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RE: Falcon 40 (Exceed heli) Forum - 5/8/2008 4:11:47 PM   
broggyr



Posts: 475
Joined: 1/22/2007
From: Naugatuck, CT, USA
Status: offline 		Woohoo UTM, way to go! I just started trying side-ins myself, I am still at the try-until-i-need-to-spin-tail-in-again stage...

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(in reply to Great_life)
       Post #: 5726

RE: Falcon 40 (Exceed heli) Forum - 5/8/2008 5:32:55 PM   
dknovick



Posts: 590
Joined: 1/19/2005
From: Albuquerque, NM, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: helojerry

Interesting. I finally took my new lipo down to where the heli would not lift off the ground. It measured 9.25 v no load of course.

Jerry

I'm at 6000ft altitude, so I need to beat the thin air harder to get off the ground. If you're up to it, I'd be interested in hearing how consistent that voltage is. That way I'd know if it was "safe" to recommend flying the pack "into the ground" at lower altitudes.

-Dave


< Message edited by dknovick -- 5/8/2008 5:39:24 PM >

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What goes up, most come down. How hard depends on you!

(in reply to helojerry)
       Post #: 5727

RE: Falcon 40 (Exceed heli) Forum - 5/8/2008 5:38:13 PM   
dknovick



Posts: 590
Joined: 1/19/2005
From: Albuquerque, NM, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: UTM

Evening all! Hope all are well.

Wanted to share a bit about a personal milestone I reached tonight. I managed to hover a full pack side-in Been working on side in hovers now for a couple of weeks and tonight it clicked. I was in full control and never swung the tail in for a full 10:41 sec flight. Actually I should say it was left side in. I am still working on right in.

Awesome! I'm at a point where I can swing it left-in or right-in without it getting wild on me. I find it was easier to take 45 degree steps. Tail in, then +- 45 degrees, then +- 90 degrees to where I'm now at +-135 degrees (for less then a minute).

-Dave


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What goes up, most come down. How hard depends on you!

(in reply to UTM)
       Post #: 5728

RE: Falcon 40 (Exceed heli) Forum - 5/8/2008 6:33:21 PM   
UTM


 

Posts: 195
Joined: 3/11/2008
From: Indianapolis, IN, USA
Status: offline
quote:

I'm at 6000ft altitude, so I need to beat the thin air harder to get off the ground. If you're up to it, I'd be interested in hearing how consistent that voltage is. That way I'd know if it was "safe" to recommend flying the pack "into the ground" at lower altitudes.

-Dave


Afternoon all.

I will start by saying that I am in Indiana and we are no higher than 750 above sea. I will always fly my packs into the ground. Have been doing so even with the CX2 before the Falcon. With the Falcon it will fly basically all the way until it just can't but will set in ground effect for about 30 more seconds. I will continue to run it until the skids touch the floor and almost without fail my voltage in 2s lipos will end at about 6.9v or 3.45v per cell this ends up getting me right aroun 11 min+- flight time with 900mamp batts. The CX2 always falls at around 7.0v with the same cells. So I would say that at lower altitudes running the pack until the bird just wont fly anymore is plenty safe. I don't usually run timers for when I should stop and simply fly it out. When I get outside I will have to because I wouldnt' want to have to walk forever to get my bird after it didn't have the juice to make it back.

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I''m addicted...2 packs a day!

(in reply to Great_life)
       Post #: 5729

RE: Falcon 40 (Exceed heli) Forum - 5/8/2008 6:49:31 PM   
UTM


 

Posts: 195
Joined: 3/11/2008
From: Indianapolis, IN, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: broggyr

Woohoo UTM, way to go! I just started trying side-ins myself, I am still at the try-until-i-need-to-spin-tail-in-again stage...

quote:

Awesome! I'm at a point where I can swing it left-in or right-in without it getting wild on me. I find it was easier to take 45 degree steps. Tail in, then +- 45 degrees, then +- 90 degrees to where I'm now at +-135 degrees (for less then a minute).

