RE: Never play chicken with a bomber*video*  
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RE: Never play chicken with a bomber*video* - 9/29/2006 9:02:34 AM   
KiwiKid



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Joined: 2/7/2005
From: Hamilton, NEW ZEALAND
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quote:

ORIGINAL: graze420

All i can say is im glad no one was hurt, that could have been a lot worse.Notice the face plant rams did, your lucky your nose didnt get broken or something, or that you lost your grip on your friend.It would have been tragic had you pulled him into the path of that prop.

Absolutely Graze, a flyer at a local club nearly died recently after being hit by a trainer. I thought it would be worth repeating an article in the club newsletter here to show what we can be dealing with.
"It happened at the Mercer field on a splendid Sunday a few weeks ago. A novice flier flew his landing plane into Brian's right upper arm and knocked him over. The wing also caught him in the lower back on that side.
Apparently the two observers weren't doing a good job and Brian shouldn't have been where he was flying his plane. There were medics present as there were parachute jumps going on, so help was quickly on hand.
An ambulance took him first to the local A & E and after X-ray of the arm (fracture) and a plaster there was a long wait for another ambulance. The accident happened around 11am and he finally made it to the City Hosp. around 3pm. While they were attending to his arm he was complaining about the pain in his ribs but the doctors wanted to get the arm wound washed out first.
When he turned a whitish shade of pale and starting to talk rubbish, his wife suggested they check his blood pressure, NOW!! Well, when they couldn’t actually find a blood pressure, things certainly started to happen then and they were a great team. 12 units of blood and various clotting agents later they had him stabilized enough to do a scan and found rather a large bleed in his chest.
Eventually he was sent to Critical Care and three days later he was transferred to an orthopaedic ward. He had two more trips to theatre to wash the wound under general anaesthetic and was released after a two week stay"
Once home he was still a sick puppy for two weeks, so was out of action for four weeks.
All due to a moments forgetfulness in not leaving the strip after takeoff and a bit of a slip up on the part of the other pilot and the observers. Lets be careful out there.




< Message edited by KiwiKid -- 9/29/2006 9:04:46 AM >


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RE: Never play chicken with a bomber*video* - 9/29/2006 2:23:43 PM   
GeneG



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From: Yardville, NJ, USA
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I had no intention of replying in this thread but your post just struck a nerve. As much as it pains you to believe, most of the observations made here by other members are accurate. Aside from the childish name calling, most people posting here are correct about what they are saying.

You're right, nobody here knows you or the pilot but they are not talking about YOU or HIM, they are talking about your behavior on the field. The video clearly shows that.

Your defense to your actions is to explain to us how the pilot has 20 years experience and is a great pilot. How he is an excellent builder and great club member. I'm sure you are right he is all those things. However, they is absolutly no excure for your actions regardless of who you are. It's AMAZING to me that you are telling fellow modelers that they have no right speaking out about the stupidity on display in that video because the pilot has 20 years experience. He may be a great pilot but I wouldn't ask either one of you to speak on safety.

It is exactly that 20 years of experience that convinced you and him that there was no danger in standing on the runway. Hell, the pilot has 20 years experience what could go wrong! The rules are in place to prevent ACCIDENTS! As I'm sure you now know. Of course he wasn't trying to land into the both of you however the situation got out of control and there was an accident. That is exactly why there are pilot stations. We need to control the environment as much as we can and be as safe as possible.

I am glad you are both OK. However, answer one quesiton. Why were you both ON the runway. I for one cannot come up with ONE reason that you should have been.



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RE: Never play chicken with a bomber*video* - 9/29/2006 4:03:26 PM   
Wings of Peril


 

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OK, now this thread has ceased to be entertaining. All I see now is a bunch of guys who weren’t at the crash site making judgments and laying down a lot of rules. Now you’re patting each other on the back for being masters of the obvious. OK, we shouldn’t stand on runway, ever! I get it now. Why don’t we make a whole list of no-brainers starting with this tidbit, Now, lets add rangerstl’s bullet points and end with perhaps “never stick your finger into the path of a rotating propeller”? Now, just to make the list worthwhile, let’s add a post-script, “Do everything possible to avoid injury to yourself and others”. Then, I could feature that.

This crash has a (somewhat) clear series of events and most of the “what-ifs” you geniuses are coming up with have more to do with the avoidance of these than the actual crash. Most RC’ers routinely make corrections in reaction to situations and save the model. If we crashed every time we had a problem, I don’t think this hobby would exist. Hell, I reckon my predicament to crash ratio is about 100:1. One of these events, such as the engine flame-out could be the root cause, but not necessarily the real or final cause. Yes, the avoidance of any of these events could have saved the model and diminished the threat to life and limb but in this case, the model was almost on the ground safely and from the clip, it’s not 100% clear that the model could not have stayed on course and landed safely while missing the humans. I'll concede that the plane could have been on a direct course to hit these guys because it appears that there was a ditching or a go-around attempt that went wrong and made matters worse-and that could be the real, final cause of the crash. With that being said, I do agree that no matter where these guys were stationed, or what thier reasons are for standing there, they attempted to land too close to themselves to allow for further errors in judgment or equipment malfunctions-for whatever reason.

