Vanquish with 4S A123

Vanquish with 4S A123
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Vanquish with 4S A123 - 9/30/2007 2:35:13 AM

Anthony-RCU

Posts: 354
Joined: 1/9/2002
From: Ossining, NY, USA
Status: offline

I wanted to get a practice plane for Masters/FAI. After reading everything I could on these I decided on the Vanquish. After reading about A123's here and on other sites I decided to try them. First four flights tonight and hope to get out tomorrow for more.
The setup is
Hitec 65 MG on the tail
Berg 7
Castle Thunderbird 54
Hacker A30-10L
APC 12x6E
Tanic 4S A123

AUW was just under 50 oz a little heavier than I had hoped. Wound up adding an ounce to the tail to get it to trim. Like I had heard from others these do tend toward nose heavy. Power seems very good about 470W @ 42A. Not sure how to measure these things since the numbers on the Watt meter jump all over. When first cranked up hot off the charger I have seen blips close to 600W!
Four flights around four minutes to be nice to the packs and put 1400ma back in. Was hoping for longer flight times. Will push more as the packs get more time on them.
My Hacker seems very tight. Even more now that it has been flown. Dorked the first landing and twisted the gear. Did a quick watt check before flight two and no change but motor feels stiff. Anyone else notice this?
Snaps were very good and tracking was good. In sharp corners felt a little weird but I may have just been going too slow. As a long time slimer it is very weird to have no sound change with throttle. Much draggier than the Aspera needs to be powered through maneuvers. Have to learn the correct throttle settings.

_____________________________

Anthony Romano
Wrong rudder is the most powerful force in the universe.

Post #: 1

RE: Vanquish with 4S A123 - 9/30/2007 2:54:18 AM

J Lachowski

Posts: 397
Joined: 9/2/2003
From: Bridgewater, NJ, USA
Status: offline

Anthony, mine is around 48 ozs all up with Lipos. I have .75 ozs on the tail. I flew tonight with the Flightpower 2500ma Evo lites. Only 5 plus minute flights. One pack 1300 plus put back in and the other around 1500ma. These packs are only 0.6 ozs heavier than the TP Extreme 2200's which are only good for about 6 to 6.5 minutes.(80-85% capacity used)

_____________________________

Joe Lachowski
NSRCA 330

(in reply to Anthony-RCU)

Post #: 2

RE: Vanquish with 4S A123 - 10/1/2007 6:50:01 PM

Anthony-RCU

Posts: 354
Joined: 1/9/2002
From: Ossining, NY, USA
Status: offline

Half a dozen flights yesterday in a little wind. Duration 5 mins and the last couple of flight put back 2000 mah. Getting close to the time limit. Very disappointed with the short flights. A friend let me try his 4S 2100 lipo. Wow! Did that thing move. Unfortunately, flight time dropped to about 4 mins and that thing came out WARM! 4S 3200 lipo's may be the answer? Boy I hope not $$$$. Waiting for the local hobby shop to get in an 11*8 E maybe it will be better with more pitch speed. Can't get a decent 8 point because I don't want to use full throttle. Needs more testing. Hoping to get out before work tomorrow.

_____________________________

Anthony Romano
Wrong rudder is the most powerful force in the universe.

(in reply to J Lachowski)

Post #: 3

RE: Vanquish with 4S A123 - 10/1/2007 8:19:27 PM

J Lachowski

Posts: 397
Joined: 9/2/2003
From: Bridgewater, NJ, USA
Status: offline

I flew 10 flights with my 2200 Extremes and EVO lite 2500's yesterday. I set my timer for 6 minutes every flight. I could get a Masters sequence in just before or right at 6 minutes. I typically put in 1800 to 1900 ma's just about everytime. Usually by the time I landed it was about 6.5ish minutes. Flew one of the EVO lite 2500's for a good 7ish minutes and put back 2100 ma's. Temps on that pack were close to 130 F though. All other flights were typically under 120 F. Running the Torque/Air Boss/12X6 APC setup. Next time out I will set the timer for 6.5 minutes on the Evo lites.

I like the the 2500 EVO lites better. You can get them for less than $100 a piece with a Tower $25 off special. They are only 0.6 oz heavier than the TP 2200ma Extremes and have the same balance taps. No balance tap adapters necessary.

Anyone want to buy two 2200ma TP Extremes for the price of one? They have 6 and 8 flights on them only. I'm serious.

