestions on the engine). I would like to cut the cowl as little as possible to keep the sharp scale look of the plane. I had originally thought about getting a OS .91 4-stroke (because of the small exhaust tube and impact on the cowling), but after I saw the price with built-in fuel pump and the lower b-hp, I think I have decided against getting my first 4-stroke, and stick with the 2-stokes that I’m more familiar with … I just wish the stock 2-stroke mufflers were smaller.

_____________________________

"It Ain''''t Lookin Good"
http://zippi.50webs.com/index.htm

(in reply to Tesla1856)

Post #: 3

RE: Seagull Edge 540 - 68" (60-90) ARF New v2- Bui... - 5/22/2006 9:13:23 PM

Tesla1856

Posts: 239
Joined: 7/31/2004
From: San Antonio, TX, USA
Status: offline

Hi Zippi, thanks for the response. That's a nice 60/90 Edge 540 you have there.

I'll definitely consider a Saito. I've heard nothing but good things about their 4-stokes. So, the FA-125A is an option
http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=SAIE125A

but since I'm already trying to scrape up money for the servos, it's good to hear that the FA-100 is a good match for an Edge 540 this size.
http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=SAIE100

For comparison sake, here are the OS offerings:
OS .91 FX - http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXBY47&P=0
OS FS-91 II Surpass - http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXSY82&P=0
OS FS-91 II Surpass w/Pump - http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXBY61

Another thing I've read is that 4-stokes run better inverted. Since my Edge's engine mounts at like a 130 degree angle down ( looks like 8 o'clock) that's something to factor in as well. Looks like the muffler angle on the Saitos is adjustable, so hopefully I could angle it so it comes out of the cowl directly under the engine (close to the middle). On this Seagull Edge, there is some major empty space down there to work with.

So with the 4-stoke, I need to get the proper fuel (makes sense), but what's the deal with the fuel pumps? If I get a Saito, do I need a Perry pump or something similar? Unlike the 2-stokes, I don't see a fuel tank pressure fitting coming off the muffler.

< Message edited by Tesla1856 -- 5/22/2006 10:24:35 PM >

_____________________________

Vince (Tesla) ... http://www.vlsdynamics.com/rc
FourStar40 .46 / P51 Mustang .46 / Edge540 Saito1.25

(in reply to Zippi)

Post #: 4

RE: Seagull Edge 540 - 68" (60-90) ARF New v2- Bui... - 5/22/2006 9:49:44 PM

Tesla1856

Posts: 239
Joined: 7/31/2004
From: San Antonio, TX, USA
Status: offline

Zippi,

What voltage and mAh is your on-board battery that you are running your Hitech servos off of?

Having only built and flown .46 up to now I never really thought about it, but it looks like the extra 1.2 volt cell can really make a difference in torque (power) and while drawing all that power, you need more of it so it's a good idea to increase the mAh size?

Looks like I might be on the right track with servo selection after all.

Your Hitech HS-635 (high torque) looks similar to the Futaba S3010
http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXFRS6&P=ML

While the HS-645 (metal gear, high torque) looks similar to the Futaba S3305
http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXUZ89&P=ML

I'm thinking a possible servo setup might be (if sticking with all Futaba radio gear) :
1 - S3305 - Rudder
2 - S3010 - Elevator
2 - S3010 - Ailerons
1 - S3004 - Throttle (a standard ball bearing servo)

< Message edited by Tesla1856 -- 5/23/2006 2:53:02 AM >

_____________________________

Vince (Tesla) ... http://www.vlsdynamics.com/rc
FourStar40 .46 / P51 Mustang .46 / Edge540 Saito1.25

(in reply to Zippi)

Post #: 5

RE: Seagull Edge 540 - 68" (60-90) ARF New v2- Bu... - 5/23/2006 12:35:53 AM

zsnugz

Posts: 19
Joined: 11/17/2005
From: ROSEBURG , OR, USA
Status: offline

Tesla1856, I have about 8 flights on my Seagull edge 540 now and love this airplane. I am using a Saito 100, (my first, but not last Saito, they sound great and run great) I am using Futaba electronics as my radio is the 9C because I also fly helis. I am using the Futaba 3010s all around and they seem to be fine. I have a 15X6 APC prop on the Saito and no pump. It is a wonderful setup that sounds great and has all the power I need. I am new to aerobatics and this was a good choice after learning the basics on my Ultra Stik. Hope you are as happy with it as I am.
Mike

(in reply to Tesla1856)

Post #: 6

RE: Seagull Edge 540 - 68" (60-90) ARF New v2- Bu... - 5/23/2006 2:52:10 AM

Tesla1856

Posts: 239
Joined: 7/31/2004
From: San Antonio, TX, USA
Status: offline

zsnugz,

Thanks. That's exactly the kind of information I'm looking for.

