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RE: Zeque Build Glow Powered... - 2/8/2007 3:37:23 AM   
ual767



Posts: 762
Joined: 12/3/2002
From: Chantilly, VA, USA
Status: offline 		Mike, the Zeque is designed for the rudder and elevator servos in the fuse center. The exits for the elevator pushrods are built into the rear of the fuse. The pics above are Rusty's Beryll stabs. My Zeque over in the electric build thread has 2 servos in the rear but I put then into the fuse sides rather than into the stab halves.

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(in reply to mwick)
       Post #: 76

RE: Zeque Build Glow Powered... - 2/8/2007 3:37:38 AM   
BERUSTY


 

Posts: 346
Joined: 2/24/2005
From: Naperville, IL, USA
Status: offline 		Zeque Build Glow Powered

Why not put the elevator servos in the tail?

Last summer I assembled (one doesn't build an ARF) a CHP Scandalous. Chip gave me all of the answers to the test including which servos and where to put them. Did I follow the advice of THE expert? No, I had a better idea which was to put the Futaba 9650's in the tail rather than under the rudder servo under the canopy. Did my solution work? Yes and no. It was simple and solid AND required a 6 ounce battery behind the firewall to balance properly which put me about 5 ounces over eleven pounds. Great if I was flying IMAC.

Rusty's toy airplane rule #13: If the designer or former F3A world champion returns your calls, let alone tells you what, how, where something goes (airplane parts), say thank you and do it.


Weights of stuff and comparisons:

(2) Futaba 9650's weigh exactly the same as (1) Futaba 9151 , about 1.8 ounces.
The Futaba 40" HD servo extensions weigh exactly the same as the Central Hobbies D.E.P.'s un-cut pushrod kit w/ (2) 36" 1/4 square balsa sticks.
Put 1.8 ounces 52" behind the CG versus 8" and you discover my problem.
Temperature may effect any pushrod 50" long.
Geometry, electronic set-up (sub trim), wear and tear may effect servo matching over time.

Everything is a compromise and I try to be realistic about my interest and abilities to muddle through them. Troy will do a fine job installing the DEPS and I will have more time to work on other stuff.

Rusty Dose
Team Futaba
Team YS Performance

(in reply to rgreen24)
       Post #: 77

RE: Zeque Build Glow Powered... - 2/8/2007 2:37:30 PM   
rgreen24



Posts: 668
Joined: 1/22/2002
From: Omaha, NE, USA
Status: offline 		Rusty I did the same. Chip told me run the serno in the fuse under the rudder, did i listen No. I ended up having to run a 6 ounce battery behind the firewall just like you did Plnae ended up weighing 10lbs 8oz. On a brighter note I just switched from ES pipe to the new Shorter Hatori pipe and I had to move my battery several inches back from the firewall because the shorter pipe moved the CG forward.

(in reply to BERUSTY)
       Post #: 78

RE: Zeque Build Glow Powered... - 2/9/2007 4:17:24 AM   
ENO


 

Posts: 47
Joined: 4/29/2005
From: Chicago, IL, USA
Status: offline 		I plan to place the servos(2-JR3421sa) in the stab of mine, I also plan to use the short hatori pipe(821) on a YS160. Just wondering how much this may throw off the CG compared to a MK system or DEPs system? If significantly different I may reconsider...

Doc

(in reply to rgreen24)
       Post #: 79

RE: Zeque Build Glow Powered... - 2/9/2007 4:40:58 AM   
BERUSTY


 

Posts: 346
Joined: 2/24/2005
From: Naperville, IL, USA
Status: offline 		Zeque Build Glow Powered

Doc's (a very funny guy...especially with Frank D.) post regarding servos in the tail.

The weights I mentioned a few posts "up" pretty well define the components...basically the same total weight. The challenge is "where" the weight is located. I will be using the same Hatori header/muffler combination and based on the layout of Mr. Suzuki's model with the battery and rx in the fuse behind the tank. I assume you will be tail heavy. Some pilots like how that flies and feels. Personally, I do not. The plane can handle a big a#$%& battery in the front, but you probably did not invest in THIS model to have to resort to that requirement...

Rusty Dose
Team Futaba
Team YS Performance

(in reply to ENO)
       Post #: 80

RE: Zeque Build Glow Powered... - 2/9/2007 4:46:29 AM   
dflynt


 

Posts: 131
Joined: 1/2/2004
From: Arlington, VA, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ENO

I plan to place the servos(2-JR3421sa) in the stab of mine, I also plan to use the short hatori pipe(821) on a YS160. Just wondering how much this may throw off the CG compared to a MK system or DEPs system? If significantly different I may reconsider...

Doc


The difference in CG location between a single elevator servo mounted near the wing verses two elevator servos in the stab is huge. I had a plane that started off with dual elevator servos in the tail, and it was tail heavy by about one inch, or 8 ounces of lead in the nose. I replaced that setup with DEPS, removed the lead, and the cg shifted forward about 1.25 inches. It is an easy decision -- install everything but the elevator setup. Then just figure out what it takes to balance on the CG without adding ballast.

In my experience, most glow pattern planes (even with a YS) will be tail heavy with dual elevator servos in the stab. The short pipe won't offset the CG significantly.

(in reply to ENO)
       Post #: 81

RE: Zeque Build Glow Powered... - 2/9/2007 6:17:31 AM   
Troy Newman


 

Posts: 2429
Joined: 12/30/2001
From: Goodyear, AZ, USA
Status: offline 		Doc,

the Zeque was designed with the Short Hatori pipe and a single servo up front. SO you WILL be tail heavy if you stick them in the back.

