Posts: 124
Joined: 3/14/2002 From: Hampton, VA, USA Status: offline
Since I have almost 10,000 hours in the DHC-7, I have a keen interest in building one. The only plans I have heard of are by Dan Palmer, and they are somewhat expensive. I have heard several comments about his plans. Some good, some bad.... Well detailed but parts don't seem to fit properly, unrealistic target weigthts, and probably no prototype model ever built from his plans.
Has anyone see this plan, and if so did you build the model?
There used to be a six foot span foam E-power model of the Dash-7, but I have been unable to locate one.
I also saw a photo of a European model and it was very large, I'm guessing a span of around 14 feet! Does anyone have any info on that model? (Photo below)
Posts: 3723
Joined: 12/25/2002 From: Vienna, VA, USA Status: offline
Joe
I have a Robbe Dash 7 still in the box. Maybe we can talk about it
Wish I could help on the plans but I kow this bird is hard to locate decent plans for. I flew on a Dash as a kid on alot of short hops and I used to love it! Are you still flying?
Posts: 124
Joined: 3/14/2002 From: Hampton, VA, USA Status: offline
quote:
ORIGINAL: DiabloKid
Joe
I have a Robbe Dash 7 still in the box. Maybe we can talk about it
Wish I could help on the plans but I kow this bird is hard to locate decent plans for. I flew on a Dash as a kid on alot of short hops and I used to love it! Are you still flying?
I would love to talk about it! I have heard about it, but know nothing about it other than it was supposed to come with the motors, etc. I don't think it even had any wheels, did it?
Is there any chance you could send me some photos of the kit and give me an idea what you would sell it for. As much as I want the kit, I'm going to the DC area tomorrow to buy an F-15 ducted fan kit from a guy. My wife would have a fit if I tell her I'm thiniking of buying another kit! And on toip of that, we are trying to sell our house to move into a condo! Way too much going on! At least I'll get the two car garage to set up as a shop!
I retired from my airline job six years ago in May. I guess you could say I hung up my headset. I haven't flown myself as pilot since.
I've got the Dan Palmer plan. Havn't built it yet as I need a bigger workshop and I'm getting the kit cut and trying to get all the other pieces together (canopy, radome, nacelles, etc...)
< Message edited by skyhawknut -- 4/14/2007 1:43:14 AM >
Posts: 124
Joined: 3/14/2002 From: Hampton, VA, USA Status: offline
quote:
ORIGINAL: skyhawknut
I've got the Dan Palmer plan. Havn't built it yet as I nee a bigger workshop and I'm getting the kit cut and trying to get all the other pieces together (canpoy, radome, nacelles, etc...)
Hi Skyhawknut,
You are the first person I've heard of who may have seen those plans. What do you think about them? What about the construction, scale details, etc. I'm particularly interested in what landing gear he came up with , as the real gear is pretty complicated.
I think I'm the only one with these plans as well!
It is very scale - he used the original factory blueprints to make his plans. Everything from the wing airfoils right down to leaving provisions and some discription for a fully detailed cabin. The only thing he comprimised on was a single flap - rather than the double fowler. The real one was pretty complex and probably very difficult to do in model form.
Mine will be electric - I'm not going to mess with trying to keep 4 .25's running properly and engine outs will not be a problem.
I've attached a pic of the custom gear made by Century jet specificly for the plane. While expensive and not all that scale - I'll probably use them as this bird will need some serious gear.
I've read all the stuff about Dan's plans as well - but the more I read about building from ANY of the big names plans - they all have the same problems with parts not fitting and plans not being clear. In the end - Dan's plans are a master piece. There is a lot of info on them and I've had to study some parts a few times to figure out what's going on. As far as I can tell the parts seem to fit better than his other plans - but I'm sure that some will be out, and the only way I will truely find out is when I put the laser cut parts together and build it. It's true that his designs probably haven't been flown - however I don't think I've read a build on any of his planes that didn't fly VERY well. (except 1 where he used too small an engine) One thing with these is the target weights are unrealistic. If you build one - build it and then when almost done - pick the powerplant based on your weight. The guy I spoke of above bought his engine with everything else and then built the plane, of course he was overweight and didn't have enough power.
