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RE: Elan Has Arrived! - 6/18/2009 11:00 AM   
Kallem


 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Doc...
Maybe I miss understood Patricia but I thought she told me the booms were fibereglass as well. 


Yes, the booms are fibreglass in the Elan. Elevator and wings are wooden.



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RE: Elan Has Arrived! - 6/18/2009 4:39 PM   
turbinepeter


 

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BaldEagle

Sorry to here you have broke both of your Dreamwork Oleos.

 I am using and have always used Oleos from Sandor. Never had a problem with them, and all spares are available. Sandor always gives fantastic service. I ordered a spare Trunion block, and two days later it arrived on my doorstep.

 I AM NOT KNOCKING DREAMWORKS.  Just giving my experience of using Digitech.

Regards

Peter

P.S
Hows the Transfer?



< Message edited by turbinepeter -- 6/18/2009 5:12 PM >

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RE: Elan Has Arrived! - 6/18/2009 5:07 PM   
lov2flyrc



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ORIGINAL: BaldEagel

Doc

Looking at the sharp edges to the paint trim lines, I do not think a clear coat has been applied, also the trim strips on the booms (not paint) can lift, that also makes me thing that no clear coat is applied.

What retracts are you using? I have broken both sides of my Dreamworks one's now.

Mike



Mike,
Please contact me regarding your Pro-Link gear, I would like to discuss the issues you are having.
Todd



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RE: Elan Has Arrived! - 6/18/2009 9:49 PM  1 votes
BaldEagel



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The booms are fibreglass, but have trim strips on them.

Mike

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RE: Elan Has Arrived! - 6/19/2009 7:43 AM   
Doc...


 

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My Elan arrived today and was blown away by the quality of the paint job.  I was also impressed with the way the flaps are designed.  I had no idea the turdle deck was fibereglassed as well.  The Navy scheme is really nice.  I will have either my Sprint  or the Elan on display at the Toledo Show next  year at the booth for JPO, (Jet Pilots Organization).  Just received my Video CanOne-2 yesterday and just affexed it to the the Sprint tonight.   Hope to use it this Sunday.  If it comes out good, I'll post the link to You Tube.  Latter.

Doc...

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RE: Elan Has Arrived! - 6/19/2009 8:28 AM  1 votes
BaldEagel



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I have the transfer on the Elan, will post a pic later, as I am off to the field to verify the Pitot with the GPS, will post my findings later.

I will now be able to do a direct comparison between the Dreamworks olios and the Digitec as I now have a set of Digitec Olios installed will report back after I have a few landings on the new ones.

Mike

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RE: Elan Has Arrived! - 6/19/2009 8:34 AM   
BaldEagel



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quote:

ORIGINAL: Doc...

Hi Mike,

My Elan arrived today and was blown away by the quality of the paint job.  I was also impressed with the way the flaps are designed.  I had no idea the turdle deck was fibereglassed as well.  The Navy scheme is really nice.  I will have either my Sprint  or the Elan on display at the Toledo Show next  year at the booth for JPO, (Jet Pilots Organization).  Just received my Video CanOne-2 yesterday and just affexed it to the the Sprint tonight.   Hope to use it this Sunday.  If it comes out good, I'll post the link to You Tube.  Latter.

Doc...


The turtle deck being fibreglass as well I see as a big step forward, in the development of the Boomerang range, this is why I have put off buying an XL up to now, when the update arrives???? with a fibreglass one piece fus and stub wings then I will flex the plastic, especially if it comes in a British colour scheme, are you listening Alan.

Mike

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RE: Elan Has Arrived! - 6/20/2009 12:25 AM  1 votes
BaldEagel



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quote:

ORIGINAL: lov2flyrc


quote:

ORIGINAL: BaldEagel

Doc

Looking at the sharp edges to the paint trim lines, I do not think a clear coat has been applied, also the trim strips on the booms (not paint) can lift, that also makes me thing that no clear coat is applied.