Just for comparison on my Astral XXc I put everything in the model the same as Naruke did, even used a Nimh battery 2300mah. The models CG is perfect just that way. Its right at the suggested range nothing added and nothing needed.

Model is 10lbs all up 4536g currently has the 170DZ in it with a solid BP spinner. I don't see the need to change anything about it. By the way I installed the DEPS system in it.

Troy

(in reply to dflynt)
       Post #: 82

RE: Zeque Build Glow Powered... - 2/9/2007 1:34:31 PM   
pappy35


 

Posts: 364
Joined: 10/30/2006
From: Liberty Township, OH, USA
Status: offline 		Rusty, that was pretty funny. Have you posted the otherr twelve rules? 8-)


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(in reply to Troy Newman)
       Post #: 83

RE: Zeque Build Glow Powered... - 2/10/2007 3:22:41 AM   
BERUSTY


 

Posts: 346
Joined: 2/24/2005
From: Naperville, IL, USA
Status: offline 		Zeque Build Glow Powered

Regarding Rusty's attempt to maintain thread "hits" absent any "actual" building...

Life's experiences have provided me a collection of rules which, like rule #13, have been developed to protect me from "me". Better stated, the disease of "Me" which I have stolen from a book on management by basketball coach Pat Riley. I encourage you to read the book or at least the chapter.

Rusty's toy airplane rule #4: Invest as much time in selecting your (sweet heart, spouse, someone you like or someone you think you like) valentine's day card as you did the last pair of toy airplane wheels.

Seriously, the Zeque WILL be ready to fly by Sunday evening (2/11)! In the coming days, I will post the following items which I feel are of potential interest including:

Dave Guerin's super slick way to mount wheel pants.
The Hatori 821 pipe set-up with all the probably way too expensive and not completely needed BUT are very cool hardware.
The "Bob Kohler" signature model stand.


Rusty Dose
Team Futaba
Team YS Performance


(in reply to pappy35)
       Post #: 84

RE: Zeque Build Glow Powered... - 2/11/2007 7:20:21 PM   
BERUSTY


 

Posts: 346
Joined: 2/24/2005
From: Naperville, IL, USA
Status: offline 		Zeque Build Glow Powered

As previously mentioned, I have always marveled at the Japanese model stands. Bryan Hebert had a nifty stand for his Quest. My pal Bob Kohler, who is in my mind a "master" wood worker volunteered to build me a custom stand for the Zeque. Bob came over the other evening, reviewed my scribbles, gathered the Home Depot materials and returned yesterday with the results. He has already decided to build another "really" cool one to out do the example on the Oxai-Zeque home page.

The rubber molding is from BVM Models and enough to complete this stand was $15.00. It has a mind of it's own and required alot of verbal coaxing to get it to look pretty good. One Central Hobbies servo screw is placed on each end and tightened to pull just under the surface. A couple coats of MinWax clear urethane, quick scratch of 400 sand paper and a coat of SC Johnson paste wax to finish it off.

The stand is symmetrical and will make the model much easier to transport and wrench on at the field or at home Thank you Bob!


Rusty Dose
Team Futaba
Team YS Performance



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< Message edited by BERUSTY -- 2/11/2007 9:09:55 PM >

(in reply to BERUSTY)
       Post #: 85

RE: Zeque Build Glow Powered... - 2/11/2007 7:28:31 PM   
BERUSTY


 

Posts: 346
Joined: 2/24/2005
From: Naperville, IL, USA
Status: offline 		Zeque Build Glow Powered

Tail wheel. The tail wheel I want to use is still in route via Adrian Wong and one of his contacts in Hong Kong. The proven and clearly still way over the top...the MK tail wheel on a diet. Cameron Smith, 2006 NATS second place finisher in Masters, sent me a photo of his modified tail wheel a few weeks ago. I just drilled a few holes using a UNI-BIT with a 3/32 pilot hole for alignment.

The scale shows the completed weight, maybe someone will post the "stock" weight.


Rusty Dose
Team Futaba
Team YS Performance

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< Message edited by BERUSTY -- 2/11/2007 9:47:53 PM >

(in reply to BERUSTY)
       Post #: 86

RE: Zeque Build Glow Powered... - 2/11/2007 9:08:26 PM   
BERUSTY


 

Posts: 346
Joined: 2/24/2005
From: Naperville, IL, USA
Status: offline 		Zeque Build Glow Powered

The parts and pieces for the next steps including the battery and receiver mounting plate picured below. I like to use "craft plywood" available at craft stores (crazy considering the name...) for non-strength related parts but hard balsa is just not strong enough.

Velcro straps available at Home Depot, are used to strap the battery and rx in place over foam rubber available from SIG. The natural foam rubber, white in color, is heavier but makes me feel more comfortable. I just cut a piece of 1/4" to 3/8" slightly larger than the component, placed between the straps. Simple and easy to remove or make adjustments. (I will be able to charge the 1320 mah lipo pack outside the model or exchange with a spare.)

The slot for the velcro is cut with a tiny all purpose bit in the trusty, but indespensible lithium Dremel tool. I showed the picture because sometimes I read stuff and still can't figure out how something was done. A 1" forstner bit makes quick work of the lightening hole. 220 grit sandpaper cleans the piece up prior to installation with "green" label ZAP.


Rusty Dose
Team Futaba
Team YS Performance

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(in reply to BERUSTY)
       Post #: 87

RE: Zeque Build Glow Powered... - 2/11/2007 9:29:37 PM   
BERUSTY


 

Posts: 346
Joined: 2/24/2005
From: Naperville, IL, USA
Sta