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Saito .72 best glow fuel and oil - 1/29/2002 9:49:27 PM   
cloudbuster-RCU


 

Posts: 90
Joined: 1/29/2002
From: fayetteville, NC, USA
Status: offline 		I hear many people using Cool Power 30% heli in their saito .72 and other say don't use that because you shortened the life of your engine.

Today I see in the tower hobbies page WILDCAT 4-cycle 20% and say this:
Wildcat fuels are specifically formulated for max performance and engine life.
These fuels are endorsed by almost all of the major engine manufacturers.

CONTENT: 20% nitro
20% oil

COMMENTS: The four-cycle fuel is straight synthetic oil.
Due to the higher oil content these fuels can be used in any two-
cycle engine.

with that fuel im going to get more power 20%nitro and also more protectan from the 20% oil this fuel it seems a good choice for the SAITO .72 what you think.
______________________________________________________________________________________________________________

or use the 15% nitro and 18% oil wildcat. I am now using 15% Cool Power but people say go for wildcat.
       Post #: 1

Funny thing - 1/30/2002 3:51:27 AM   
Homebrewer



Posts: 1335
Joined: 12/29/2001
From: Colorado Springs, CO, USA
Status: offline 		I normally don't believe in ad hype. Example: FORD Motor Company says that quality is Job 1 but their new Mini SUV, Escape had at least 6 recalls its first year in production costing them over a billion dollars.

Look at any fuel ad and you'll read the same garbage. Buy what's available in your local area and what is affordable.

(in reply to cloudbuster-RCU)
       Post #: 2

Saito Fuel - 1/30/2002 5:40:56 AM   
jimcork1



Posts: 915
Joined: 1/29/2002
From: Slidell, LA, USA
Status: online 		I can only tell you what works in my Saitos. I use Cool power 15% all synthetic oil in my .91 and I use Power Master 2020 in my 1.8. This gives more power. (It has flown well on the Cool Power 15).

I know people who use 30%nitro, but as you mentioned there are downsides. I have used powermaster 15% w/castor in the .52 and it was ok also. The common item is synthetic oil (after breakin), and 15 to 20% nitro for normal flying. Unless you really need extra power I would not spend the extra $$ for the 30%.

(in reply to cloudbuster-RCU)
       Post #: 3

Saito .72 best glow fuel and oil - 1/31/2002 5:32:47 AM   
Fuelman


 

Posts: 1009
Joined: 12/31/2001
From: Jordan, NY, USA
Status: offline 		Saito's like the high oil fuels, in fact, 20% oil is what is specified in the instruction manual. Don't go by the brands of fuel mentioned in the instructions. Of the ones mentioned in the instructions, only Cool Power 30 Heli meets the oil specified.
As far as running 30% nitro, its completly not necessary unless the little extra power is desired. I have found that fuel containing 15% nitro / 20% oil will power the 180's quite well and make them last a loooong time. Yes, they handle the extra nitro rather well and will produce a bit more power on it. For most sport flying I don't see the need for more than say 25% nitro.

Saito's do run much better and last a lot longer (IMO) on 20% oil fuels regardless of nitro amount. They tell you 20% oil for a reason- it lasts longer!

Look at it this way; you paid a premium for a premium engine, why save a buck and fly with a fuel that does not meet the 20% oil spec?

To the best of my knowledge, the 4-stroke fuels currently on the market that meet the 20% requirement are: all of Cooper's and all of S&W's, some of Wildcats, a couple of Morgan's and some of Powermasters. Others may exist.


Happy motoring, you bought a good engine.


Fuelman

< Message edited by Fuelman -- Jan 7 2003 4:02AM >


_____________________________

Fuelman
Cooper Fuels LLC

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       Post #: 4

Saito .72 best glow fuel and oil - 1/31/2002 7:00:00 AM   
shmo46


 

Posts: 418
Joined: 1/26/2002
From: Tucson
Status: offline 		I'm curious about all synthetic vs synthetic castor blend. The saito manual says not to use all castor, and suggests using castor/ synthetic.

i tried using all synthetic Byron Helly fuel running quite rich for a few tanks but found my compression dropping rapidly, i nearly returned the engine it was so bad. decided to just go back to the synthetic/castor again. The engine recovered most of its orignal compression in only 1 tank and was back to normal after a couple more. i assume most of the comression recovery is just the presence of the castor sticking to the surface and acting as a seal. i think that is a good indicator that with a little castor you will have less metal to metal contact (?)

Questions i have is how much castor can i get away with before some problem comes up? Does it gum up the engine? corrosion?
I have heard corrosion is a big problem for four strokes what causes this, and how do you aviod it?

(in reply to cloudbuster-RCU)
       Post #: 5

How much Castor? - 1/31/2002 11:15:53 PM   
Bigc


 

Posts: 16
Joined: 1/31/2002
From: El Paso, TX, USA
Status: offline 		If your asking how much as a percentage of castor you can run,
the answer is 100%. However, It's not the best thing to do in a
four stroke. Castor, while providing excellent lubracation, will gum up after sitting for awhile. (months) You could run after run
oil to help with this. A synthetic/castor blend will work very well,
and may be the best combo to run. If your buying Cool Power or something like it, adding four ounces of castor will bring the oil
content up to 20%. All synthetic may give rust problems if the engines sits without being started. This is where after run oil
is best used. Adding castor helps fight this rust.
If your asking how much oil you can run...Fox Superfuel is 28% castor. Unless your running an old C/L Fox 35 with cast iron
cylinder, don't think you'll need this much.

