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ZDZ problem resolved

Old 08-24-2006, 11:04 AM
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texomalaser
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Default ZDZ problem resolved

See post number 23!!!! (Problem resolved)

I have had 2 ZDZ 80's. One super 80 and an RV. The first one was the RV engine. I flown it for about 3 monthes and it burned up. I sent it in and RC showcase said there was trash in the carb screen causing it to run lean and burn up. Funny thing is I run a filter on all my planes, and in my fuel jug. So I ate the repairs on this motor. While this motor was in the shop I ordered a new ZDZ Super 80. This motor never did run right and did weird things. I called numerous times to RC Showcase and they had no answers. They just kept telling me how good all the other motors have been running and there shouldnt be any problems with this engine. Well I finnaly got it through break in and it still never ran right but it was tollerable. But about the 7th gallon of fuel during flight the motor wouldnt idle down. And then the motor just seized up in flight. I deadsticked the plane and began taking the cowling off and thats when I noticed the block was cracked. I took the plane home and removed the engine and took pictures of it and sent it to RC Showcase. I got a reply and was told it was due to a foreign object being ingested throught the carb. I then called them and while i was on the phone I noticed then that the carb throttle butterfly/plate screw was missing. I was instructed to send the motor back in to RC Showcase for inspection. Later I called to see what was found and was told that the motor was a complete write off and ZDZ probably wouldnt warranty this. It was also noticed that the carb was removed and put back on by me which is true. The reason is because it is a rear carb and I have to do that for engine installation through firewall. But I never had to remove anyscrews but the main carb mount screws. Why would I have to remove the butterfly screws to do this? But it was made to sound like I had modified the carb becasue I removed it and I applied a little red RTV silicon on it for sealant. After all said and done the motor is coming back to me not warrantied. ZDZ would not warranty a screw coming out of there carb and destroying my engine? I have called other manufacturers and they said they would warranty such a thing. I was also told it was hard for ZDZ to warranty anything.
This is a big loss of money for a motor I had for only 4 weeks. I must say buyer beware of this brand of engine. They may run good when you get a good one but God forbid anything happen to it. They just wont stand behind ther product. Even though they give you 30 monthes warranty they wont honor it at all.

Sad pilot,
Scott S.

Old 08-24-2006, 11:20 AM
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rcbill
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Default RE: ZDZ GONE BAD!!!!!

So sorry to hear about your problems Scott. I don't own a ZDZ but whenever someone tells a tale like yours on these threads I keep it in mind for future purchases..... Bill
Old 08-24-2006, 12:48 PM
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Dangerous Dan
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Default RE: ZDZ GONE BAD!!!!!

Problem resolved see post 23

Scott you might add;

1. That you mounted the engine, started it and set it rich with 32-1 penzoil aircooled. Took the plane to the field and the ignition was faulty....
2. The engine did not have a manual in the box...
3. It ran like heck it would bog down when you pulled the nose up and speed up when you pointed the nose down.
4. You removed the engine to strengthen the firewall to possibly help this problem and when you reinstalled the carb the carb mounting screws stripped.
5. the carb spacer was warped
6. All modifications and adjustments were made per recomendations you recieved when you called RC Showcase multiple times.

Problem resolved see post 23
Old 08-24-2006, 01:02 PM
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Tired Old Man
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Default RE: ZDZ GONE BAD!!!!!

I've been following the history of the ZDZ and RC Showcase engine lines since they hit the market, and I'm sorry to say what you have experienced isand has been all too common. And yes, I have experience with both, up to the 215 radial.

I'm really sorry to hear the way they're making you take it in the shorts, and it sounds like it's time to make a change. It's for ceratin that this kind of customer treatment and testimonial reinforces my decision never to purchase another.

Dntmn,
Since I know your background, your update to texomalaser's efforts solidly reinforces his credibility. I'm guessing that you've been working on the issues with him where needed.
Old 08-24-2006, 01:04 PM
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wildchild45177
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Default RE: ZDZ GONE BAD!!!!!

If it bogged down and spead up depending on the attitude of the plane, then it was not adjusted properly, or had a problem in the first place. Either way it should have been sent back then, and possibly saved ruining it completely. I must say if that's the kind of customer service they provide, I will not buy their product.

Bob
Old 08-24-2006, 01:14 PM
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Dangerous Dan
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Default RE: ZDZ GONE BAD!!!!!

Problem resolved see post 23

ORIGINAL: wildchild45177

If it bogged down and spead up depending on the attitude of the plane, then it was not adjusted properly, or had a problem in the first place. Either way it should have been sent back then, and possibly saved ruining it completely.

Bob
Problem resolved see post 23

I agree completly, It did not come with a manual so it was a challenge to set the needles, three people tried and the problem got better but would not go away. If it had been sent in then it would have resolved the initial problems, but the carb screw would have likely still came off and toasted the engine. To RC Showcases sredit they did replace the faulty ignition. Scott an I travel to IMAC's together and when you send in an engine to have them troubleshoot a problem that only shows itself in the air you would likely be without an engine for 2 weeks or more.

