RE: Did I screw up the wing on my avenger?

RE: Did I screw up the wing on my avenger?
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RE: Did I screw up the wing on my avenger? - 7/20/2007 5:15:00 PM

The Internet Killer

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Has anyone tried ripstop and super77 ??

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RE: Did I screw up the wing on my avenger? - 7/20/2007 6:26:19 PM

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Weither you do tape or ripstop, usually the first step is a quick spray of 3M-77. with the tape, it helps stick stuff down, and it makes ironing down the tape more effective. But 77 doesn't have quite enough grab to work by itself, I don't think. A while back, some guys were using Icrex, or some other very thin nylon-like stuff and spray glue, but it was really expensive, and not really any stronger or more durable than tape, and like any ripstop, it's harder to repair than tape.

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RE: Did I screw up the wing on my avenger? - 7/20/2007 6:57:58 PM

rollo

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Great conversation, it seems that I will just stick with the packing tape this go around as this is my first combat plane. Just have to figure out where in my area you can get the colored stuff.

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RE: Did I screw up the wing on my avenger? - 7/20/2007 7:10:07 PM

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It's hard to find. I usually just order it from uline.com. A lot of guys get smaller quantites from fastpack.com (I think that's the url). When you order from uline, you have to order 18 rolls at a time, but you can mix-and-match the colors.

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RE: Did I screw up the wing on my avenger? - 7/20/2007 10:02:06 PM

rollo

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The closest thing I can find locally with colors is duck tape. Would that work?

< Message edited by rollo -- 7/20/2007 10:12:19 PM >

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RE: Did I screw up the wing on my avenger? - 7/20/2007 10:15:47 PM

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No, much too heavy, and it won't shrink.

In a pinch, you can use clear packing tape, and then paint over it, or use sign vinyl for markings.

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RE: Did I screw up the wing on my avenger? - 7/20/2007 10:46:22 PM

rollo

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I may do a test on painting the clear. I am looking for a quick turn around to get these in the air the summer is almost over here (j/k, kinda?). There is the option of using caution tape as a highlight or markings.

Thanks for the help and answering some of my simple questions. My only saving grace is saving someone else the imbarrasment

of asking these simple questions.

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RE: Did I screw up the wing on my avenger? - 7/21/2007 1:41:35 AM

The Internet Killer

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Montague

Weither you do tape or ripstop, usually the first step is a quick spray of 3M-77. with the tape, it helps stick stuff down, and it makes ironing down the tape more effective. But 77 doesn't have quite enough grab to work by itself, I don't think. A while back, some guys were using Icrex, or some other very thin nylon-like stuff and spray glue, but it was really expensive, and not really any stronger or more durable than tape, and like any ripstop, it's harder to repair than tape.

A year or so ago I did a test with pink foam and tyvek. I was able to get the tyvek to stick to the foam by spraying a few light coats of Super 77 on the foam and letting the solvents flash off, and spraying Hi-Strenght 90 on the tyvek and spread it around with a squegee.
Waited for both to get aggressivly tacky, then slapped them together. I also used a piece of Bidi to the same foam as kind of a control
to be able to gauge my results.

Waited 24 hours and then tried to peel them off the foam.

Both the bidi and the tyvek pulled off with approx the same force and both removed a thin layer of pink foam.

Warning: do not spray Hi-Strenght 90 on to foam directly.

Yes, packing tape is easier to repair, but Ripstop and tyvek have more strenght.

I didn't do any testing to see if what effect glow fuel would have. So your on your own there!!!!

< Message edited by The Internet Killer -- 7/21/2007 1:43:57 AM >

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RE: Did I screw up the wing on my avenger? - 7/23/2007 1:56:31 PM

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we get our colored packing tape from fastpack.com, reasonable cost and quantities. we tried Icarex and hated it, too heavy, time-consuming, and expensive, and not very tough. Ironing on ripstop with 3M77 would have the same disadvantages, WBP is lighter and easier. Overall I'd suggest sticking with tape. nothing worse than a RSN finish lifting and bubbling on a dewey or rainy morning.

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RE: Did I screw up the wing on my avenger? - 7/23/2007 4:30:17 PM

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Oh, yeah, I forgot about the problems with RSN and WBP and weather changes! ugh, that was a pain.