What retracts are you using? I have broken both sides of my Dreamworks one's now.

Mike



Mike,
Please contact me regarding your Pro-Link gear, I would like to discuss the issues you are having.
Todd




Todd

Sent an e-mail to you immediatly you posted this, have not received a reply from you.

Mike


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RE: Elan Has Arrived! - 6/20/2009 7:56 AM  1 votes
BaldEagel



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Status: online 		GPS vs Pitot

I now have my GPS installed in the Elan with the Jetcat P80 on board, the pitot gives a fairly consistant max reading of 135MPH without any diving runs or trying to get the speed up to maximum possible, the average speed is again fairly consistant at 80MPH, the interesting thing is with the GPS installed the top speed was 158MPH and the average was down to 63MPH, was I rearly flying in a 20MPH wind, airspeed vs groundspeed, it was windy, the only way to verify these readings is to fly when it is calm and re-evaluate the two readouts against each other.

Maximum height was 396ft which is good as we have a restriction of 400ft on model aircraft over 7Kg in the UK, it took a while for the GPS to set itself up and is still an hour behind on time which is understandable as not everone works to British Summer time.  Maximum No of satalites seen is 9.

The most interesting bit of information on this unit is the G pulled, this has averaged out at 3.7G, but the maximum seen is 6.5G, this I think was in a hard turn away from a no fly zone that I have imposed on myself due to it being over a bridle path.  Lots of other information on this unit which I will not boar you with unless someone is interested?

Oh yes I used half flap for the first time on take off just to see how short I could make the ground run, it took off like an overpowered 3D foamy, rearly a silly sort run, but fun nontheless, with a full tank on board, do all Elans have to be hauled off the deck with elevator without flap? or is just me?

Mike

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RE: Elan Has Arrived! - 6/20/2009 8:49 AM   
turbinepeter


 

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That info makes intersting reading.

Is it the Jetcat GPS system you are using?

I often wondered what height I get to when flying and goes without saying everybody wants to know how fast there Jet goes. Got a P120 in mine, and while its not as quick as my old Comp Flash, the Elan P120 combo still entertains.

P.S.

I always use first stage flap on Take Off, really helps in not having to give a big dollop of Elavator to get it to rotate. Make sure your Elan sits level. All Elans need around20mm of packing under the front retract !!!!!!!(maybe Alan can address this issue)

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RE: Elan Has Arrived! - 6/20/2009 9:06 AM  1 votes
BaldEagel



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Yes it is the Jetcat GPS, I looking for the downloadabel software that is supposed to be available for it, but can only find the turbine software at the moment.

I have a P120SX to go into my Rookie when I finish it, maybe it needs proving in the Elan first.

The sit on its wheels is slightly nose up now I have fitted a pair of Digitech olios, this is due to the smaller wheels I have put on the retracts as opposed to the Intairco ones that came with the Dreamworks olios.  Glad to hear you need a "big dollop" of elevator to help it rotate, as I said earlier in this thread the main problem with installing most front retracts is the hole needed for the retract air tube through the bearer, this is certainly the case with the Dreamworks retracts, I don't know where the Jet A1's come out, but comming out at right angles is not convenient to say the least.

Mike



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RE: Elan Has Arrived! - 6/20/2009 2:07 PM   
Countryboy



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quote:

ORIGINAL: BaldEagel

Peter

Yes it is the Jetcat GPS, I looking for the downloadabel software that is supposed to be available for it, but can only find the turbine software at the moment.

I have a P120SX to go into my Rookie when I finish it, maybe it needs proving in the Elan first.

The sit on its wheels is slightly nose up now I have fitted a pair of Digitech olios, this is due to the smaller wheels I have put on the retracts as opposed to the Intairco ones that came with the Dreamworks olios.  Glad to hear you need a "big dollop" of elevator to help it rotate, as I said earlier in this thread the main problem with installing most front retracts is the hole needed for the retract air tube through the bearer, this is certainly the case with the Dreamworks retracts, I don't know where the Jet A1's come out, but comming out at right angles is not convenient to say the least.