-Dave


Thanks all! I usually can get 30 sec at a time right in but am still working on it. I think I will end up taking that same step as you Dave and going progressivly further around until I can nose-in. It's a bit daunting though. I've worked hard side-in to get here and now a new learning curve. I am positive that my training will pay off in the long run though. It is boring to hover train night after night but after that it'll be downhill to learn FF and FFF.

quote:

I have been doing some reading here and I think I had almost all of the problems and frustrations people has been posting here through my ownership of 6 Falcon 40/DF4#1. All my birds now have been through extensive upgrades and modes and now they have none of the problems and frustrations. The only drawback is it gets boring without the repairs and the tinkerings. My conclusion is in the end you get what you paid for. No brush motor is ever going to outperform a BL, otherwise Trex and all the other highend copters would be using them. It is unecessary to keep track of how long a motor last and it should never need repair or replacement. BL also give you stunning authority which is another advantage over brush.


I fully agree with your argument life. BL is certainly a better motor than a brushed. You'll never hear me argue otherwise. However as I have said many times I am not intrested in sinking $200 on electronics and motors to convert a $90 heli into a preformance machine. It seems like trying to turn a volvo into a mustang when for the money spent on the conversion you could just buy a mustang. I am using the falcon as a trainer only. When I get "good" enough I will be in the market for a prefomance heli. A belt CP 450 class RTF is only $189! BTW and it comes BL with a belt driven tail. I'm not saying that it''s the end all of helis and it certainly has some drawbacks but I'd rather make the inital investment for one rather than sinking that money into the Falcon. Don't get me wrong I love it and most likely won't sell it but still a trainer. What I want is to find a low cost solution to my frequent tail issues. I could possibly consider a BL tail for the cost it would most likely pay for itself shortly but replacing all the rest with BL is just not for me. The brushed main motors when properly broken in will last 100+ flights and that is ok with me. I would have to fly like 1000 flights to make up the cost to convert. I'll be on to a bigger heli by then so brushed main stays. Jury is stll out on the tail. As far as the 4#3's outpreforming the 40.....who cares. Most of the people that buy these are using them to train for a bigger heli. Let the 4#3 people sink a bunch of money into those and in the mean while I'll be flying circles around em with a 450.

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I''m addicted...2 packs a day!

(in reply to broggyr)
       Post #: 5730

RE: Falcon 40 (Exceed heli) Forum - 5/8/2008 7:51:33 PM   
Short Flight


 

Posts: 107
Joined: 1/11/2008
From: Reinholds, PA, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: UTM
The brushed main motors when properly broken in will last 100+ flights and that is ok with me. I would have to fly like 1000 flights to make up the cost to convert. I'll be on to a bigger heli by then so brushed main stays. Jury is stll out on the tail. As far as the 4#3's outpreforming the 40.....who cares. Most of the people that buy these are using them to train for a bigger heli. Let the 4#3 people sink a bunch of money into those and in the mean while I'll be flying circles around em with a 450.


Totally agree. I think most people buy the Falcon as a 1st bird or stepping stone from dual rotor to CP flying. If I planned to throw $200. into a copter (which I did with my Copter X ) it won't be to try to upgrade a little FP trainer. That being said, if the Falcon is going to be your main ride, may as well ride first class!

Speaking of upgrading, we haven't heard from Billmay or Wade for awhile... wondering how thier jump to CP flying is going. Hey guys, are those Falcons getting any airtime, or are you too busy flying upside down these days?

- Chris

(in reply to UTM)
       Post #: 5731

RE: Falcon 40 (Exceed heli) Forum - 5/8/2008 9:42:45 PM   
Bones27


 

Posts: 519
Joined: 4/17/2007
From: Warner Robins, GA, USA
Status: offline 		What's all this talk of LiPo's, BL motors and new technology, I tell you it's witch craft, everyone knows motors don't run without brushes and you should be burned at the stake!!!! Just kidding, couldn't resist that one LOL!!!! Here's my take on the subject; this is a hobby and to me the definition of a hobby is what makes each of us happy. We all enjoy helicopters and RC and we each have our own ideas of what is the perfect heli, some want BL motors and Lipo's and some want Brushes and NiMh's, I say to each his own and I enjoy reading about all of the different ideas but in the end I am going to do what makes me happy and I will not fault anyone one else for doing the same. Just my 2 cents worth and I hope I didn't offend anyone, if I did please accept my apologies.