_____________________________

Joe Lachowski
NSRCA 330

(in reply to Anthony-RCU)

Post #: 4

RE: Vanquish with 4S A123 - 10/1/2007 8:40:25 PM

bobferguson

Posts: 260
Joined: 6/21/2003
From: Mission, BC, CANADA
Status: offline

Do you know what the current is on the tp extreme 2200?

quote:

ORIGINAL: J Lachowski

I flew 10 flights with my 2200 Extremes and EVO lite 2500's yesterday. I set my timer for 6 minutes every flight. I could get a Masters sequence in just before or right at 6 minutes. I typically put in 1800 to 1900 ma's just about everytime. Usually by the time I landed it was about 6.5ish minutes. Flew one of the EVO lite 2500's for a good 7ish minutes and put back 2100 ma's. Temps on that pack were close to 130 F though. All other flights were typically under 120 F. Running the Torque/Air Boss/12X6 APC setup. Next time out I will set the timer for 6.5 minutes on the Evo lites.

I like the the 2500 EVO lites better. You can get them for less than $100 a piece with a Tower $25 off special. They are only 0.6 oz heavier than the TP 2200ma Extremes and have the same balance taps. No balance tap adapters necessary.

Anyone want to buy two 2200ma TP Extremes for the price of one? They have 6 and 8 flights on them only. I'm serious.

(in reply to J Lachowski)

Post #: 5

RE: Vanquish with 4S A123 - 10/2/2007 12:30:29 AM

J Lachowski

Posts: 397
Joined: 9/2/2003
From: Bridgewater, NJ, USA
Status: offline

I just hooked up my Medusa Power Analyzer to one of my TP 2200 packs. It static peaked at about 43 amps on fresh charge at full throttle and then declined a few amps afterwards. Power is very good with these packs. It is just duration that I am not 100% satisfied with. I do not like to discharge beyond 80 to 85% of the packs capacity and that is what I try to maintain. I'm sure these packs are fine if you are a 3D'er. For a pattern flyer they are just enough to complete an AMA Masters Sequence and land with a decent margine of safety. I'm sure there might be a better prop combination but haven't experimented with it and I am satisfied for the time being with the 12X6.

_____________________________

Joe Lachowski
NSRCA 330

(in reply to bobferguson)

Post #: 6

RE: Vanquish with 4S A123 - 10/2/2007 12:40:18 AM

bobferguson

Posts: 260
Joined: 6/21/2003
From: Mission, BC, CANADA
Status: offline

I just sent back four extreme 2200 3s1p packs to TP. They would maybe get to 25 amps at best before going into lvc. They are sending me replacements. You got 43 amps! If I can get a burst for 30-45seconds of 35 amps I will be very happy. I am getting tp2200 v2 I am told. We'll see when they get here.
Ar your packs v2 or what color band do they have and what is the date on them.

quote:

ORIGINAL: J Lachowski

I just hooked up my Medusa Power Analyzer to one of my TP 2200 packs. It static peaked at about 43 amps on fresh charge at full throttle and then declined a few amps afterwards. Power is very good with these packs. It is just duration that I am not 100% satisfied with. I do not like to discharge beyond 80 to 85% of the packs capacity and that is what I try to maintain. I'm sure these packs are fine if you are a 3D'er. For a pattern flyer they are just enough to complete an AMA Masters Sequence and land with a decent margine of safety. I'm sure there might be a better prop combination but haven't experimented with it and I am satisfied for the time being with the 12X6.

(in reply to J Lachowski)

Post #: 7

RE: Vanquish with 4S A123 - 10/2/2007 2:29:40 AM

TerryTill

Posts: 47
Joined: 7/11/2003
From: alexandria, VA, USA
Status: offline

"My Hacker seems very tight. Even more now that it has been flown. Dorked the first landing and twisted the gear. Did a quick watt check before flight two and no change but motor feels stiff. Anyone else notice this?"
I suspect this is just the field strength of the magnets.
You can go to www.neumotors.com or www.aveox.com and use their motor calculator. If your within a few amps of the predicted result you're fine. The motors not going to feel "free" because of the magnetic strength. The motor calculators give an idea of what to expect. Just don't expect matching numbers Aveox's predictions run a little high in amps.
As far as flight times, you should easily get 6-7 minutes with good throttle control.
Terry

(in reply to bobferguson)

Post #: 8

RE: Vanquish with 4S A123 - 10/2/2007 2:43:59 AM

J Lachowski

Posts: 397
Joined: 9/2/2003
From: Bridgewater, NJ, USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: bobferguson

I just sent back four extreme 2200 3s1p packs to TP. They would maybe get to 25 amps at best before going into lvc. They are sending me replacements. You got 43 amps! If I can get a burst for 30-45seconds of 35 amps I will be very happy. I am getting tp2200 v2 I am told. We'll see when they get here.
Ar your packs v2 or what color band do they have and what is the date on them.

