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*G62 Just Shut Down* - 7/7/2007 2:44:15 AM   
Zippi



Posts: 3195
Joined: 6/29/2004
From: Evansville, IN, USA
Status: online 		I have a G62 on a WH Extra 300LX and it had been performing great up until today. I went through my normal start up and range check. After a couple passes the engine just shut down to idle and would not take any throttle. I got it down with only a cracked wheel pant. When I got home I checked all the fuel lines, filter, fuel dot etc. and everything looked fine. I did notice that the RTV silicone sealant I used was leaking and the muffler was very loose. When I pulled it apart there was almost nothing as far as a gasket. Could that have caused the engine to maybe lean out and not take any throttle or should I be looking for something else? This engine is basically brand new with EI from Ralph.

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RE: *G62 Just Shut Down* - 7/7/2007 2:54:31 AM   
Herby 1


 

Posts: 10
Joined: 4/26/2003
From: Northern Arizona
Status: offline 		A loose muffler won't cause the problem...
Look at the back plate, if there is only 1 nylon screw in the center, send me the engine for a new ignition circuit, no charge...

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RE: *G62 Just Shut Down* - 7/7/2007 3:00:08 AM   
Zippi



Posts: 3195
Joined: 6/29/2004
From: Evansville, IN, USA
Status: online 		RCIGN1,

I don't recall seeing a nylon screw in the center of the back plate. I'll have to pull the engine off tomorrow and take a look. What does the nylon screw hold? What if the nylon screw is still in place?

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RE: *G62 Just Shut Down* - 7/7/2007 3:09:25 AM   
Herby 1


 

Posts: 10
Joined: 4/26/2003
From: Northern Arizona
Status: offline 		The nylon screw is a 4-40 holding the ignition circuit on the plate...My old circuits used 1 screw in the center...Some of my old circuits were defective...If there are 2 screws in the plate the circuit is a C&H....Check the carb inlet needle diaphragm, it might have gotten stiff and won't meter fuel correctly...

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RE: *G62 Just Shut Down* - 7/7/2007 3:10:03 AM   
Zippi



Posts: 3195
Joined: 6/29/2004
From: Evansville, IN, USA
Status: online 		I just looked at the back plate which is kind of hard to see with it mounted but there is one screw towards one corner and the other one is center from left to right but a little low. Both look like allen head screws flush with the back plate and they are both in.

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RE: *G62 Just Shut Down* - 7/7/2007 3:23:11 AM   
Zippi



Posts: 3195
Joined: 6/29/2004
From: Evansville, IN, USA
Status: online 		Ralph,

Can you explain just where the "carb inlet needle diaphragm" is or post of pic of what I'm looking for? I know nothing of these engines so act like I'm a 2 year old when you explain this.

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RE: *G62 Just Shut Down* - 7/7/2007 4:15:41 AM   
Herby 1


 

Posts: 10
Joined: 4/26/2003
From: Northern Arizona
Status: offline 		The cover with 4 screws on the front of the carb...Take the 4 screws out, take the cover off...Hold the diaphragm and gasket between 2 fingers and flex the center...It should be completely flexible, if not I can send you a new one...

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RE: *G62 Just Shut Down* - 7/7/2007 8:54:35 AM   
Tired Old Man


 

Posts: 12012
Joined: 2/25/2002
From: Central, CA, USA
Status: offline 		On another subject, do not use a muffler gasket. They ALWAYS loosen and fall out! Obtain some Permatex "All Copper". Make a thin bead of the stuff around the muffler flange. Install the muffler and screws using red Locktite on the threads. Wipe off the excess All Copper with a paper towel. If you're nuts about a super clean look then use a paper towel wet with acetone to wipe off the excess. Let it sit for an hour or two. Then fly and forget about the muffler.

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RE: *G62 Just Shut Down* - 7/7/2007 12:39:03 PM   
ljones5000


 

Posts: 461
Joined: 7/16/2002
From: Fayetteville, NC, USA
Status: offline 		Zippi, last time I had an engine shut down to idle in the air it was the radio going into Failsafe due to low voltage. The fix was a new set of batteries.

Don't rule it out.

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RE: *G62 Just Shut Down* - 7/7/2007 12:45:47 PM   
Zippi



Posts: 3195
Joined: 6/29/2004
From: Evansville, IN, USA
Status: online 		Ralph,

I'll check that gasket before I head to the field this morning.

ljones5000,

You could have a point there but if it went into fail safe wouldn't the other controls went into fail safe as well? I was able to fly the plane to the ground. You think the high end could have been boadering being to lean and it just leaned out on me?


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RE: *G62 Just Shut Down* - 7/7/2007 12:51:34 PM   
Zippi



Posts: 3195
Joined: 6/29/2004
From: Evansville, IN, USA
Status: online
quote:

ORIGINAL: RCIGN1

The cover with 4 screws on the front of the carb...Take the 4 screws out, take the cover off...Hold the diaphragm and gasket between 2 fingers and flex the center...It should be completely flexible, if not I can send you a new one...

I pulled the front cover off and there is a little round metal ring in a piece of rubber and it seems pretty flexable.