Scotts origional ZDZ80RV got hot when there was not enough of an opening in the cowel, Lesson learned, Scott paid for these repairs.
The Super 80 had ample cooling and this was not the issue although RC showcase claimed that the engine was about to blow up anyway. If this is true it is not because of anything Scott did it is because of the problems the engine had from the get go.

Problem resolved see post 23
Old 08-24-2006, 01:54 PM
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RVM
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Default RE: ZDZ GONE BAD!!!!!

That's really ****ty of RCS. You should send them a link to this thread and let them know what their customer service is earning for their business.

Of course, I say this only hearing one side of the story. I'm sure RCS has their own side to take, but regardless, if all is as the original poster says, then RCS should have taken care of him. ZDZ engines aren't exactly cheap, and if something goes wrong one would expect that the problem would be taken care of.
Old 08-24-2006, 02:21 PM
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texomalaser
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Default RE: ZDZ GONE BAD!!!!!

See post number 23!!!!


Thanks for all that have replied..Its just the fact that with all the problems with the motor and now this, it would seem there would be some honor on ZDZ's part. But instead I have been made out to be the villan, just by by taking the carb off to install it on my plane. Not to note they also said it looked like it had been overheated also. Its like they are masking the problem and making it look like its all my fault. I have done everything right with this motor. I did temperature checks on this engine after a hard flight after it was broke in and it never got over 219 degrees. Thats the hottest it ever has been. I just cant seem to make these people understand that there is nothing i have done to cause any fault on my behalf. And I really hate having to write this thread in the forum but I feel people should know about this. I just cant stand behind ZDZ anymore after this. I will fly the old ZDZ Rv when it gets here after repair until I can sell it and get a new motor..Hmmmm.. Which brand will I choose? BME, DA, 3W ...I sure do like the way DNTMN motor runs and its a BME 110 extreme...And now they have the 115 Extreme. But that may be a little to much power for my airframe..But then again. I will be getting the new Wildhare Sukhoi soon hopefully...
This sux!!! But im not letting it ruin a wondefull Hobby I have enjoyed for over 20 years. I will just be more carefull next time when spending so much money on my hobby. It is just a hobby, right?

Scott S.
Old 08-24-2006, 03:19 PM
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Mike Dooley/RCS
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Default RE: ZDZ GONE BAD!!!!!

The bottom line and the fact is that the engine has ingested the throttle plate screw and destroyed the engine. The carb was removed and the phenolic carb block was reinstalled with improper gaskets and improper sealant. This totally blocked the pulse holes. How can the engine work properly? This most certainly would cause improper fuel delivery and a poor running engine. How can we possibly warrant a carb screw destroying the engine when we do not see this as a cammon failure mode? It is obvious the engine was taken apart and put back together improperly. We stand behind our product line 100% and of course will only do want is fair regarding warranty claims and repairs.
Old 08-24-2006, 03:28 PM
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Default RE: ZDZ GONE BAD!!!!!

There it it, Tex. Read it and weep.

That 115 will only require a little throttle management and the addition of a throttle curve in the transmitter to prevent pulling the wings off.

BTW, the 115 will balance in that new Sukhoi, just keep the rudder servo(s) and batteries as forward as the interior permits. I'm coming out pretty much on the money with the Brison and a dual rudder tray placed aft as you've already seen. A metal spinner would assure an easy balance. The most you will have to do is cut a new opening in the tray for the rudder servo. Piece of cake!
Old 08-24-2006, 03:31 PM
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Dangerous Dan
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Default RE: ZDZ GONE BAD!!!!!

Problem resolved see post 23

Scott did not take the throttle plate screw off,

Removing the carb in order to cut the opening in the firewall and set the standoff location and length should not void the warranty.

Using rtv instead odf a gasket had nothing to do with the throttle plate screw comming off and destroying the engine.

The engine did not run properly when the origional gasket was installed without the RTV.

He did nothing to void the warranty. I feel sorry for scott he saved for some time to buy this engine, and I talked him in to it

Sorry scott

Problem resolved see post 23
Old 08-24-2006, 03:38 PM
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Mike Dooley/RCS
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Default RE: ZDZ GONE BAD!!!!!

Unfortunately we see it differently and it was dissasembled and reassembled improperly. It is a fact.
Sorry we seem to be the bad guys here in this case.
Old 08-24-2006, 03:51 PM
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Default RE: ZDZ GONE BAD!!!!!

Mike,
Though I can see both sides of this problem, taking everything into consideration I don't see why you couldn't just bite the bullet and replace the engine. Using to much sealant and clogging the pulse hole will certaintly make the engine run poorly, if running at all, but I don't see how that would have anything to do with a part of the engine dislodging, getting ingested and ruining the engine. Perhaps a drop of loctite on that screw would be in order before mounting the carburetor.
DKjens
Old 08-24-2006, 04:08 PM
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Mike Dooley/RCS
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Default RE: ZDZ GONE BAD!!!!!

Bite the bullet? Really?
The engine costs us real money. That is why.
We cannot simply "Bite the Bullet" for something we feel is not warranty related that we cannot get replaced by the factory.
Old 08-24-2006, 04:08 PM
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Default RE: ZDZ GONE BAD!!!!!