Mike




Maybe not the most convenient, but most certainly not a major task to overcome. A slight relief in the bearer is all that is needed. As for clear coat, mine is most defintely clear coated.



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RE: Elan Has Arrived! - 6/20/2009 3:24 PM  1 votes
BaldEagel



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Status: online 		In the realm of things needed to be done on a ARTF airframe the drilling of the bearer to get the air line into the retract mechanism is a major task, relieving the bearer is not an option due to the weakening of same if flying off the normal type of UK surface, you guys in the US don't know how lucky you are.  There is not enough room to get a right angle drill in between the bearers and it is far enough down to prevent an adequate angle with a conventional drill, so Countryboy tell us how you would do it without compromising the strength of the retract bearer.

As the trim strips have peeled off I can catagoracaly say mine is not clear coated over the trim strips.

Mike

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RE: Elan Has Arrived! - 6/20/2009 3:25 PM   
tucson


 

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Status: offline 		Bald Eagle,

I had to groove out more then a bit of wood to allow the air tube to slip on the rear nipple of the nose gear retract also. This made me uncomfortable with the remaining strength left on of the bearers. I did make a side support for the wood bearer to add additional support. I am not sure it really needed it but better safe then sorry.

Interesting information on the speeds and amount of G's pulled. When I used to fly full scale competition aerobatics, The maximum I saw was 61/2 G's when I tried to keep myself from flying out of the box.
I really never checked real close the air speed at that moment, but I was pulling pretty hard on the stick. Speed was 180-200 mph.

I would think that Models pull more g's then that the way some of us fly :-))

Stan

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RE: Elan Has Arrived! - 6/20/2009 4:19 PM   
tucson


 

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Status: offline 		Has anyone used the BVM clear brake line?

I am about to give up trying to get it on the nipple.

Todd suggested chewing it a bit, I tried that , still difficult to do.

Any suggestions out there?

Thanks,
Stan

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RE: Elan Has Arrived! - 6/20/2009 5:18 PM   
Countryboy



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quote:

ORIGINAL: BaldEagel

In the realm of things needed to be done on a ARTF airframe the drilling of the bearer to get the air line into the retract mechanism is a major task, relieving the bearer is not an option due to the weakening of same if flying off the normal type of UK surface, you guys in the US don't know how lucky you are.  There is not enough room to get a right angle drill in between the bearers and it is far enough down to prevent an adequate angle with a conventional drill, so Countryboy tell us how you would do it without compromising the strength of the retract bearer.

As the trim strips have peeled off I can catagoracaly say mine is not clear coated over the trim strips.

Mike


I haven't looked that close to see if the clear was applied before or after the trim was applied on the booms, but there is a definite clear coat  which I thought was the original question regarding whether or not the Elan was clear coated. Notice the half dollar size spot of clear coat missing in the photo.

As for the retract bearer, a zip bit chucked in the dremel quickly makes room for the retract air nipple. IMO, not enough material is removed too significantly weaken the bearer to the extent that it is a concern.



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RE: Elan Has Arrived! - 6/20/2009 5:30 PM   
Doc...


 

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I had a problem with that but here is what I did to make life better.  I used a hex driver that was just a tad larger than the opening on the brake line.  Then I wiped the top of the driver with just a touch of machine oil with my thumb and four finger.  Then I inserted it into the hole going in about 1/4".   At this point the driver should be pretty secure.  I then took my heat gun and went back and forth over the section the driver is in.  Don't get it to hot.  You can see and feel it softening up which at that point I pulled the driver out of the line and immediatly slipped it on the nipple.  It is improtant at this point not to work with that area until it's completly cooled.  A drop or two of cold water here works. 

Hopes this works,

Doc...

