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RE: Extreme Flight 88 - 3/16/2011 1:01 AM   
3DAP


 

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Status: offline 		yea i got it up there joe.

Trying to get motocross habit out of my veins before im too Old..... lol

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RE: Extreme Flight 88 - 3/16/2011 1:06 PM   
JoeAirPort



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Status: offline 		I thought it was the Yak. It's the Extra right? That's a good price. Should be gone in no time.

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RE: Extreme Flight 88 - 3/23/2011 8:26 PM   
House2twist


 

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Status: offline 		So, for those of you running a pipe, which pipe are you running? I'm thinking it's about time I pipe my yak. I'm currently running a DA50 on stock muffs and I'm looking for a little more oomph.


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RE: Extreme Flight 88 - 3/23/2011 8:43 PM   
exeter_acres



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KS1060
ES Composite...

all are good

25mm drop for the headers.

The ES composite are nice, light, have good power...but they are a bit pricey

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RE: Extreme Flight 88 - 3/23/2011 10:58 PM   
xtraflyr


 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: House2twist

So, for those of you running a pipe, which pipe are you running? I'm thinking it's about time I pipe my yak. I'm currently running a DA50 on stock muffs and I'm looking for a little more oomph.


On my old Yak I used a KS 1060 and on my EF Edge I'm using a ES Composites . To me they seemed about the same,with the ES being lighter like Curtis has stated. I think the ES is easier to mount,because it doesn't heat up like an aluminum pipe,so you can just put a bit of silicone where the tie wrap would wrap around it .

Frank..


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RE: Extreme Flight 88 - 3/28/2011 7:42 PM   
frieshoo



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Status: offline 		Got Yak #2 ready for the maiden. Hopefully, this will be the last snow of the year. I went with Futuba servos for this one. I'm a little concerned about the rudder wag with only 200 oz-in of the torque. It has S9153's all around, except throttle (9252).

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RE: Extreme Flight 88 - 4/1/2011 2:50 AM   
JoeAirPort



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Status: offline 		Cool, glad to hear you got a #2. What happened to #1? I would not tension the rudder cables too much. Just take out the slack. I think that can cause rudder wag. 200 ounces is not too bad for rudder. See how it works and if you need more, easy to change it out. I'm almost done with my 110 Yak and can't wait to fly it. Like you I hope no more snow. I should be ready for a maiden in a week or so. And I stress the so.

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RE: Extreme Flight 88 - 4/1/2011 3:02 AM   
Slow and Steady


 

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Status: offline 		Any thoughts on prop size for the EF Yak with DLE 55 and stock muffler. I am currently using a Vess 22 B, but I'm thinking about the 23 B. The 22 B turns at 7,200 RPM restrained on the ground. DLE's manual rates the engine at 5.5 HP at 7,500 RPM, if that has any bearing. Vertical appears unlimited but slow.

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RE: Extreme Flight 88 - 4/1/2011 3:18 AM   
ArcherIIDriver



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quote:

ORIGINAL: Slow and Steady

Any thoughts on prop size for the EF Yak with DLE 55 and stock muffler. I am currently using a Vess 22 B, but I'm thinking about the 23 B. The 22 B turns at 7,200 RPM restrained on the ground. DLE's manual rates the engine at 5.5 HP at 7,500 RPM, if that has any bearing. Vertical appears unlimited but slow.

I go back & forth between the 23B and 23A. Depends on my mood. Most of the time, I like the 23B best...it seems to have a little better "bite" & vertical pull. Both the 23A & 23B are good choices and both are WAY better than the 22A & B, IMHO.

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RE: Extreme Flight 88 - 4/1/2011 1:40 PM   
JoeAirPort



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quote:

ORIGINAL: Slow and Steady

Any thoughts on prop size for the EF Yak with DLE 55 and stock muffler. I am currently using a Vess 22 B, but I'm thinking about the 23 B. The 22 B turns at 7,200 RPM restrained on the ground. DLE's manual rates the engine at 5.5 HP at 7,500 RPM, if that has any bearing. Vertical appears unlimited but slow.


Yeah I hear all the time how well the Vess 23A and 23B run on that engine. Is your prop really close to the cowling? It should be spaced further away than other Extra or Edge type planes. The prop has better efficiency further away. A larger diameter prop might help that.

