Schulze Future 32.80KA F3A

Schulze Future 32.80KA F3A
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Schulze Future 32.80KA F3A - 9/7/2006 9:48:41 AM

Sprink

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I flew my new Genesis yesterday (though only one flight unfortunately). It is powered by a Pletti Extra 30-10 Evo and a Schulze Future 32.80KA F3A. I am running TP Prolite 6000s in 10S.

I have a couple of questions on the esc about the set up. At the moment I don't have the proportional brake on, or so I believe, it is set to 0. I am assuming that you set the brake to 1 to get it to do the proportional braking?

The main problem is that the throttle control and curve was very wierd. I am using a Futaba ZAP. I reversed the trottle, and set the ATVs at 100% as per the instructions. However virtually all the power is in the top half of the stick travel, with the motor coming to a halt at little below half throttle. To get something like a decent throttle curve for the first flight, I reduced the bottom end ATV to 50% and put in positive exponetial of 40%. Is this normal, or is something wrong? Will this change if I go to the proportional braking set up, should I go back to 100% ATV when I change over? Any help on your set ups would be appreciated.

One other thing, the controller had regular problems identifying the correct direction of travel, with the motor stuttering, before grinding to a halt. I would not expect that on such a high end controller, does anyone else experience this with this set up? I have the timing on Hard and 9khz as per the instructions.

Cheers
Nick

_____________________________

"If it doesn't break, it is probably too heavy"

Post #: 1

RE: Schulze Future 32.80KA F3A - 9/7/2006 3:16:20 PM

Adamg-RCU

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From: Saskatoon, SK, CANADA
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Middle of throttle is actually zero throttle.
something like 120% in downward throttle direction is full brake.
everything below middle is proportional brake
everything above middle is proportional throttle
something like 120% in upward thorttle direction is full throttle.
With top-half throttle set to 100%, you were not at full throttle.

I was flying with something like 50% downwards travel and 135% upwards travel (JR 10X, which goes to 150%). Full brake is too much.

I suggest enabling the brake on the switches. if I recall correctly, switch 1 is on, the rest are off.

To make this feel like a normal throttle, you will have to put in a throttle curve that is extremely steep for the bottom ~ 1/4 stick of throttle. On the ground, the motor should engage at 1/4 throttle, approximately.

This controller is very bad is starting the EVO and Xtra 25-13. A few techniques I tried including leaving the throttle on the first throttle setting that engages the ESC (success starts about 20% of attempts), and continuing to throttle up while it was trying to start the motor (success 40% of time).

(in reply to Sprink)

Post #: 2

RE: Schulze Future 32.80KA F3A - 9/7/2006 10:16:00 PM

mola

Posts: 166
Joined: 7/26/2002
From: Henne, DENMARK
Status: offline

Hi Nick,

I'm using this combo (EVO and 32.80KA) as well, but I haven't had issues with starting the motor. Just advance the throttle slowly to start the motor turning and you should be fine. Don't floor it immediately, or the ESC could have trouble "sensing" the rotational field of the motor. At the EC in Switzerland last week I noticed one guy having trouble starting an outrunner, who actually spun the prop with his hands (like starting an IC engine) to get it turning and then he advanced the throttle stick slightly immediately afterwards... This worked for him.

I have attached a picture of my throttle curve (T14MZ) to get you started, you will notice that it is very steep at the beginning like Adam said. This is due to the fact that the software used in the Schulze F3A ESC's is actually from the car guys, who have neutral at middle stick, thats why we have to make a throttle curve looking a little steep in the beginning...

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_____________________________

Best regards,
Morten Laugesen

(in reply to Sprink)

Post #: 3

RE: Schulze Future 32.80KA F3A - 9/8/2006 3:31:12 AM

can773

Posts: 1603
Joined: 1/25/2002
From: Calgary, AB, CANADA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sprink

I flew my new Genesis yesterday (though only one flight unfortunately). It is powered by a Pletti Extra 30-10 Evo and a Schulze Future 32.80KA F3A. I am running TP Prolite 6000s in 10S.