You don't do yourself any favors when you irritate a regional C/D. You end up with a lot of negative milege.
Old 08-24-2006, 04:09 PM
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Default RE: ZDZ GONE BAD!!!!!

Mike,
I think that you are steping over a dollar to pickup a penny. It's your business decision.

Regards, Dave
Old 08-24-2006, 04:16 PM
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Default RE: ZDZ GONE BAD!!!!!


ORIGINAL: Mike Dooley/RCS

Bite the bullet? Really?
The engine costs us real money. That is why.
We cannot simply "Bite the Bullet" for something we feel is not warranty related that we cannot get replaced by the factory.
Fair enough. It seems there is some on both sides of this one. Mike, since there were some issues that are customer related (albeit, innocent from the sound of it) and an assembly issue with the screw that got into the motor, can't you guys meet in the middle and get Scott a new motor at cost or something similar? Seems fair to me and you are out no real $$$, while you get some better PR and customer satisfaction on the plus side.

As noted, it's your decision in the end.


Mark
Old 08-24-2006, 04:31 PM
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Mike Dooley/RCS
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Default RE: ZDZ GONE BAD!!!!!

Mark,
At this point I think to satify everyone involved and to keep us from looking like the bandits we are portrayed as, it is a viable solution. Of course we do not wish to step on anyones toes or get into a heated discussion that ends up going nowhere.
It makes no business sense. It is much too easy to get caught up in the back and forth discussions with people who do not fully understand the situation.
Old 08-24-2006, 04:45 PM
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Default RE: ZDZ GONE BAD!!!!!

Yay!


ORIGINAL: Mike Dooley/RCS

Mark,
At this point I think to satify everyone involved and to keep us from looking like the bandits we are portrayed as, it is a viable solution. Of course we do not wish to step on anyones toes or get into a heated discussion that ends up going nowhere.
It makes no business sense. It is much too easy to get caught up in the back and forth discussions with people who do not fully understand the situation.
Old 08-24-2006, 04:58 PM
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Default RE: ZDZ GONE BAD!!!!!

Tex,
Down here in Alamo City, we have an expression. WHAT COMES AROUND, GOES AROUND. Everytime a flyer asks about your ZDZ80, you will tell this story. Bad news dies hard.

Regards, Dave
Old 08-24-2006, 05:32 PM
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Dangerous Dan
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Default RE: ZDZ GONE BAD!!!!!

Problem resolved see post 23

Mike
I respect the fact that you are posting on here and trying to work out a resolution. I have seen both sides of this story and have worked with Scott quite a bit in trying to make this engine run correctly. In my humble opinion Scott did not do anything wrong he spent weeks trying to get this engine right, and you gave him a lot of phone support. Reguardless of all of this the throttle plate screw killed the engine. Any other discoveries you made on this engine that you feel may have voided the warranty was done as a result of troubleshooting and phone support due to the origional problems, which were never totally resolved. I am sure you will do what is right.

Problem resolved see post 23
Old 08-24-2006, 05:45 PM
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Default RE: ZDZ GONE BAD!!!!!

Good luck Scott..I hate to see this stuff happen..I know what it means to have to save up for stuff[:-]
Old 08-24-2006, 05:51 PM
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RVM
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Default RE: ZDZ GONE BAD!!!!!

I would like to add that Mike has been very professional in his posts. It can often be hard as a businessman/salesperson to be level headed in situations like this, and it says a lot about his character, in my opinion.

I do hope they can reach a solution on this. I think the suggestion that Scott be allowed to purchase a replacement engine at cost is an excellent idea.

ORIGINAL: Mike Dooley/RCS

Mark,
At this point I think to satify everyone involved and to keep us from looking like the bandits we are portrayed as, it is a viable solution. Of course we do not wish to step on anyones toes or get into a heated discussion that ends up going nowhere.
It makes no business sense. It is much too easy to get caught up in the back and forth discussions with people who do not fully understand the situation.
Old 08-24-2006, 05:57 PM
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texomalaser
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Default RE: ZDZ GONE BAD!!!!!

The problem has been resolved and I thank Mike Dooley for that......He is also going to bench run a new Super 80 before he sends it to me to make sure it is right...I think this is a lesson learned for all of us that anything can and will happen to a motor. As long as ZDZ stands behind there product I will stand behind them and fly there sticker on my plane proudly. I think we can all say that warranty issues are a nightmare on any product..Enough said.....Thanks all

Scott Shaffer
Old 08-24-2006, 05:59 PM
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RVM
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Default RE: ZDZ GONE BAD!!!!!

Excellent!


ORIGINAL: texomalaser

The problem has been resolved and I thank Mike Dooley for that......He is also going to bench run a new Super 80 before he sends it to me to make sure it is right...I think this is a lesson learned for all of us that anything can and will happen to a motor. As long as ZDZ stands behind there product I will stand behind them and fly there sticker on my plane proudly. I think we can all say that warranty issues are a nightmare on any product..Enough said.....Thanks all

Scott Shaffer

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