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RE: Extreme Flight 88 - 4/2/2011 4:14 AM   
Slow and Steady


 

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Status: offline 		My prop is alittle over an inch from the leading edge of the cowling. I went from 22b to 23b today and didn't notice much difference. Today, A friend who has had 3 ef yaks also suggested the 23a. I will order and try. I noticed the DLE manual recommeds high octane gas; I believe 92. I am running on 87 and wonder if that is effecting performance also. This link shows a DLE 55 stock muffler and 23a with some pretty strong pull out: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pNdIOX3rkwY

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RE: Extreme Flight 88 - 4/2/2011 3:36 PM   
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Status: offline 		Increased octane won't increase power if the engine was designed for low octane gas (it was). It's for much higher compression engines to control combustion timing. Just low octane is all you need. Mid to high won't hurt it though. In really hot weather the high octane can keep the engine from detonating (that crackly sound at high RPM's). Also good for tuned pipes. You have the high needle tuned for peak RPM's? The 55 is a strong engine. Maybe the 23A will have better pull out. I think the huge cowling can hinder prop efficiency but I'm no expert on that. Just a theory that some of us share. Sounds like you have a good enough gap. I think my spacing is the same as yours. MY pull out is pretty good. It's a DL-50 with stock exhaust. Xoar 22x8 beech wood. I pasted a couple of videos of mine below.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ynkFiYZOS7k

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z1SD21qAJoA


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RE: Extreme Flight 88 - 4/3/2011 2:06 AM   
Slow and Steady


 

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Status: offline 		Hi Joe, I saw that first video months ago, when it was first posted. At the time, I suggested EF add a link from its site. It is a great video. Your a great flyer and I enjoy watching it; it is really well made -the videographer deserves some strong cudos also. I pulled out the Chinese manual for the DLE 55 and it recommends "clean petrol 93#, which I presume means 93 octane - their manual leaves alot to be desired. A later manual that I downloaded from the Tower site reccommends 87 to 93. What you noted about octane results sounds reasonable. I will post my max rpm and pull out after I run the 23a, while remaining with the 87 octane, 40 to 1 Red Line mix. I should note that my plane has not been weighed and I should check that before assuming it is a prop issue. I did some mods that likely put it on the upper end of the weight range. I did notice after changing from the 22b to the 23b that I had better braking and increased snap response, likely due to the diameter increase and increased prop wash beyond the cowl. Thanks for the help and advise, and the great videos.

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RE: Extreme Flight 88 - 4/3/2011 10:36 AM   
Richard D Bahmann aka/Wrongway



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Status: offline 		Somewhere I read that the 93 octane in the book refers to what they get overseas where the engine is built. If I remember correct it is similar to the 89 octane that we have at the pump using the RM/2 method over here. 93 there like 89 here.

It has been a while.....but I tried 100 octane race gas in my DA-50 on stock muffler....no rpm gain...back to regular pump gas same top end rpm.

Weight of airplane will reflect in how quick it goes up on a vertical line with a similar engine/prop/thrust combo. If you plane for example weighs 16 pounds and you have 32 pounds of thrust you have 2-1 power to weight ratio....this will yield scalding up lines... in another example, if the plane weighs 18 pounds and you only have 28 pounds of thrust (pure examples) then you might only have 1.55 power to weight....much slower pull out. Most 3D pilots can fly 3D at 1.5 to one...most would rather have 2 to one.

What oil are you using?

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RE: Extreme Flight 88 - 4/3/2011 6:46 PM   
JoeAirPort



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quote:

ORIGINAL: Slow and Steady

Hi Joe, I saw that first video months ago, when it was first posted. At the time, I suggested EF add a link from its site. It is a great video. Your a great flyer and I enjoy watching it; it is really well made -the videographer deserves some strong cudos also. I pulled out the Chinese manual for the DLE 55 and it recommends ''clean petrol 93#, which I presume means 93 octane - their manual leaves alot to be desired. A later manual that I downloaded from the Tower site reccommends 87 to 93. What you noted about octane results sounds reasonable. I will post my max rpm and pull out after I run the 23a, while remaining with the 87 octane, 40 to 1 Red Line mix. I should note that my plane has not been weighed and I should check that before assuming it is a prop issue. I did some mods that likely put it on the upper end of the weight range. I did notice after changing from the 22b to the 23b that I had better braking and increased snap response, likely due to the diameter increase and increased prop wash beyond the cowl. Thanks for the help and advise, and the great videos.


Thanks for the compliments on the videos. The guy that does them is very good at it (he did only the 1st one). He also did one of us flying foamies indoors. Very cool to have a guy like that in our club.

Mine is 17# 13 oz dry and with the DL-50 sock exhaust...the pull out is not rocket but plenty for my needs. My Extreme Flight 100" Yak with DA-120 will very likely have a 2:1 thrust to weight ratio. The engine is supposed to grunt out 60# of thrust and my plane is going to weigh about 28 lbs.

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RE: Extreme Flight 88 - 4/3/2011 11:02 PM   
Richard D Bahmann aka/Wrongway



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Status: offline 		Isn't it amazing.... I remember some years ago watching a guy hover a plane....might have been the first time I saw an RC giant hover....it was a video...when he punched out he also nosed it over so it would start using the wings.....wonder what his thrust to weight was? Nowadays we are pushing the 2-1 rocket like escape.....yeah I saw LXCoup with his DA120 powered EF-110 on a JC 28-10 at about 6500 rpm.....he punched go and it was like a rocket launch, straight up.... We have come a long way..

