RE: what the? Axe CP jumping in the air!

RE: what the? Axe CP jumping in the air!
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RE: what the? Axe CP jumping in the air! - 9/14/2007 2:46:14 PM

Posts: 37
Joined: 8/27/2007
From: Roseville, MI, USA
Status: offline

15-16 batts still flyin no jumping or popping , i think the molyorsomethingnamedstuff would be better as it bonds to the mainshaft on the melecuular or sumthing level

kinda the same way slick 50 bonds to the internal parts of your car engine. Im still using the after run oil on my swashplate (just a drop in 4 corners) as i have this oil from my nitro planes use it so when plane sits motor doesnt lock up

And again I AM NOT saying its a fix or I am PLEASING the heli gods but it did work very well for me , as after 15 -16 flights or batts (which ever comes first

) No jumps or pops , I waited to post this after my flights to make sure it did work , so far doing really well , getting better at hovering i only have 3 batts (green peas

) but the only time my AXE is on the ground is to change the BATT need to move to lipos but right now funds wont allow it

flyin in my basement on an area rug as my boundary and so far no major crashes , getting better at controlling her as I manage to keep her over the rug if she drifts off the rug i do shut down and recenter on the rug , training gear still on

but in time i will get up enough guts to remove them , im doing good tail in flyin but as far as nose in , im terrible , can not fly this way at all

but still trin. I heard one suggestion in here when flyin nose in (nose of heli facing you) which ever way heli is moving move the stick that way , which makes sense cause it would make heli go oppisite way its moving at least in left right direction, roll i think Yaw is controlled by tail pitch is fore and aft , roll would be left and right, right?
Nose in is tough , I have r/c cars but 2D is much more forgivin then 3D

Practice Practice Practice , any suggestions for Nose in flyin or anything that helped u other guys get better at nose in flyin , would be greatly appreciated. Also have extra main blades but still on original set , they are a little chewed up on ends but no vibration , I assume they are out of balance , but when she flies i cant see it and when i rev her up and sit on floor and look at blades no double vision , so i keep using them , also im just hovering no turns or anything yet but workin on it and im hovering all the way through the batt , Land change batt and hover some more I did notice a controll issue when batts start to get low is this normal does your guys heli's do same and will it do the same with a Li-Po ?

Its not the fall , Its that sudden stop at the end of the fall

LMK and thanks for all the great info!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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RE: what the? Axe CP jumping in the air! - 9/14/2007 5:09:52 PM

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Joined: 7/27/2007
From: Great Falls , MT, USA
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DLCRASHRC,

I've been told to time my flights. When the heli takes a lot more stick to keep it in the air, you are nearing the end of your flight (battery charge). So, if you can fly for about 6 minutes before the power starts to fade, that is pretty close to your time limit. It's the same way with LiPos. You have to keep an eye on how long you're flying so you don't loose control and crash. I have an ESC and gyro on my AXE. When power gets below a certain point (about 12 to 14 minutes of hovering) the tail motor cuts out on me. It's not quite as abrupt as that, you can hear a pitch change in the main rotor and then the Axe will slowly descend. If you give it more stick, it'll rise, but then the tail motor cuts out and then you have to set it down anyways.
I applied some antiseize on my shaft, just in the area that the swash plat rises and falls. I'll look for some of the after run oil for the swashplate itself as time permits. The moly lube you mentioned did the name sound something like molybendum lube/grease? I am a special purpose mechanic in the USAF. I'm pretty familiar with automotive oils and lubricants and their uses. I just don't know what automotive products I can use on my rc heli.

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RE: what the? Axe CP jumping in the air! - 9/14/2007 7:38:59 PM

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Joined: 1/23/2003
From: Dickinson, TX, USA
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DLCRASHRC, - the tail rotor authority fade as the battery runs down is normal - I adjusted the 3n1 pot on mine to where I need a couple of left clicks on the trim with a fresh battery, and as it fades I slowly click to center, maybe one click right. Be gentle, the adjustment is very sensitive.

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"Never use your shins as a blade tracking device" - Mike

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RE: what the? Axe CP jumping in the air! - 9/14/2007 8:45:10 PM

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Joined: 8/15/2003
From: Benton Harbor, MI, USA
Status: offline

Push the cyclic stick under the low part of the disc for nose in hover. If the heli is leaning towards YOUR left, push the stick left. If the heli is leaning nose down, push the stick aft, etc... Kinda the same idea, but you're not waiting for the heli to start moving through the air and then correcting. It leans first, then it moves, so you're one step ahead with this technique. And, while it's nose-in and everything is backwards, push the rudder stick right if you want the nose to go to your left and vice-versa. Another way to think of it is looking at the tail and push the stick the direction you want the tail to move to. Nose-in and tail to your right, pull the tail to the left by pushing the stick left.