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RE: Elan Has Arrived! - 6/20/2009 5:35 PM   
tucson


 

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Looks like you used more then the 1/2" blocks to  elevate your nose gear. If you used the 1/2" blocks the channel for the nipple would be lower down in the nose compartment and harder to reach with a dremel or otherwise. I used 1/2" blocks and I could see no way to get that low in the block with out tearing it up. That's why I glued a support to the side of the beam. When I originaly trial fit 1" blocks the nipple area was easier to reach.

Stan

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RE: Elan Has Arrived! - 6/20/2009 6:55 PM   
tucson


 

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Thanks for the tip. It worked for me also.

Thanks,
Stan

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RE: Elan Has Arrived! - 6/20/2009 11:26 PM   
Countryboy



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Your correct, the blocks are closer to 3/4". I wanted and needed as much height in the nose gear as I could get.


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RE: Elan Has Arrived! - 6/22/2009 10:00 AM  1 votes
BaldEagel



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quote:

ORIGINAL: Countryboy

As for the retract bearer, a zip bit chucked in the dremel quickly makes room for the retract air nipple. IMO, not enough material is removed too significantly weaken the bearer to the extent that it is a concern.



With due respect by not making your packing block full length you have introduced a point load at the mid span of what is effectivly a beam, in structural terms this is to be avoided at all costs if possible, as I said earlier you guys in the US do not know how lucky you are with your smooth surface airstrips, you can possilby get away with the above off a tarmac surface, but in the UK that UC would dissintigrate in about four landings off our normal pasture landing areas, if you now consider the packing being essentially full length of the original beam you will see the problem encountered, with the packing only 1/2" high as mine was originally the hole for the retract air line would need to be in the middle of the original beam, a hole drilled through the middle of the web of a beam will not substantially weaken the load bearing capacity of said beam, this is the best structural solution to the problem encountered, alternativly the air nipple could have been more conveniently placed, what would be ideal would be for the air cylinder to be able to rotate so that each individual instalation could be taken into account and the nipple placed in whatever position the end user requires.

Mike


< Message edited by BaldEagel -- 6/22/2009 12:30 PM >

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RE: Elan Has Arrived! - 6/22/2009 12:26 PM   
geh3


 

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Status: offline 		My elan has a tiny bit of + incidence with no packing on the front beams.. and it has trailing link mains. With this set up it takes off very easy with just a little up elevator...The trailing links do compress somewhat when the plane starts rolling which adds to the + incidence...overall it flys great. My CG is a little behind the figure in the Elan manual...

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RE: Elan Has Arrived! - 6/22/2009 3:27 PM  1 votes
BaldEagel



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What make and length of front leg do you have?  your trailing link mains will be around the same as everyone one else as the length is dictated by the whell well.

Mike

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RE: Elan Has Arrived! - 6/22/2009 3:37 PM   
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Status: offline 		I have jet A-1 units with trailing links... with a full tank, my Elan is very slightly positive.. I can see that when I  apply up elevator to rotate, the trailing links collapse a lttle
and then the plane takes off nicely.. this plane flys great I really don't think it matters what you have at rest even slightly - it will still take off just fine... my CG is 1/8" further back that the recommended starting point in the elan manual

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RE: Elan Has Arrived! - 6/22/2009 3:50 PM  1 votes
BaldEagel



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Status: online 		I had the Dreamworks legs and packed up the front retract by 20mm and had a spacer made to go on the front leg to get it even higher, this was the only way to get any where near a positive angle of attack on the ground which I needed to allow short take offs, with half fap deployed I can take off in about 25ft, and now I have increased my up aileron on crow I can land in about 30ft roll out that is.

I have my C of G about 20mm back from the recommended which has made it more pitch sensitive, but has stopped the nose dropping in turns and having to pull a lot of elevator, I have my P80 up for sale at the moment as I have a P120SX to put in it which should be fun.

Mike

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