I have a couple of questions on the esc about the set up. At the moment I don't have the proportional brake on, or so I believe, it is set to 0. I am assuming that you set the brake to 1 to get it to do the proportional braking?

The main problem is that the throttle control and curve was very wierd. I am using a Futaba ZAP. I reversed the trottle, and set the ATVs at 100% as per the instructions. However virtually all the power is in the top half of the stick travel, with the motor coming to a halt at little below half throttle. To get something like a decent throttle curve for the first flight, I reduced the bottom end ATV to 50% and put in positive exponetial of 40%. Is this normal, or is something wrong? Will this change if I go to the proportional braking set up, should I go back to 100% ATV when I change over? Any help on your set ups would be appreciated.

One other thing, the controller had regular problems identifying the correct direction of travel, with the motor stuttering, before grinding to a halt. I would not expect that on such a high end controller, does anyone else experience this with this set up? I have the timing on Hard and 9khz as per the instructions.

Cheers
Nick

Nick

On a ZAP the ATV's should be set to around 115-120 to get full range at both ends. Set to 100% you are likely way down on power. The lower end is not as critical because the amount you set it at determines the brake force and you adjust that as you go.

Use a throttle curve that looks like Morten's, its been my experience that all the Schulze's brake or not need this curve to get a good linear response. I also setup a dial to adjust the lower end of the throttle curve so that I have easy adjustment of the brake while in flight etc. Just activate the VOL and assign a dial and direction, you will see the knob move the curve if its working. Whatever you do leave the ATV's set as above and use the throttle curve to adjust response and brake force. Schulze recommends using sub trim to affect the neutral point (between power and brake) but I have not tried doing it that way....it may result in a more straight curve if you do...might be worth playing with.

For the DIL switches, its not really intuitive....#1 is ON and the rest are OFF. #1 is the proportional brake....ON turns it on, OFF leaves it as a freewheeling prop.

The start....its a bit of a pain. For whatever reason this controller has this problem, I have told Schulze about it and hopefully its been corrected. I find aggressively blurping the throttle kicks it in the right direction very quickly and nearly 100% of the time, I rarely have a problem getting the motor spinning using that technique.

_____________________________

Chad Northeast

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Post #: 4

RE: Schulze Future 32.80KA F3A - 9/8/2006 9:10:28 AM

Malcolm H

Posts: 269
Joined: 10/24/2002
From: glasgow, UNITED KINGDOM
Status: online

So if the problem has been corrected how does one update the firmware in an existing controller?

Malcolm

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Post #: 5

RE: Schulze Future 32.80KA F3A - 9/8/2006 3:20:52 PM

Sprink

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From: London, UNITED KINGDOM
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Thanks Morten and Chad. I will have a fiddle at the field tomorrow. I have set up throttle curves before on electrics so know how to do it. Will copy Mortens curve and start from there. When I flew the plane on Wednesday, it did not seem to be lacking in power, so would be interesting to see what increasing the ATV to 120 will do!

Malcolm, I doubt that schulze has managed to upgrade their programmes yet, as mine is brand new - I only recived the motor and esc from Plettenberg about three weeks ago, and it was delayed as Pletti were waiting for a new supply of escs from Schulze.

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"If it doesn't break, it is probably too heavy"

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Post #: 6

RE: Schulze Future 32.80KA F3A - 9/8/2006 10:05:57 PM

can773

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From: Calgary, AB, CANADA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sprink

Thanks Morten and Chad. I will have a fiddle at the field tomorrow. I have set up throttle curves before on electrics so know how to do it. Will copy Mortens curve and start from there. When I flew the plane on Wednesday, it did not seem to be lacking in power, so would be interesting to see what increasing the ATV to 120 will do!

Malcolm, I doubt that schulze has managed to upgrade their programmes yet, as mine is brand new - I only recived the motor and esc from Plettenberg about three weeks ago, and it was delayed as Pletti were waiting for a new supply of escs from Schulze.