Thinking of only 2 directions instead of 4 made things easier for me. Instead of thinking nose up, tail up, left , and right, think nose up or NOT up, and right stick or NOT right stick (for this I look at the antenna tube to keep track of right side on the heli). You are only controlling the cyclic with 2 gimbals on the radio, so only think 2 directions when applying corrections. In a word, Simplify!

(in reply to MMatheny)

RE: what the? Axe CP jumping in the air! - 9/14/2007 8:55:30 PM

Posts: 1331
Joined: 5/7/2005
From: Dwight, IL, USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: strat1960s

DLCRASHRC,

I've been told to time my flights. When the heli takes a lot more stick to keep it in the air, you are nearing the end of your flight (battery charge). So, if you can fly for about 6 minutes before the power starts to fade, that is pretty close to your time limit. It's the same way with LiPos. You have to keep an eye on how long you're flying so you don't loose control and crash. I have an ESC and gyro on my AXE. When power gets below a certain point (about 12 to 14 minutes of hovering) the tail motor cuts out on me. It's not quite as abrupt as that, you can hear a pitch change in the main rotor and then the Axe will slowly descend. If you give it more stick, it'll rise, but then the tail motor cuts out and then you have to set it down anyways.
I applied some antiseize on my shaft, just in the area that the swash plat rises and falls. I'll look for some of the after run oil for the swashplate itself as time permits. The moly lube you mentioned did the name sound something like molybendum lube/grease? I am a special purpose mechanic in the USAF. I'm pretty familiar with automotive oils and lubricants and their uses. I just don't know what automotive products I can use on my rc heli.

here's that moly stuff... and yeah, it's that molybendum stuff... I can never remember the whole name...

http://www.shootersolutions.com/molyfusion1.html

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RE: what the? Axe CP jumping in the air! - 9/15/2007 3:33:40 AM

Posts: 209
Joined: 8/6/2007
From: Winslow, ME, USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MMatheny

DLCRASHRC, - the tail rotor authority fade as the battery runs down is normal - I adjusted the 3n1 pot on mine to where I need a couple of left clicks on the trim with a fresh battery, and as it fades I slowly click to center, maybe one click right. Be gentle, the adjustment is very sensitive.

That's a great idea. Right now I'm starting out just right of center on the tail trim but after a few minutes have maxed out the right tail trim. I like the idea of making it so that I have more play room from the start. So which POT are you working with and how much are you adjusting it? CW or CCW? I usually think of any kind of rotary adjuster as a clock; given that, my middle POT is currently at about 12:30 and the bottom POT is at about 13:00. Which direction and how far do I need to turn [it/them] to get the kind of adjustment you're talking about?

Thx.

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RE: what the? Axe CP jumping in the air! - 9/15/2007 5:35:31 AM

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From: Benton Harbor, MI, USA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: HelisRule

quote:

ORIGINAL: MMatheny

DLCRASHRC, - the tail rotor authority fade as the battery runs down is normal - I adjusted the 3n1 pot on mine to where I need a couple of left clicks on the trim with a fresh battery, and as it fades I slowly click to center, maybe one click right. Be gentle, the adjustment is very sensitive.

That's a great idea. Right now I'm starting out just right of center on the tail trim but after a few minutes have maxed out the right tail trim. I like the idea of making it so that I have more play room from the start. So which POT are you working with and how much are you adjusting it? CW or CCW? I usually think of any kind of rotary adjuster as a clock; given that, my middle POT is currently at about 12:30 and the bottom POT is at about 13:00. Which direction and how far do I need to turn [it/them] to get the kind of adjustment you're talking about?

Thx.

I'll bet if you turned them to the stops and put them back you'll find that the middle pot is at 18:30 (180 degrees out) and the bottom is like you say 1300. Turn bottom pot cw and see if you need to add left trim on the TX.

(in reply to HelisRule)

RE: what the? Axe CP jumping in the air! - 9/15/2007 5:25:08 PM

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Joined: 8/27/2007
From: Roseville, MI, USA
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Thank You Gentlemen , All this info is great and we have each others support , I think is a win win and as u know those r hard to find. I keep coming back to check for new posts and I WILL report any new findings , mods , ETC This forum is excellent , Just wanted to say THANK YOU , GOOD FLYING , AND SOFT LANDINGS !!!!!!!!!!!!

Dlcrashrc

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RE: what the? Axe CP jumping in the air! - 9/16/2007 3:10:49 AM

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Joined: 8/6/2007
From: Winslow, ME, USA
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You could be right PilotLight, it may very well be 18:30. I'll check that out tomorrow, and try your suggested adjustment. How much CW adjustment should I use on the bottom POT? Or are you saying just use trial and error until I get it where it feels right?

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RE: what the? Axe CP jumping in the air! - 9/16/2007 7:27:36 PM

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From: Benton Harbor, MI, USA
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Trial and error works great. That's how most of us here have found the proper adjustments. Try 1/8th to 1/16th of a turn and see what you get.

