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RE: Scratch building 105 - 5/17/2012 6:38 AM   
Props4ever


 

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Out of usable paint brushes to apply resin with to make the 4th scoop, so had to do something in terms of moving forward with progress, started to lightly hand sand cockpit window #3, it took 1hr to get it to fine sanding stage. Same i did with main window #4, this one took 2hrs to get it to fine sand and primer stage.


PS: Now i can certainly see how much time, effort is needed to make molds and then cast parts from them, no wonder fibreglass parts and kits aren't cheap to get!. Same for getting final prep work done before primer stage takes place followed by painting or applying aluminium foil coverings...

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RE: Scratch building 105 - 5/18/2012 6:00 AM   
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Back to the mold again...

Well at the time i did layup for the dome's mold, it's inner flat surface didn't come out totally fine, few areas were damaged by air bubbles including edges of square depression where plywood will get copulated in when domes will be casted from this mold.

I got some epoxy putty to fix these areas, epoxy putty is 2 part putty that once mixed together by hands will be ready for use. It has solid play-do type of texture. So i'm going to take some of it and mix it together first, then it will be put into the damaged areas from air bubbles, once fully cured, i will then use sand paper to flush it smooth with rest of the flat surface. This will also be used to fix edges of square depression.

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RE: Scratch building 105 - 5/18/2012 6:03 AM   
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Status: offline 		What are you copulating in Sammy ??


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RE: Scratch building 105 - 5/18/2012 11:53 PM   
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Slow Low

What are you copulating in Sammy ??



James,

There will be 1/8" x 2" x 2" plywood piece in the center of the domes that i will capulate between 2 layers of CF. This piece will be the base to mount motor mounts on.

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RE: Scratch building 105 - 5/24/2012 5:13 AM   
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Status: offline 		Even though i took a break to build the wings of my big Concorde model, i haven't forgot about my Connie!...

Look what i found to replicate Cooling fairing ring that goes between prop and the main air intake of the cowling....maybe not perfect but works for me...what do u guys think...

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RE: Scratch building 105 - 5/24/2012 10:26 AM   
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You be the judge.

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RE: Scratch building 105 - 5/24/2012 2:18 PM   
Props4ever


 

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Status: offline 		George, buddy wait till i'm done with these then u and other will see.....there is more to it then just how u see it...btw which S Connie is that with intake gap sealed off in the bottom left picture..

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RE: Scratch building 105 - 5/24/2012 11:14 PM   
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Status: offline 		Sam,

Picture was found here : http://www.rbogash.com/connie.html Scroll down.

In the future please post some pictures of your prototype aircraft when yopu ask for advice about how the model compairs with the prototype.

You should really have a spinner on the prop correctly spaced as you make decisions as to how it compairs. As you can see from the photos your cooling duct is sticking out way too far and the shape will be wrong as you pull it back and attach a spinner. I know how dificult it can be to "get it right". Been there and done that.

You are doing a great job so don't settle for less than correct.

George

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RE: Scratch building 105 - 5/25/2012 4:21 AM   
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Here are couple pics of my giant Concorde models presently under built with S Connie, this past long weekend i built it's right whole wing starting at Friday afternoon by cutting ribs and spars on Satruday, Sunday and Monday were dry assembly days, today i managed to get tail and aft fuselage dry assembled with rest of the airframe structure. Coming weekend i will be making left wing of her and then glue all parts of both wings together.

1/12th scale Concorde.
17 feet length
7 feet wing span
Propulsion: 4 x 90mm Freewing edf's with 1750KV motors on 6S
Estimated weight 25lbs to 27lbs RTF...

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RE: Scratch building 105 - 5/25/2012 4:28 AM   
Props4ever


 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: ampbomber

Sam,

Picture was found here : http://www.rbogash.com/connie.html Scroll down.

In the future please post some pictures of your prototype aircraft when yopu ask for advice about how the model compairs with the prototype.

You should really have a spinner on the prop correctly spaced as you make decisions as to how it compairs. As you can see from the photos your cooling duct is sticking out way too far and the shape will be wrong as you pull it back and attach a spinner. I know how dificult it can be to ''get it right''. Been there and done that.

You are doing a great job so don't settle for less than correct.

George



You have a very valid point George, i will do as you advised from now my friend. Yes fairing on my cowls are sticking out a lot then they should be, i will just use there half frontal part that will be butt joined to spinner's back plates on there back sides.

Yes i should technically make these cooling fairings from balsa block but after spending so much time already, i want to use something close enough and get the model done and look great....maybe i'm cheating but i'm sure you understand where im coming from...



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RE: Scratch building 105 - 5/25/2012 6:02 PM   
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WOW! Have you made headway with that model!!

I haven't been on RCU for a bit and I gotta tell ya, your model is really shaping up.

Kudos and good going!!

Charles

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RE: Scratch building 105 - 5/30/2012 7:41 AM   
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Avaiojet

Sam,

WOW! Have you made headway with that model!!

I haven't been on RCU for a bit and I gotta tell ya, your model is really shaping up.

Kudos and good going!!

Charles



Hey Charles,

Good to see you on here again and thanks for liking my progress and encouragement....

Here is what i am presently working one, basically splitting time between 2 major projects now that Connie is right around the corner from completion...




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RE: Scratch building 105 - 5/31/2012 1:42 AM   
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Status: offline 		Got my Carbon fibre cloth today, so ill be making dome pieces .starting tonite. I will also make one.remaining. lower
air intake scoop also. My MS 12x8 3blade props are on the way so i will now able to make atleast one full
cowling in this week hopefully.

