RE: Eletronic engine syncronizer **SUPPORT **  
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All Forums >> RC Airplanes >> Twin & Multi Engine RC Aircraft >> RE: Eletronic engine syncronizer **SUPPORT **
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RE: Eletronic engine syncronizer **SUPPOR... - 11/5/2007 12:56:50 PM   
yl5295


 

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From: Raleigh, NC
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Yes... Uker - the two glow drivers that are connected are connected correctly.

(in reply to UkerDuker)
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RE: Eletronic engine syncronizer **SUPPORT ** - 11/5/2007 1:00:11 PM   
yl5295


 

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Rick is correct. The only way you can use the magnets is if one is pointing north and one is pointing south. This way the sensor will only sense one rotation per rotation. If they both are pointing the same direction then anything other than 180 deg will definitely NOT work. The Twinsync calculates the time per rotation so if they are not 180 deg it will get a high then a low RPM and be very confused.

(in reply to jbwilhelmi)
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RE: Eletronic engine syncronizer **SUPPO... - 11/5/2007 1:08:37 PM   
yl5295


 

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Guys,

I just had a customer find an interesting issue with a specific receiver. The Futaba 148DP and 149DP put power to the servos for a while before it starts providing a signal. Most servos don't move if power is applied with no signal but some will go to the lock.

Anyway the twinsync declares failsafe and moves the servos to idle after 0.25 seconds of no signal. It returns control of the servos after 0.125 seconds of a good signal. Therefore if you have servos that are faster than 0.25 sec with this receiver it is possible that they may move to their stops at power on and then back to where they should be when the receivers starts outputting a signal. I have updated the firmware to power up the twinsync in failsafe (servos at idle). Once the Twinsync gets receiver a signal for 0.125 secs control is passed to the tx/rx. This will prevent servos from moving while the receiver is powering up.

I believe that this is also been observed on a JR ZPCM receiver also.

(in reply to yl5295)
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RE: Eletronic engine syncronizer **SUPPOR... - 11/5/2007 9:34:16 PM   
jbwilhelmi


 

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Thanks Rick. Magnets are 180 degrees apart I believe. Going from memory at work.
Jack

(in reply to 2engsout)
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RE: Eletronic engine syncronizer **SUPPOR... - 11/7/2007 2:33:30 AM   
Bo Ingram


 

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Bill,

You have helped me with the problems I am having. I was the user that had the Multiplex EVO and you supplied a new chip with the proper frame rate. Now another issue.

When hooked up per instructions, I was getting a dim green light on engine 1 (J1) and a brighter green light when I tested the magnet. Nothing I did corrected it.

But, when I reversed the lead and put the black wire on the board toward the IC and the orange wire outboard, it works just fine. Could the board have been soldered in reverse by accident.

Also, I am using the diametric mags and it does not seem to matter which way the orientation is.

Thanks for your help....your observations?

Bo

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RE: Eletronic engine syncronizer **SUPPO... - 11/7/2007 2:54:50 AM   
yl5295


 

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The good news is:

No it is not possible that anything on the board is hooked up backwards. They are tested to 99%.

What is possible is that the sensor was soldered onto the wire backwards. They are all supposed to be tested too so please let me know if that is the case. When the writing on the sensor is facing toward you the colors of wire that should be connected to it are red, brown orange from left to right while holding the sensor up with the wire below it.

I expect that if you are using diametric magnets you probably have an alignment problem with the magnets. Please retest with the spinner mounted flat magnets. If those work correctly then you probably have the rotation of the diametrics wrong. This would explain the dim led. You must rotate the diametric magnets correctly in the hole or you will get bad results. A good trick a customer taught me was to use a second magnet to rotate the diametric magnets in their hole before glueing them.

(in reply to Bo Ingram)
       Post #: 456

RE: Eletronic engine syncronizer **SUPPO... - 11/7/2007 2:57:43 AM   
yl5295


 

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QUESTION FOR THREAD FOLLOWERS:

I am getting a lot of inquires about using the sensors with the flywheel mounted magnets in the Evolution 26. I know that it has two magnets mounted 90 deg apart. Has anyone tried using the sensors with the flywheel magnets and are they point opposite or the same direction?

Thanks in advance for any replies...

< Message edited by yl5295 -- 11/7/2007 2:58:16 AM >

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RE: Eletronic engine syncronizer **SUPPO... - 11/7/2007 5:50:08 AM   
2engsout


 