(in reply to cloudbuster-RCU)
       Post #: 6

Saito .72 best glow fuel and oil - 1/31/2002 11:30:36 PM   
shmo46


 

Posts: 418
Joined: 1/26/2002
From: Tucson
Status: offline 		Many thanks BigC.

Shmo

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       Post #: 7

How much castor is enough? - 2/2/2002 5:43:03 AM   
Fuelman


 

Posts: 1009
Joined: 12/31/2001
From: Jordan, NY, USA
Status: offline 		I have tested to more fuel/oil/engine combinations that I can imagine. What I have found is that 20% total oil in any 4-stroke will yield huge benefits over using a traditional 4-stroke low oil fuel.
As for castor vs. synthetic vs. a blend of both.
I have found that during the first gallon or two, high castor is not a problem at all in any 4-stroke, in fact I think it helps with seating the ring. After a good break in, a mixture of 18% synthetic oil and 2% castor will provide you with outstanding rust protection, outstanding ring to cylinder wall scuff protection and additional connectiong rod journal and wrist pin protection over an all synthetic fuel. My 2% castor blends did not even begin to carbon up the valves or gum up the ring after numerous gallons of torture testing.
The only time I started to notice valve carboning was when I ran more than 4% castor (16% syn/4% cas) for extended times. The 2% definatly does burn cleaner in the engine.

Corrosion is caused by the byproducts of combusting nitro and methanol (its acidic I believe) when no other rust inhibitors are used. Synthetic model engine oils generally have little or no rust inhibiting qualities and in fact contribute to the problem when they are partialy combusted duel to their lower flashpoint. A couple of % of castor will help this as castor is the best rust inhibitor we can use in a glow fuel. Keep in mind that most 4-strokes only get oil to the bottom end through blow by! So if most your oil is flashed off in combustion, what little that goes past the ring should be of the best protection you can get.
It is best to run your engine dry at the end of the flying day and if storing it for a while, squirt a bit of Rislone or Marvel AIR TOOL OIL in the crankcase breather (except YS and OS diaphram pumpers)

Fuelman

< Message edited by Fuelman -- Feb 2 2002 12:51AM >


_____________________________

Fuelman
Cooper Fuels LLC

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       Post #: 8

Saito .72 best glow fuel and oil - 2/2/2002 6:35:52 AM   
shmo46


 

Posts: 418
Joined: 1/26/2002
From: Tucson
Status: offline 		Many thanks Fuelman!



Shmo

(in reply to cloudbuster-RCU)
       Post #: 9

Satio - 2/3/2002 10:58:54 AM   
F900



Posts: 404
Joined: 12/7/2001
From: Ft.Lauderdale , FL, USA
Status: offline 		I have a Satio .56, i used 10% coolpower, and 2 stroke Omega 10% ( Pink) and have never had a Dead Stick. I have been very pleased with satio engine especially when i fly my Tomahawk, last thing i need is a deadstick. Great engine !!!

And use a OS "F" type glow plug. Right guys ?

(in reply to cloudbuster-RCU)
       Post #: 10

Fuelman's name - 2/3/2002 10:25:56 PM   
Hobbsy



Posts: 10426
Joined: 12/2/2001
From: Colonial Beach, VA, USA
Status: offline 		Fuelman, do you call yourself that because you manufacture and sell fuel, are a fuel guru or have your wife convinced that you run on nitro?

_____________________________

"I have gone faster backwards, upside down and on fire than most people have gone at all" Don Garlits

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       Post #: 11

What Quality Caster oil to use? - 7/18/2002 5:41:53 PM   
berniem


 

Posts: 86
Joined: 5/20/2002
From: PA
Status: offline 		Can I get by with a CVS brand caster oil? Are they the same quality?

(in reply to cloudbuster-RCU)
       Post #: 12

Castor - 7/18/2002 10:57:40 PM   
Hobbsy



Posts: 10426
Joined: 12/2/2001
From: Colonial Beach, VA, USA
Status: offline 		Bern, I think most people would say that Sig Castor is the best to buy for adding to fuel.

_____________________________

"I have gone faster backwards, upside down and on fire than most people have gone at all" Don Garlits

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       Post #: 13

Saito .72 best glow fuel and oil - 7/22/2002 10:55:32 PM   
TennCharlie



Posts: 76
Joined: 6/20/2002
From: Dyersburg, TN, USA
Status: offline 		Byron fuels makes a 15% nitro with 20% blend of castor & synthetic oil. Wouldn't this be a good choice. I just bought a Saito .91S & that's what I plan to use in it. The guy at the hobby shop said 20% oil was a bit much, but then he said to always run it blubering rich running 16% oil.
Seems like 20% tuned properly would be the better choice.

(in reply to cloudbuster-RCU)
       Post #: 14

Saito .72 best glow fuel and oil - 7/27/2002 12:24:44 AM