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RE: Extreme Flight 88 - 4/4/2011 10:37 PM   
Slow and Steady


 

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Status: offline 		I'm using Red Line at 40 to 1, after 4 gallons of Lawn Boy Ashless at 30 to 1. I should also check the gap on the plug, which I hear should be at .018. It made a big difference on the Funtana. Didn't know about the difference in US octane compared to Europe; thanks for the continued help. This is my first 50cc and it is definitely a work in progress. My goal for a rocket may be misplaced and really not needed for my style of flying. Just looking to get the best I can within the stock muffler configuration. My other plane is a Funtana 125 with a 30cc gasser and it has strong vertical, but isn't nearly as much fun to fly.

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RE: Extreme Flight 88 - 4/15/2011 3:35 AM   
ahylt


 

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Status: offline 		Need helps guys:
I have an 88in YAK. I need about an quarter inch up elevator for level flight. At full throttle it dies. I need again about an quarter inch right rudder for straight flight. My CG is on the back side of the recommended mark. The incidence meter won't be here for another week. I need suggestions please.

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RE: Extreme Flight 88 - 4/15/2011 4:00 AM   
JoeAirPort



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Status: offline 		Wait for the incidence meter. Check everything including engine thrust. Should have a little right thrust in the firewall. Engine is offset a small fraction of an inch to the left (1/8th to 1/4"). Are you using good aluminum standoffs? If the stand off's are home made the thrust could be off.

Richen the high needle. It may be too lean and running out of fuel in the mix.

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RE: Extreme Flight 88 - 4/15/2011 4:19 AM   
xtraflyr


 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: ahylt

Need helps guys:
I have an 88in YAK. I need about an quarter inch up elevator for level flight. At full throttle it dies. I need again about an quarter inch right rudder for straight flight. My CG is on the back side of the recommended mark. The incidence meter won't be here for another week. I need suggestions please.

Definitely sounds lean on the high end. And like Joe said,wait for your incidence meter before you go adding shims to the motor or anything. Most of the 88's needed the stab to be modified to take out the elev.trim. The mod is very easy and only takes about 1/2 hour or so to do..


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RE: Extreme Flight 88 - 4/15/2011 6:31 AM   
Slow and Steady


 

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Status: offline 		Mine flies with 5 clicks of up elevator trim, as does a friend with another EF 88" Yak. I thought the incidence might be off, since the cg provides near hands off inverted and upright flight. Didn't want to mess with it, sincel it flies so well as is. Will adjusting incidence make much difference?

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RE: Extreme Flight 88 - 4/15/2011 3:33 PM   
JoeAirPort



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ORIGINAL: Slow and Steady

Mine flies with 5 clicks of up elevator trim, as does a friend with another EF 88'' Yak. I thought the incidence might be off, since the cg provides near hands off inverted and upright flight. Didn't want to mess with it, sincel it flies so well as is. Will adjusting incidence make much difference?


You know, if it makes you feel better, yes. But if it flies well it's really not worth bothering with. I put my 88" Yak on my ping pong table and checked all incidences with a meter. I tweaked both stabs a tiny bit to make them perfect 0/0 (one was -1/2, other +1/4). Then I had bragging rights that I only needed one click of up trim (2 counts in Futaba trim screen) and 0 aileron trim (my wings were perfect 0/0 out of the box). But does it really matter if you need trim? I could have saved all that dinking around of stab incidences. On my 110 I didn't do anything. I just matched the elevator throws and flew it (2 counts left trim, 10 counts up trim in Futaba trim screen). The thing flies beautifully. So I say that's what trims are for (as long as it's not 50 clicks of up trim or stabs are so far off it's noticeable by eye).

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RE: Extreme Flight 88 - 4/15/2011 5:27 PM   
ahylt


 

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Status: offline 		Oops typo. The plane dives when i go full throttle not dies. I am using the dle 55 with the stock standoffs. Everybody talks how good this flies but my ef 88 edge flies much better, just not happy with it right now. guess i will wait for the incidence meter and see if it straightens out. Thanks guys

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RE: Extreme Flight 88 - 4/15/2011 6:59 PM   
Slow and Steady


 

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Status: offline 		I am definitely enjoying this plane. The blenders, which I just learned are awesome and totally predictable. The inverted flat spins are FLAT! I think I will leave well enough alone regarding the incidence. Thanks for the advise. This is my first 50cc plane and its ability to fly in 15+ MPH winds is great. 82 flights in two months and loving it!

AHYLT, I look forward to hearing of your incidence results. Hopefully, the issue is quickly resolved.

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RE: Extreme Flight 88 - 4/15/2011 8:20 PM   
closetguy


 

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Status: offline 		i had two EF yaks,both needed the incidence tweak a little on the stabs to make them perfect.if you don't mind flying with a little trim, that is all well and good.it's just nice ( for me) to take your hands off the sticks and it flies straight,flat and true with out the control surfaces fighting each other.
i do this on every ARF i buy and it a pretty common problem on all of them,no one builds the way you would build one for your self.

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