Glad to hear you like it and the Saito 100 is plenty of power. No pump and it runs fine ... cool. Did you use the stock fuel tank or upgrade it ?

Are you running your Futaba 3010's on 4.8v or 6.0v

_____________________________

Vince (Tesla) ... http://www.vlsdynamics.com/rc
FourStar40 .46 / P51 Mustang .46 / Edge540 Saito1.25

(in reply to zsnugz)

Post #: 7

RE: Seagull Edge 540 - 68" (60-90) ARF New v2- Bu... - 5/23/2006 4:46:16 AM

zsnugz

Posts: 19
Joined: 11/17/2005
From: ROSEBURG , OR, USA
Status: offline

I am using the stock tank so far and setting my timer to 7 minutes before I land and I still have fuel left over. I need to take off the cowl on one of the next flights to actually see how much I have left. I haven't been pushing it either though. It will fly plenty fast at 1/2 throttle, at least for me. My servos are running on 4.8 volts and I put in a 1500 battery. I also have been using 30% Powermaster heli fuel. A little pricey but from what I have read 30% heli fuel is the recommended by Horizon Hobby and Saito.

(in reply to Tesla1856)

Post #: 8

RE: Seagull Edge 540 - 68" (60-90) ARF New v2- Bu... - 5/23/2006 5:59:01 AM

Tesla1856

Posts: 239
Joined: 7/31/2004
From: San Antonio, TX, USA
Status: offline

zsnugz,

I've heard 4-stokes get better fuel economy than the 2-stokes so maybe that makes up the difference. It's just that I've been reading where some of the guys have been upgrading the tanks (so I had to ask), and it's not much bigger than the tanks on my .46 planes ... but with a normal size engine I tend to agree with you ... if it works, don't fix it.

Ya, I guess running 5 high-torgue 3010's, a standard 3004, and a reciever ... all off of a little 4.8v 600mAh battery is asking a bit much. If it would only last for 1or2 5-10 minute flights before a recharge, that's a little too close for comfort for me.

I think this is the proper one, and the price is right:
http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXWX97&P=0

< Message edited by Tesla1856 -- 5/23/2006 10:49:59 PM >

_____________________________

Vince (Tesla) ... http://www.vlsdynamics.com/rc
FourStar40 .46 / P51 Mustang .46 / Edge540 Saito1.25

(in reply to zsnugz)

Post #: 9

RE: Seagull Edge 540 - 68" (60-90) ARF New v2- Bu... - 5/23/2006 2:35:23 PM

Sturtz

Posts: 1511
Joined: 9/22/2004
From: El Reno, OK, USA
Status: offline

Those 3010's won't use up much more than a standard servo. I use them in place of 3004's because they have more torque and seem to like the 5cell batteries better. I can get 3 to 4 10 min flights with a 600mah nicd on several of my 3010 equipped planes.
Best bang for the buck is a NimH 2700 or another Nicd if you prefer. I get all my rx and tx batteries from fellow RCU member Evan at his website RC Assesories. For example here's a 4.8 , 2700mah NiMh for the same price your paying for the 1500.
RC Assesories, 4.8 2700mah, nimh

_____________________________

Kurt
AMA# 794291
Saito Club #121

(in reply to Tesla1856)

Post #: 10

RE: Seagull Edge 540 - 68" (60-90) ARF New v2- Bui... - 5/23/2006 2:37:44 PM

Jim Dines

Posts: 1373
Joined: 2/27/2002
From: Keller, TX, USA
Status: offline

Tesla1856, i flew the earlier version of the Seagull Edge with a Magnum .91 slx (2 stroke). It was an excellent combination. The Magnum does not give you the problems the OS 91fx gives. It is powerful, reliable and very user friendly. Plus it gives you the option of carb mounted needle valve (where it should be) or remote mount. Also, the engine fits side mounted perfectly inside the cowl. With a Slimline large capacity Pitts style muffler (the same one labeled for the OS 91 fx) it looks good and sounds good. And, it costs a lot less than the other engines you are considering.

When you do get to flying your edge, check your elevator control response carefully to avoid excessive throw. It can give you a snap when you don't expect it. Don't ask me how I know that.

Good luck.

(in reply to Tesla1856)

Post #: 11

RE: Seagull Edge 540 - 68" (60-90) ARF New v2- Bu... - 5/23/2006 2:39:16 PM

wraith0078

Posts: 159
Joined: 3/5/2005
From: Grimes, IA, USA
Status: offline

I've also got this plane and love it. I'm flying mine with a Saito 125, Futaba 6EXA and the S3004s that came with it, but on a 6v 1400mAH battery. I wouldn't suggest it. The torque is fine, but after 6 flights, I've already stripped one servo and I haven't even gotten frisky with it yet. I'm planning on switching