I do agree that RSN tends to be stronger than tape, but I think it's overkill, the tape is strong enough, and the ease of fixing makes it more than worth while. I have SSC wings that are 4 seasons old, have been repaired at leat 5-6 times, and still keep coming back for more. I haven't built a new SSC wing in over a year, I just keep fixing the ones I have. And I fly a fairly full schedule each year as well.

Like Scott, I did the RSN thing years ago, but gave it up pretty quickly in favor of tape.
Btw, if you really don't like tape, you can use low-temp heatshrink, like Ultracote or EconoKote (but not MonoKote) over foam. The bit downside to that kind of stuff is that when it gets even a minor prop cut in it, it tends to tear totally, leading to a complete wing failure. You can't over-estimate how useful the seams are on a tape job, the overlaps really do a great job stopping tears. It also makes it easier to do some repairs, but something of a pain to entirely strip a wing (which I don't do unless things are really messed up)

Tape is also nice in that you can just tape over prop cuts that don't hit anything important, you can tape around the LE to smooth out dents, you can iron down layers of tape to smooth out wrinkles left after field repairs, and so on. (one of the funny things I keep running in to is stripping old tape off a wing to get to a serious cut or loose spar and finding sticky stuff under a couple of layers of tape where I did some kind of field repair right over the sticky to get going fast, and just left it that way until the wing got really hit hard later one. Did one of those last night, in fact).

By all means, if you want to experiment with other coverings, go for it. Let us know how it works. That's how new, cool stuff comes around. But it also pays to look at what the guys who are really good at this stuff do, the guys who show up at major contests with piles of planes and put effort in to maintaining large fleets. Almost everyone is using tape these days because it works, it saves us time and money.

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RE: Did I screw up the wing on my avenger? - 7/23/2007 5:08:50 PM

rollo

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Since this is my first build I have decided to go witht he norm and use tape. Actually finished up the covering last night shouldn't be too long before I take it out for a flight.

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RE: Did I screw up the wing on my avenger? - 7/23/2007 5:50:00 PM

The Internet Killer

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All great points and I admit my combat fleet (2 planes) are finished in coloured packing tape.

As for weather changes and RSN with Super77 would the coated stuff work better ???

It is all a balancing act, durability, ease of building , repairability, strenght, etc.
and for some targets...er ??? pilot, looks or appearance

also know as a more appealing target.

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RE: Did I screw up the wing on my avenger? - 7/23/2007 6:16:43 PM

The Internet Killer

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WOW !!!
I just noticed that there are at least 2 posters in this thread from the Seattle area ( Rollo & DrScoles).
and 2 more futher north up I-5 ( me and Wolverine) if we could get some more we
could almost have a North West Combat League.

I better shut up before I get accused of hijacking this thread. ( sorry)

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RE: Did I screw up the wing on my avenger? - 7/23/2007 7:27:44 PM

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From: Holiday City, OH, USA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: rollo

The closest thing I can find locally with colors is duck tape. Would that work?

I bought an avenger off a club member covered in duct tape. It would not even fly with the 25 on it. I took off a pound of tape and recovered it with packing tape.... a pound

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RE: Did I screw up the wing on my avenger? - 7/23/2007 7:39:14 PM

rollo

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Capn America

I bought an avenger off a club member covered in duct tape. It would not even fly with the 25 on it. I took off a pound of tape and recovered it with packing tape.... a pound

I guess the guy was going for durability over speed.

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RE: Did I screw up the wing on my avenger? - 7/23/2007 7:48:03 PM

rollo

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From: Sammamish, WA, USA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: The Internet Killer

WOW !!!
I just noticed that there are at least 2 posters in this thread from the Seattle area ( Rollo & DrScoles).
and 2 more futher north up I-5 ( me and Wolverine) if we could get some more we
could almost have a North West Combat League.

I better shut up before I get accused of hijacking this thread. ( sorry)

Through the efforts of DrScoles there is a growing number of combat guys in the Seattle area.

(in reply to The Internet Killer)

RE: Did I screw up the wing on my avenger? - 7/23/2007 8:47:45 PM