(in reply to Short Flight)
       Post #: 5732

RE: Falcon 40 (Exceed heli) Forum - 5/8/2008 9:46:19 PM   
Great_life


 

Posts: 41
Joined: 4/24/2008
From: Brea, CA, USA
Status: offline 		Agreed, huum 100 flights for brush? That will last about 20 days for me but may work for most people who flies a lot less often. As far as cost goes, the $189 CP pro does not include electronics, may be only comes with one ESC and a motor so it is not $189 RTF. You are looking at may be $500 before it can fly. On the BL conversion you are talking about $50 total with motor, converter and ESC which is about $10-20 more than a brush motor upgrade. That is the reason why it is difficult for me to understand why people are upgrading to brush and not considering BL. May be it is the resistance to change mentality. Anyway may be most people don't know the place to get brushless conversion parts and they end up spending over $100. My previous post, a BL main motor costs $16 and runs much better than a brush motor. Now, how much is a brush motor? I am not trying to competite with the 4#3, all I am saying is that you can make the Falcon fly a lot better and more enjoyable. I have 2 Tres450SE and I fly my Falcon more after the mods. It is hard to sink in for most people because they have never tried it. If you have never driven a Ferrari, you should not try to convinced yourself that your Corolla runs just as fine or that you don't care about a Ferrari beating you on the punch. Hehe, we are only taking about $10-20 not $100,000-200,000 so I think it is well worth the change. Why am I trying to convince people here to go BL? Ever since I got into this thread, I feel the urge. It's like telling a third world country farmers that they should use farm machines instead of their cows. No pun intended, just trying to bring in the reality.

Falcon 40 can be more fun than a Trex450SE.

(in reply to UTM)
       Post #: 5733

RE: Falcon 40 (Exceed heli) Forum - 5/8/2008 9:50:41 PM   
Great_life


 

Posts: 41
Joined: 4/24/2008
From: Brea, CA, USA
Status: offline 		Agreed, huum 100 flights for brush may work for weekend pilots? That will last about 20 days for me but may work for most people who flies a lot less often. Disagree, as far as cost goes, the $189 CP pro does not include electronics, may be only comes with one ESC and a motor so it is not $189 RTF. You are looking at may be $500 before it can fly. On the BL conversion you are talking about $50 total with motor, converter and ESC which is about $10-20 more than a brush motor upgrade. That is the reason why it is difficult for me to understand why people are upgrading to brush and not considering BL. May be it is the resistance to change mentality. Anyway may be most people don't know the place to get brushless conversion parts and they end up spending over $100. My previous post, a BL main motor costs $16 and runs much better than a brush motor. Now, how much is a brush motor? I am not trying to competite with the 4#3, all I am saying is that you can make the Falcon fly a lot better and more enjoyable. I have 2 Tres450SE and I fly my Falcon more after the mods. It is hard to sink in for most people because they have never tried it. If you have never driven a Ferrari, you should not try to convinced yourself that your Corolla runs just as fine or that you don't care about a Ferrari beating you on the punch. Hehe, we are only taking about $10-20 not $100,000-200,000 so I think it is well worth the change. Why am I trying to convince people here to go BL? Ever since I got into this thread, I feel the urge. It's like telling a third world country farmers that they should use farm machines instead of their cows. Most, I hear on this thread is that the cow is getting a stomach ache (motor problems). No pun intended, just trying to bring in the reality.

Falcon 40 can be more fun than a Trex450SE.

< Message edited by Great_life -- 5/8/2008 9:54:20 PM >

(in reply to UTM)
       Post #: 5734

RE: Falcon 40 (Exceed heli) Forum - 5/8/2008 10:23:43 PM   
UTM


 

Posts: 195
Joined: 3/11/2008
From: Indianapolis, IN, USA
Status: offline 		Life - You have obviously not looked into brushed motors or the Belt CP. when I say $189 RTF I mean it. Everything including the TX, RX included. I have watched videos of people actually taking them out of the box and plugging them in to a battery and flying. You should really do your homework before disagreeing so openly. As far as brushed upgrades go the Century motor is $11.95 main and $9 tail not $10 bucks less than $50-$60 and that is for each motor so it would cost min $100-$120 to upgrade VS $21 to upgrade brushed motors. The BL motors may be not that much more than brushed but then you gotta buy ESC's and converters to go with it. Can't just drop in