Try this link :http://www.rcscalebuilder.com/
There is a section in the forums for Dan Palmer plan builds. Lots of good info.
< Message edited by skyhawknut -- 4/14/2007 1:44:12 AM >
Posts: 124
Joined: 3/14/2002 From: Hampton, VA, USA Status: offline
HI again,
I have heard all that you mentioned about the Palmer plans. In any case, it will be much better than starting from scratch. You mentioned having lazer cut parts. Is this a CAD drawing? If not, was it very expensive to have it converted so it could be lazer cut?
The gear is no where near scale. On the real one, there is a yoke at the top that goes about half way down to the wheel. The strut extends upward above that, and the whole thing folds during retraction to save space in the gear well. I wish I had a drawing of it. It would be very neat to duplicate it.
As for the flaps, they were four seperate pieces on each side. You could say it was complicated. All four pieces move together down to 25 degrees. The next step was 45 degrees, and that was the three trailing edge pieces moving together. The front section which was one very long piece was extended by three (or four-been a long time) jack screws. The trailing edge sections were hydrulic. Did he make provisions for the flaps to extend as the went down (fowler flaps). That extra area had a lot to do with the STOL preformance that I really loved to show off. WE could land and be stopped within 1000 feet from the approach end of the runway. Every time!
It was a fun plane to fly, and I really do miss it.
Posts: 124
Joined: 3/14/2002 From: Hampton, VA, USA Status: offline
I do have another question regarding the plans. The ailerons on the -7 are very small. Most of the roll control was done with two spoilers on each wing. The outboard spoilers were disabled at about 130 kt's. Does he show the ailerons at the scale size, enlarged, or does he also use spoilers for roll?
Reason for asking: If they are the proper size and spoilers are not used, the roll control will be very weak. With ailerons alone, in a hydrolic failure mode, the plane was very sluggish.
Regarding the large model above in the photo, if my memory serves me right belongs to Jerremy Shaw in the UK, built in the early nineties. I think you may be able to reach him through the Large Model Association in the UK (google "LMA" .
About the laser cut kit. No it's not a CADplan but their are at least two companies that have scanned and made laser files for it. The one I'm going to get is from Precision cut kits.
As for the gear - it's better than stright gear. It would be insanely expensive and very difficult to get a near perfect scale gear. I'll probably dress up these ones with a fake drag strut and maybey some yokes that I would shape an then JB weld to the side of the strut. That would be much more ecinomical and yet have an easy install, reliable, and fully functional strut and gear.
Yes - the flaps are fowler, but as I said only a single flap due to the complextity of trying to get a double flap to work on such a small scale and without hydralics as mentioned.
There are no spoilers on this model - but it wouldn't be hard to install some from Robbe (I think) One of the hobby stores was importing some units from Europe. They are really nice. Made for sailplanes - just cut a hole and drop them in. They are fully self contained and have almost no depth. Actuated by 1 servo pulling on the rod at the end of the unit. Even without these and a scale looking sized aileron I'm still not worried about how it will fly. As I said earlier - all Dan's planes seem to fly like ****cats.
I'll try and take some small section pics of the plans and post them.
Voyager airways in Canada operates 7 Dash 7's. One of them is based in Vancouver in the same hanger as my company. So I see it all the time and I hang out with the mechanics. They let me poke around and ask questions so I'm pretty familliar with the 7 and it's systems. And I have the real one to help with my build!
Posts: 124
Joined: 3/14/2002 From: Hampton, VA, USA Status: offline
Hi again,
It's good that you have a real one to look at. You should be able to make a super looking model. Keep us posted. I would like to see some of the details of the plans.
Joe, I have included some shots of the plans just to show the level of detail. There are 4 sheets at 36" x 72". Fwd fuse, tail, outboard wings + nacelles, and inboard wings.
The wings bolt to the fuse and they also break down between the inboard and outboard nacelles. The fuse also splits between the vertical and the wing trailing edge - so the model is fairly transportable in even a small car.
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DeHavilland DHC-7 - 