AT the risk of stating the obvious, you guys who like to play NTSB investigator should remember the real differences between model flying and the transport of humans. With full-scale, every attempt is made and every expense is paid to avoid predicaments. Not so with models. We don’t have control towers or teams of maintenance professionals with reliability analysis programs. We just try to do our best and have fun. We’re encouraged to develop our skills to the point where we’re thinking ahead and our actions are predictive but we should not become robots and diminish our reactive abilities. We’ll need them. Whatever your skill level is, you are not immune to a case of dumb thumbs or a sense of panic. No matter how deep your pockets are, you’re not immune to equipment failure. Every time we maiden a new model, get distracted, fly with other models in the air, or try a new maneuver, we put the aircraft at risk. Let’s just be sure we do everything possible to avoid injury to yourself and others.

(in reply to Arrow IV)
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RE: Never play chicken with a bomber*video* - 9/29/2006 4:50:51 PM   
Brineymolly



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RE: Never play chicken with a bomber*video* - 9/29/2006 4:53:24 PM   
Arrow IV


 

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Hey Wings,

"WHAT IF" you just stayed off the end of the runway?????????



PS My NTSB clearance # is: 29778462579921349738941276949852865485724887121458728884527585

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RE: Never play chicken with a bomber*video* - 9/29/2006 4:56:07 PM   
CorsairJock



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quote:

ORIGINAL: Wings of Peril
OK, now this thread has ceased to be entertaining. All I see now is a bunch of guys who weren’t at the crash site making judgments and laying down a lot of rules. Now you’re patting each other on the back for being masters of the obvious.
...................................................


I didn't realize the main purpose of this thread was "to be entertaining", altho it is obvious that some thought it to be that way.
I think the purpose of threads like these should be educational. Learn from your mistakes, AND learn from the mistakes of others. Threads like these should ultimately result in preventing others from making the same mistakes.
And what is obvious to some, is not so obvious to others, which is why some of us feel the need to explain it to others.
Just my 'expert' opinion (been accused of refeing to myself as an expert so many times, figured I might as well actually do it).

< Message edited by CorsairJock -- 9/29/2006 5:10:25 PM >


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RE: Never play chicken with a bomber*video* - 9/29/2006 6:09:09 PM   
Bruno Stachel



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I'll just say this. Ramms1 and his friend should not have been standing where they were. The video is an illustration of what not to do. But I and everyone else here is not without sin. Sorry to see you burn like this Ramms1.

And I wonder who shot and put the video on the web? A friend of Ramms1? I don't think I'd like to be embarrassed like that without being asked permission. I suppose no permission is legally needed. Makes me think twice about flying when someone is running a camera. I consider myself a safe pilot. But what if I you-know-what the pooch while someone's shooting! I guess it's part of the times to get used to.

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RE: Never play chicken with a bomber*video* - 9/29/2006 6:26:15 PM   
Wings of Peril


 

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Hey Arrow,
"What if" I don’t play kamikaze and use myself for a target!
There are plenty of electric powered planes and helicopters for that purpose!

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RE: Never play chicken with a bomber*video* - 9/29/2006 7:32:52 PM   
ramcfarland



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Edit


< Message edited by ramcfarland -- 10/13/2006 10:07:25 PM >


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RE: Never play chicken with a bomber*video* - 9/29/2006 7:58:22 PM   
Liberator


 

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Brineymolly,

Nice job

Tom

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RE: Never play chicken with a bomber*video* - 9/29/2006 8:39:58 PM   
ArmedZagi



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I love how the guy in the white shirt pulled the pilot INTO the path of the plane....

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RE: Never play chicken with a bomber*video* - 9/29/2006 8:58:34 PM   
ArCeeFlyer



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Arrow IV: Hey Wings,
"WHAT IF" you just stayed off the end of the runway?????????

Wings of Peril: Hey Arrow,
"What if" I don’t play kamikaze and use myself for a target!

Isn't that what Arrow meant?

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RE: Never play chicken with a bomber*video* - 9/29/2006 9:13:23 PM   
Flak


 

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I guess the feller in the blue shirt didn't want to go swimmin....mayber the pool was too crowded...LMAO!!!

OK guys, we have all seen the video and we all know what happened. I don't see the point in going to a war of words or fists over it.
Let's get back to our modeling and have a good, but safe time. I have a Ziroli B-25J Mitchell in the finishing stages at this time. I am anxious to get her in the air! This weekend should be the maiden of my T/F C-47. Yes, I'll have a video. I'll try to smile for the camera.

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RE: Never play chicken with a bomber*video* - 9/29/2006 9:36:48 PM   
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