I have ATV'd mine back to 110 because I found it easy to come screaming over the top of things with too much speed

Thats unfortunate they have not addressed the startup issue yet, I sent out a note to Pletty and Schulze probably a week after I got the motor (early July), and had hoped they would have addressed it by now. Guess I may have to bug them some more about it!

_____________________________

Chad Northeast

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Post #: 7

RE: Schulze Future 32.80KA F3A - 9/9/2006 5:34:04 AM

Pattern_is_Fun

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From: San Jose, CA, USA
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Man Nick, I spent a week in London not long ago and I would have given a lot to see a flying field over there and watch some pattern! Next time, I contact you before hand. We need to tell my wife that the site is a national church for the pattern gods!

Scott

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Post #: 8

RE: Schulze Future 32.80KA F3A - 9/11/2006 10:07:58 PM

Sprink

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Well my first comp yesterday, and the controller lost me some points. On some of the downlines the proportional brake was stopping the prop completely, and when restarting it went through this start up problem again. Not a pleasent experience when flying and trying to compete.

obviously I need to set it so that it doesn't stop, but I am starting to wonder if I should just turn the brake off. However without it, it rather defeats the purpose of buying that controller.

Hmmm

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Post #: 9

RE: Schulze Future 32.80KA F3A - 9/11/2006 10:38:20 PM

can773

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Wow, I have yet to ever stop the prop in flight....are you sure that your DIL switches are setup correct and you dont have the conventional brake turned on?

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Chad Northeast

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Post #: 10

RE: Schulze Future 32.80KA F3A - 9/12/2006 4:28:25 AM

can773

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Sprink

Here is my exact setup in a 9Z WC2.

ATV - 120% Rate A, 110-120% Rate B (120 is full throttle I have found).

Throttle Trim setting (TRM menu) - 50% below mid point, reads +50 on my Tx.

Make sure you activate your throttle curve, the point values are as follows.

1 - 0
2 - 38
3 - 50
4 - 55
5 - 59
6 - 64
7 - 69
8 - 73
9 - 78
10 - 82
11 - 88
12 - 93
13 - 100

D button sets the Low which is set to 80%, the dial is set to a value of +75% (that is the value in the brackets)....corresponds to about 1.5 to the right side of zero on the dial. The dial is how I affect the brake strength. Activate a dial by going to VOL, then H for left dial. Set the dial value to negative. That will give less brake when turning clockwise and vice versa.

The brake strength can be affected by either throttle trim level or the dial, so play with them until you have a point on the dial at which you have a decent range of adjustment for your flying style.

If you want to get creative you could use the sub trim to offset the neutral point, that would flatten out the throttle curve a bit and give you some more resolution for the low end. I dont feel its needed though.

Let me know how it goes.

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Chad Northeast

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Post #: 11

RE: Schulze Future 32.80KA F3A - 9/12/2006 9:14:34 AM

Sprink

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Chad, I had set my own throttle curve, had come to very similar settings to you (within 1 or 2 points). I have now set the other settings as you suggest.

Is normal brake an option on the controller? I have set all the switches to zero except the brake switch (switch 3) which is set to 1. Is this correct? Easy to change if not.

Thanks
Nick

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"If it doesn't break, it is probably too heavy"

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Post #: 12

RE: Schulze Future 32.80KA F3A - 9/12/2006 1:58:25 PM

can773

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Ahhhh! Yes normal brake is an option, I forget the DIL but 3 might be it

You want #1 on for land mode which engages the proportional brake and all the other DIL's should be off.

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Chad Northeast

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Post #: 13

RE: Schulze Future 32.80KA F3A - 9/12/2006 2:02:03 PM

Harry Ells

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From: Cobourg, ON, CANADA
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Hi Nick

This is the setup that Chad gave me and I find it works well. The only switch that is in the "on" position is switch # 1.

Regards
Harry

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Post #: 14

RE: Schulze Future 32.80KA F3A - 9/13/2006 4:33:29 PM

Sprink

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