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RE: *G62 Just Shut Down* - 7/7/2007 1:02:37 PM   
ljones5000


 

Posts: 461
Joined: 7/16/2002
From: Fayetteville, NC, USA
Status: offline 		When this happened to me, a friend was flying my Cap580 and he was in a harrier near the ground. The engine suddenly slowed to a fast idle and he was lucky to land the plane safely. We thought the engine (DA100) had over-heated so I richened the mixture and it did it again.

Maybe a week later I was flying nice and high, doing nothing strenuous on the plane and it suddenly went to idle again. I landed and finally it dawned on me that it was going into failsafe. I cycled both battery packs (JRs) and found that neither one would hold a charge. I replaced the batteries with SR packs, re-set my needles and have had no problem since and it's been almost a year.

This is more than you wanted to know, probably. But the deal on Failsafe (mine, anyway) is that the throttle is the one that is set to go to a pre-set % in case of low voltage. You can then throttle back supposedly and regain control long enough to land (assuming you have your wits about you when it happens). I use a Futaba 9C Super radio and you can set the Failsafe to whatever % you wish.

Zippi, one other thing about the batteries. When you check them, the voltage may seem ok but in flight all it takes to set off Failsafe is a TEMPORARY drop in voltage (like when you are moving the sticks). So, the check you need to make on your batteries is to cycle them and see if they are holding the rated capcity. It seems I read that if not more than 90% of rated capacity, replace them. Or even, you could have a short or a bad cell.

On the other hand, if you can't make the engine run on the ground now, you got some other problem.

< Message edited by ljones5000 -- 7/7/2007 1:15:23 PM >

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RE: *G62 Just Shut Down* - 7/7/2007 1:18:18 PM   
Zippi



Posts: 3195
Joined: 6/29/2004
From: Evansville, IN, USA
Status: online 		ljones5000,

Thanks for the info. I'm running the JR 7202 PCM and the only options I can see on the fail safe are "Hold" and "FS". I have it set to the default which is Low throttle and all other channels hold the last good signal. I'd like to turn it off just to see if that was it. I didn't check the batteries when I got down or at home but I always check before each flight. These are new packs but I as we know that don't mean didly.


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RE: *G62 Just Shut Down* - 7/7/2007 3:42:29 PM   
gboulton



Posts: 1862
Joined: 5/28/2005
From: La Vergne, TN, USA
Status: offline 		Zippi,

You don't say if this is one of Ralph's G62's or not...if it is, here's another thing to check.

There's a small (maybe 2" long if that) black neoprene hose from the crankcase to the carb, providing pulse pressure. That neoprene tends, for some reason, to dry-rot and crack fairly quickly...as it starts to go, it can cause no end of oddball problems, including shutting down the engine, backfires, surging, you name it. Check it, and if it's the least bit suspect, replace that with a piece of Tygon (or some other gas line of your choice). (Personally, I just replace it right away out of habit now, without even looking at it)

Don't know that that's it, but since learning of that issue with one of mine (thanks nogyro), I've seen/heard about it on quite a few 62's, and it's caused a rather wide range of seemingly unrelated problems.

HTH

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RE: *G62 Just Shut Down* - 7/7/2007 4:24:49 PM   
Rcpilot


 

Posts: 6663
Joined: 3/20/2002
From: Arvada, CO, USA
Status: offline 		I have a bunch of questions Zippi. The answer to these questions will help us guide you in the right direction.

So, will it start? Will it run now? Or is it dead?

If it will start now and run, I think it's possible something changed and it just leaned out.

Was it hot the other day?
Did you change your prop?
Did you change your oil?
Oil ratio?
Was it surging at full throttle on the ground before take-off?

Are you using a good fuel filter system? Using a felt clunk and filtering your fuel before it goes in the tank? It doesn't take much gunk in the screen to cause a problem.

Have you been flying this plane a lot recently? Or did you just drag it out for the first time this summer after a long storage period over the winter? Possible some oil dried up and got crusty inside the carb somewhere after sitting for a long time.

If it's just dead and won't start or run at all--listen to Ralph, or send it to him.

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RE: *G62 Just Shut Down* - 7/7/2007 8:52:39 PM   
Zippi



Posts: 3195
Joined: 6/29/2004
From: Evansville, IN, USA
Status: online 		Rcpilet,

I just came back from the field and had the same thing happen. When the engine is cold it fires up as normal and I can get a couple passes around the field and it seems like once it gets good and hot in the air it starts the problem. It will not take any throttle and if I do give any throttle it pulsates and nothing about an idle. I have been flying this plane on a weekly basis and I sent this engine to Ralph to have EI put on it. It was new when I sent it to Ralph. It was very hot but no hotter than any other day. I did not change the mix, prop, or oil. Once the problem starts it will only idle but I have to bump the idle up a little to keep it running. Like I said, if I try and give it any throttle it just pulsates. I tried to lean out the high end and richen it and the problem stayed the same. A couple of gas guys at the field said it sounded like it was an Ignition problem. I am running a filter to the carb but I have not checked the screen in the carb. Is it oposite the pump with one big screw in the middle? Seems like if there was something in the screen it would do it when it's cold as well.


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