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Hi Bill, I looked at a 26, 2 weeks ago and did not actually test the magnets on the twin sync hall sensor, but, I would assume that both magnets would have to be North to talk to the ignition sensor. I would also assume that as the propdriver rotates past the ignition sensor, it ignores the first magnet when you flip it over and reads the 2nd magnet polorization to create the spark, at which the piston is now within 2 degrees before top dead center, which makes for an easy starting engine. I would next assume that at aprox 2500 rpms, the ignition module THEN starts to read the 1st magnet polorization it sees, and electroniclly advances the timing to full advance. That timing curve is programmed into the module , but not published. Most 2 stroke engines have 28-32 degrees at full advance. Even though the 1st magnet passes the sensor approx 90 degrees before top dead center, the module compensates for this. If you dont want to use a spinner on the prop, and dont want a backplate of any type behind the prop to hold the magnets, the only concievable way I know to get the twin sync to work on the 26 is to use a diametric magnet mounted in the prop hub opposite the ignition magnets, with the South pole outboard from crank centerline, so it will NOW polorize the OTHER SIDE (side opposite from the side with the writing on it) of the twin sync hall sensor, and NOT effect the ignition hall sensor. THEN, you could mount the twin sync hall sensor on the opposite side of the engine case from the ignition hall sensor. This ONLY works IF, the twin sync polorization magnets are opposite poles from the ignition magnet poles, AND there is NO RF leakage emmiting from the ignition hall sensor lead to send false signals to the twin sync hall sensor, AND, the spark plug high tension lead is suffiently shielded for RF. This theory would have to be tested to be conclusive either way. If there is leakage, then you could shield BOTH hall sensor leads. The ignition lead, all the way to the module, and the twin sync lead, at least 12" past the module on its jouney back to the twin sync unit. My recommendation, if you dont use a spinner on your prop, then use a 3/32" thick aluminum backplate behind the prop approx 1.5" bigger in dia. than the propdriver to mount the twin sync magnet. Then use a hardwood 3/8" x 3/8" standoff bolted to the engine mount rail to hold the hall sensor in place with a 1/16" air gap. Rick Simmons

(in reply to yl5295)
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RE: Eletronic engine syncronizer **SUPPO... - 11/7/2007 1:39:40 PM   
Bo Ingram


 

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Bill,

To clarify, J1 and J2 when connected per the instructions left LED 2 working OK, but LED 1 glowed dimly and would brighten when the magner was passed by it.

On J1, when I hook it up with the orange wire outboard and the black inboard, everything works OK. Perhaps I wired the extension backward, but is buried in the wing and I can't check it without major disasssembly.

I am unclear re: diametric mags. They seem to light up the LED's from either end.

The sensors are soldered properly per your instructions.

Thanks for your help...

Bo

(in reply to yl5295)
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RE: Eletronic engine syncronizer **SUPPO... - 11/7/2007 2:21:25 PM   
yl5295


 

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I am concerned that you are not using the diametrics correctly. email me your phone #. Let's talk for a couple of minutes. That is the fastest way to get to the bottom of this.

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RE: Eletronic engine syncronizer **SUPPO... - 11/8/2007 5:09:49 AM   
2engsout


 

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Hi Guys, I guess I should have included this pic along with my explanation. The diametric magnets are cylinder shaped and have the north - south poles on each half LENTHWISE. Like cutting a pie in half. The left half is north and the right half is south. To test the ign magnets on the 26, pass the twin sync hall sensor across both magnets with the side that the writing is on and see if the LED's light up on the twin sync unit. Lets say that they do. Now, you will rotate the diametric magnet untill you find the half that lights up the LED's on the twin sync unit. Mark that half with a red ink pen. That is the half that will face the crank centerline as it is pushed into the prop driver. Now simply mount the twin sync hall sensor with the writing NOT facing the magnet. It should now light up the twin sync LED. Bill will have to confirm this procedure, but I think it should work. Rick

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RE: Eletronic engine syncronizer **SUPPO... - 11/8/2007 4:33:27 PM   
rchotrod



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I am getting started on a build of an ASM C-130. I think this twinsync would be a good idea at least on the outboard pair of engines. Has the 4 engine version been worked out?

Engines will be the OS 25fx glow. I want to use sport digital servos for the throttles. Maybe even mini digitals to save some weight. Will they work with the twinsync ok? I like the digitals for throttle because they seem to have finer trim points for setting up throttle arm throws.

I am currently using two of the os25's on a smaller C-160 twin. I can't remember the peak rpm as I was more concerned with getting the mechanical set-ups as close as possible. And getting reliable idles and transitions to full power. By the way I am spinning 9-5 props on the C-160 and may go to 9-6 on the C-130.

Thanks, just getting started with the project and getting as much info I can before hand.

See ya,
Rod

(in reply to 2engsout)
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RE: Eletronic engine syncronizer **SUPPO... - 11/8/2007 4:44:39 PM   
yl5295


 

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The four engine unit has been ready and shipping for a while. Several in the field being flown on C130s and B17s. I only sell the four engine unit direct. Email me at billw@nc.rr.com and I will send you more info.

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RE: Eletronic engine syncronizer **SUPPO... - 11/8/2007 5:19:38 PM   
rchotrod



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Ok thanks. I am a long ways from installing engines so I will contact you then.

So there is no problem with the digital servos? That way I can buy the servos I need when I get to that point. What are the rpm limits on the sync?

See ya,
Rod

(in reply to yl5295)
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RE: Eletronic engine syncronizer **SUPPO... -