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RE: Scratch building 105 - 5/31/2012 4:04 PM   
Props4ever


 

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Status: offline 		I didn't realized up till last night that i was out of working gloves til i set everything up and found that out, good that i didn't mixed the resin as it would have been wasted. Carbon i got is 5.8oz sq/in, so this should be more then enough to withstand any vibration, torque Rimfire 55 motors has to give plus would be very advocate to mount motors on it directly but i'll copulate plywood square to act as flat surface for motor mounts to be mounted on these domes...

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RE: Scratch building 105 - 6/1/2012 8:18 AM   
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Well here it is, first ever Carbon fibre dome piece made for this model!, 1 down 3 more to go.
I also made last lower scoop from Carbon Fibre, lets see if i could do the same for front section due to small, tight and complex mold...

This is first time ever i'm working with carbon, i like working with it but only problem i faced, cloths strands would move apart and make gaps in the cloth surface, this time i added small pieces to cover the gaps and also used lighter weight fibreglass cloth also to fill open gap areas. I would like someone on here who does work with carbon to advise me what i'm doing wrong in lay up procedure why strands tend to move apart on the wall's surface.

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RE: Scratch building 105 - 6/1/2012 10:59 AM   
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Status: offline 		Hi Sam,

My experience with CF cloth is that it does not take on small curves well. Tends to want to straighten itself out during curing. As for the strands seperating, the strands (called tow) are more loosly woven than glass cloth plus they are made out of thousands of fine filiments for each piece of tow. Possiby two layers of 2 oz CF cloth would have been a better choice.

Frankly, I don't mold anything from CF cloth that is small in size and has small curves because it requires constant attention untill the epoxy cures. It's a PITA!

This is my persnal opinion and others may have a different one.

George

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RE: Scratch building 105 - 6/1/2012 9:41 PM   
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Here are the parts pulled from the molds. I tell ya, pulling the dome piece wasn't easy task to do....but i got it out without damaging the mold. You will see, wet resin around the square section, i didn't thought to put bigger piece in the dome after layup to prevent big air gaps, but nit going to waste this piece, so i mixed bit of resin n applied it to those areas...hopefully this will do the trick...

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RE: Scratch building 105 - 6/1/2012 9:42 PM   
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Status: offline 		George, im running late for my company's seminar, ill get baick to u later tonite....

< Message edited by Props4ever -- 6/1/2012 10:33 PM >

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RE: Scratch building 105 - 6/1/2012 11:21 PM   
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I agree with Ampbomber Your using far heavier fabric than you need. I would think that using the two layers of the 2 oz fabric would be more than adequate. Keep in mind the carbon fiber is much stronger than the fiberglass to start with so you need a lot less.
As far as results you got working with carbon fiber cloth they are similar to what I have seen and not a lot to be alarmed about. It doesn't like to lay over curves well ,and because of the weave, it tends to separate along the edges much like you have seen even when not going over small radius curves. I think for the most part carbon fiber is used in conjunction with vacuum bagging when making up components with it. I of course have not tried that yet, but am thinking about it for a build I would like to do in the future. It's my understanding you can get a lot lighter weight out of the parts when you make up parts that way.
I would still recommend you check with the guy's in the composite forum, they could give you far better info than I could. I have to wonder if six or seven layers .2oz/ of omnidirectional carbon fiber veil (tissue) wouldn't work well fpr what you are doing.

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RE: Scratch building 105 - 6/2/2012 4:51 AM   
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Status: offline 		I do agree with you George, it should be made with 2oz cloth but to get that much i'm talking well over $100 per/sq yard!, i got hell of a deal on lots of 5.8 oz CF cloth so i bought this instead. Tows do tend to shift but i didn't had problem with getting it into tight spots or curves at all, it's not different then working with FG cloth. Plus these part prolly weight less then paper even!.

I'll try coulpe different tricks to see what works best for me and use that for the rest of CF use...

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RE: Scratch building 105 - 6/2/2012 6:12 AM   
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Status: offline 		Flash has been trimmed off from the back of the dome, dome has been dry fitted on the back of the main cowl piece, lower scoop is also dry assembled. Now you guys can see how full complete cowlings will look once all 4 are completed!....

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RE: Scratch building 105 - 6/3/2012 8:22 AM   
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Status: offline 		As i'm getting closer to finishing my S Constellation model, i have been recommended by few guys to hook up 2 left motors in opposite turning direction from right side!,. Meaning if one side it turning clockwise then opposite will turn anti-clock wise, plus props one side will be puller but otherside will use pusher props....

Does this makes sense as on actual Connies, all 4 engines turn in one direction...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=v3MBmS3APP0

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RE: Scratch building 105 - 6/4/2012 2:40 AM   
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RE: Scratch building 105 - 6/4/2012 3:33 AM   
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Status: offline 		counter rotating props will just cancel out much of the Torque and P-factor tendencies. They typically didn't use this technique much on Full-scale aircraft b/c it involves having to have different engine/prop combo's for each side of the airframe which = more money, especially if its just one aircraft that uses that particular prop/engine combo

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RE: Scratch building 105 - 6/4/2012 3:52 AM   
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Status: offline 		Hey Thomas,

You are right and i have already got this straighten out on another forum by guys flying 4 engine models. P-Factor and torque will not effect on planes with wing mounted engines specially with 4 engines as torque acts around the center line of the motor/s. Airplanes roll along the centerline of the fuselage. What is commonly called "torque" is actually P-factor, which only has an effect at high power settings, high angles of attack and low airspeed. And that's easily controlled.

< Message edited by Props4ever -- 6/4/2012 6:25 AM >

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