Keep in mind, I'm using 4S packs <g>

They are dated 9/01/07. I think the color band on the label is yellow if that is what you are talking about.

_____________________________

Joe Lachowski
NSRCA 330

(in reply to bobferguson)

Post #: 9

RE: Vanquish with 4S A123 - 10/2/2007 1:46:54 PM

Anthony-RCU

Posts: 354
Joined: 1/9/2002
From: Ossining, NY, USA
Status: offline

When it is warm the motor barely turns. I thought I might have bent something with the bad landing. That is why the run up on the meter before the second flight. Flip the prop now and it spins a little but after a flight it barely turns. Will temp it today.

_____________________________

Anthony Romano
Wrong rudder is the most powerful force in the universe.

(in reply to TerryTill)

Post #: 10

RE: Vanquish with 4S A123 - 10/2/2007 5:48:30 PM

TerryTill

Posts: 47
Joined: 7/11/2003
From: alexandria, VA, USA
Status: offline

You should contact http://www.hackerbrushless.com/contact.shtml
and see if it needs to be repaired. It should not be any tighter after a run IMHO.

Terry

(in reply to Anthony-RCU)

Post #: 11

RE: Vanquish with 4S A123 - 10/2/2007 6:16:16 PM

Anthony-RCU

Posts: 354
Joined: 1/9/2002
From: Ossining, NY, USA
Status: offline

Was planning on shooting them an email. Temp gun hasn't arrived yet but the motor could easily pass the 5 second test after each flight. Beautiful fall day with almost no wind 3 flights this morning around 6.5 mins mot. Put 1800 mah back into the first two packs. Second flight was the current Masters with a few extra and the other two were P09 plus a few. Starting to get a feel for how much power is needed. Really had fun today. Makes me think about getting more packs!

_____________________________

Anthony Romano
Wrong rudder is the most powerful force in the universe.

(in reply to TerryTill)

Post #: 12

RE: Vanquish with 4S A123 - 10/25/2007 2:19:05 PM

RealOverlord

Posts: 6
Joined: 10/28/2005
From: Douglas, IRELAND
Status: offline

can any 1 tell me if you can use a diff setup from the 1 on box that will give f3a style performance on 3s lipos?the vanquish i got looks great and i want to make sure i fit right setup to get the most out of it for pattern style flying,not 3d.

(in reply to Anthony-RCU)

Post #: 13

RE: Vanquish with 4S A123 - 10/25/2007 8:34:51 PM

Anthony-RCU

Posts: 354
Joined: 1/9/2002
From: Ossining, NY, USA
Status: offline

Remember Volts are your friends. I know most people have 3S pack and the jump to 4S is significant but you will be happier with more power. Running 3S you will need to pull some decent amps in this size plane and push your packs pretty hard. This is why most go to 2P when doing this. Now you need twice as many batteries and chargers while adding weight without the watts.
This is why I tried the A123's. If I had the budget the next thing I would like to try would be a 3250 4S lipo. Similar weight as the A123's but more volts available. I am fairly new to E power but it all seems like an endless experiment.

_____________________________

Anthony Romano
Wrong rudder is the most powerful force in the universe.

(in reply to RealOverlord)

Post #: 14

RE: Vanquish with 4S A123 - 11/17/2007 4:45:54 PM

Anthony-RCU

Posts: 354
Joined: 1/9/2002
From: Ossining, NY, USA
Status: offline

Have almost 40 flights total and very happy with the whole setup. Trimming is getting very close and having lots of fun with the 09 schedules.
Finally got some flights with an 11*8 and didn't like it. Cruise speed was good but at high throttle the packs just fell flat and duration suffers. The 11 also has NO brakes on down lines. Wish my ESC had a brake setting. Hoping to fly today with the 12*6 to compare.
Found why the motor was tight. After being unplugged the CC ESC holds some current in the motor making it hard to turn. Didn't know it but my smaller plane does the same thing. Almost 600W with the 12*6 and it barely gets warm.
Now also thinking about a higher output charger. The Cellpro works well but only puts out 3 amps on 4S. Missing a big advantage to the A123 by not being able to charge faster.

_____________________________

Anthony Romano
Wrong rudder is the most powerful force in the universe.

(in reply to Anthony-RCU)