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RE: what the? Axe CP jumping in the air! - 9/21/2007 1:26:32 PM

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Joined: 8/27/2007
From: Roseville, MI, USA
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Well gentlemen I am very sad to report that my axe is acting very strange again , after aprox 20 batts it flew great no pop no jump rock steady hover I was so pleased with the heli and myself just to be able to keep her in one spot , BUT then or I should say NOW I have a more serious problem. OK charged batts went to the basement all ready to fly , prefight check , retighten check , blade tracking check , everything ok , so started my flight about thirty seconds into 1st batt she started jumping and popping and by the way still using after run oil on swashplate cuz I had some good luck with it or at least I thought , did it once then seemed to settle down so I kept flyin then 2nd batt , flew ok about a minute got her in a pretty descent hover (im no pro) then all of a sudden with no stick input from myself the heli took a hard left turn or yaw and dropped the tail to the point the nose was almost pointing straight up , I quickly panic , shove right stick forward and PULL left stick all the way back , to my surprise or I should say to my luck the heli went down almost level and came down like a rock on the training gear , took a good look at her evrything seemed ok , so I though what was that , reluctent I take her back up this time keeping her very close to ground just enough to clear prop wash but then again I was prob in and out of it cuz i was very timmid of what it was going to do , so she is hovering pretty steady and then BAM hard left yaw , tail dropped and Im sure it did same thing first itme , but I was in such a panic I didnt hear it , while the heli made this very hard yaw and tail dropping motion I could hear a very hard surge almost like the sound when u turn the idle up switch on. The noise was very loud and I am sure it was directly related , I am stumped and very very dissapointed I will no longer fly cuz of fear of serious crash I was lucky it didnt already crash hard and it was luck when it first did it and it just landed hard (NO POWER) on the gear and tail skid.
Toady I am going to call tech support and have a long talk and ask for some serious help or maybe some kind of adjustment on eboard maybe its the bias but prob not either way I am calling for help. I am so dissapointed now I have a 200 heli I am to scared to fly cuz it is definitly very unpredictable I dont understand she flew like a rock for about 20 batts and I was so happy and NO hard landings no tipovers , no bladestrikes , She hovered like a rock, little tail rotor trim and she would stay straight as an arrow I impressed myself Cuz I am just learning and thought I was doing pretty good for a newbie. PLEASE HELP GUYS

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RE: what the? Axe CP jumping in the air! - 9/21/2007 2:45:42 PM

Posts: 37
Joined: 8/27/2007
From: Roseville, MI, USA
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GREAT NEWS GENTLE MEN , I called 217-398-8970 then push #5 to get support and skip all the crap , Explained my sitch and they told me if was DEFINITLY a servo issue (Talked to Jake) , They r currently sending me 3 brand new servos and do not want the old ones back (WHA!) I think they are aware of the sitchuation and they will prob do the same for the rest of you guys with this popping and jumping issue, I was lucky not to have a seriuos crash but the potential was definitly THERE (LUCKY) I hope passing this info on helps other people with this prob I am currently waiting for servos to arrive and WILL report back when I make the swap and test her out. I seriously hope this corrects the problem and I also explained to jake about the heat sink covering the holes on the main motor and told him how I used a dremel to cut slots in heat sink to open these slots for better cooling of the Main motor, He said he was going to pass it on to the build department so I think newer models will have the slots in the heat sink out of the box , They should of done this out the gate but hey we are human , Also like to give credit too the product support team for standing behind thier product they are very easy to deal with and I thought that was a very good trait on their part. Jake was The guy I talked to and he was excellent and very supportive with me "WAY TO GO JAKE" Dont want to jump the gun until I replace the servos and test her out , I know even with the new servos I will be very very cautious and prob scared the first flights but hope all will end well.

POPPING AND JUMPING IS DEF A SERVO ISSUE ACCORDING TO TECH AND PRODUCT SUPPORT
SO GENTLEMEN GET ON THE PHONE AND GET YOUR NEW SERVOS BEFORE SOMETHING BAD HAPPENS

dlcrashrc
P.S. Hope this helps everyone I really do , getting to the root cause of this issue would I am sure be greatly appreciated by everyone with this issue!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Good Luck , Good Flyin AND VERY SOFT LANDINGS

Your fellow Heli Pilot
dlcrashrc

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RE: what the? Axe CP jumping in the air! - 9/21/2007 9:15:45 PM

Posts: 256
Joined: 7/27/2007
From: Great Falls , MT, USA
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DLCRASHRC,

What kind of servos are they sending you??

Ted

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RE: what the? Axe CP jumping in the air! - 9/21/2007 9:31:17 PM

Posts: 1331
Joined: 5/7/2005
From: Dwight, IL, USA
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cool, I just picked up new Hitecs for the MX today, guess the e-flites that I have in that can move over to the CP and we'll see what happens then!

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