RE: Formation of two tank leagues

RE: Formation of two tank leagues
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RE: Formation of two tank leagues - 11/30/2007 5:32:08 PM

YHR

Posts: 1776
Joined: 11/29/2006
From: Grande Prairie, AB, CANADA
Status: offline

Jeff

For the record, you called my comment on "function over form" bull, and then went on to say with input like that things will never get off the ground. So lets just be clear about who fired the first salvo shall we, and respect the opinions and ideas of others.

< Message edited by YHR -- 11/30/2007 5:54:37 PM >

(in reply to Panther F)

Post #: 76

RE: Formation of two tank leagues - 11/30/2007 5:36:51 PM

Panther F

Posts: 2131
Joined: 12/31/2005
From: Franklin, IN, USA
Status: offline

Whatever your name is, clearly you have a problem. So let's just stay out of each other's hair from now on just to keep the peace.

Sounds like the mature thing to do.

Jeff

_____________________________

HL StuG III, Tamiya: M4 Sherman, M4A1E8 Sherman, Sturmtiger, T-34/85 and an M26A1 Pershing

(in reply to YHR)

Post #: 77

RE: Formation of two tank leagues - 11/30/2007 5:46:32 PM

YHR

Posts: 1776
Joined: 11/29/2006
From: Grande Prairie, AB, CANADA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: OliverLove

I am a huge fan of YHR's idea of using the tank speed instead of the shape for what qualifies as a medium or heavy. That way its fair again, exactly the way it actually way, the faster tanks represent light tanks and can take fewer hits and depend on speed, while a geardowned tank that rumbles along will qualify as a heavy no matter its shape.

Then again the Texas mindset seems the best so far, throw rules out the window and have a blast!

The bottom line is to have fun. To keep it simple let the tank velocity determine how many hits it can take.

0- 20 SMPH= heavy
20-30 smph= medium
30-40 smph= light
>40 smph= super light

A guy shows up. He runs his tank through the speed trap, and it is classified.

A Tiger moving along > 40 is classified a super light, and that is the price you pay for not wanting to run it at scale speeds. Seems pretty simple to police and implement without a whole bunch of cost to the partcipants. If a guys goes to the trouble of regearing or electronically controlling the top end then he can then reap the benefits in battle as his tank falls into line with what it is supposed to prototypically be.

(in reply to OliverLove)

Post #: 78

RE: Formation of two tank leagues - 11/30/2007 5:50:50 PM

YHR

Posts: 1776
Joined: 11/29/2006
From: Grande Prairie, AB, CANADA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Panther F

Whatever your name is, clearly you have a problem. So let's just stay out of each other's hair from now on just to keep the peace.

Sounds like the mature thing to do.

Jeff

Just never stops

Nice thing about the written word it is all there for everyone to read. I am perfectly fine with the words I have written, and am quite Ok with the forum membership making up their own minds if I have a problem or not. As far as staying out of each others hair that is one thing we can agree on.

< Message edited by YHR -- 11/30/2007 5:53:12 PM >

(in reply to Panther F)

Post #: 79

RE: Formation of two tank leagues - 11/30/2007 5:55:00 PM

Panther F

Posts: 2131
Joined: 12/31/2005
From: Franklin, IN, USA
Status: offline

I think it's up to each club to run whatever type of alterations of their rule they want to. Heck, if they want to classify the tank by color, than so be it.

A Tiger tank that is a little too fast should be able to play but show them how to slow it down some eventually by the next time they use it. Making up new restrictions and changing clasifications on the fly is totally up to you.

Jeff

_____________________________

HL StuG III, Tamiya: M4 Sherman, M4A1E8 Sherman, Sturmtiger, T-34/85 and an M26A1 Pershing

(in reply to OliverLove)

Post #: 80

RE: Formation of two tank leagues - 11/30/2007 5:57:45 PM

Panther F

Posts: 2131
Joined: 12/31/2005
From: Franklin, IN, USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: YHR

quote:

ORIGINAL: Panther F

Whatever your name is, clearly you have a problem. So let's just stay out of each other's hair from now on just to keep the peace.

Sounds like the mature thing to do.

Jeff

Just never stops

Nice thing about the written word it is all there for everyone to read. I am perfectly fine with the words I have written, and am quite Ok with the forum membership making up their own minds if I have a problem or not. As far as staying out of each others hair that is one thing we can agree on.

"Just never stops" Then good, it's ended.

GREAT!!!

Jeff

_____________________________

HL StuG III, Tamiya: M4 Sherman, M4A1E8 Sherman, Sturmtiger, T-34/85 and an M26A1 Pershing

(in reply to YHR)

Post #: 81

RE: Formation of two tank leagues - 11/30/2007 6:11:05 PM

b.bullfrog

Posts: 165
Joined: 5/30/2006
From: jacksonville, FL, USA
Status: offline

Ya'll are going about this the wrong way.But I would prefer ya'll conversing by e-mails instead of this thread.No not everyone is going to like what I come up with- I would be suprised if everyone did. But it will be better that what was out there to start with.

(in reply to Panther F)

Post #: 82

RE: Formation of two tank leagues - 11/30/2007 6:14:14 PM

icecreamslick

Posts: 2576
Joined: 1/5/2005
From: Conroe, TX, USA
Status: offline

quote:

I am a huge fan of YHR's idea of using the tank speed instead of the shape for what qualifies as a medium or heavy. That way its fair again, exactly the way it actually way, the faster tanks represent light tanks and can take fewer hits and depend on speed, while a geardowned tank that rumbles along will qualify as a heavy no matter its shape.

quote:

The bottom line is to have fun. To keep it simple let the tank velocity determine how many hits it can take.

0- 20 SMPH= heavy
20-30 smph= medium
30-40 smph= light
>40 smph= super light

A guy shows up. He runs his tank through the speed trap, and it is classified.

So, you guys think that all Tamiya King Tigers should be clssified as "light" since they are the fastest WWII tanks made by Tamiya?

That is just a plain fact. A lot of KT owners may disagree with your decision. I'm sure that I will never put a gear reduction into one of my tanks just because it was designed and built to move faster than scale speed for that model.

Sorry for the negativity guys, but I just can't seem to get my mind around the reason for rules. As long as no one slams into my tank intentionally or runs over and slaps my wife, I'm pretty much okay.

Shenlonco, StoneColdFreak and I will just have to play together, by ourselves.

_____________________________

"I find television very educating. Every time somebody turns on the set, I go into the other room and read a book."

(in reply to YHR)

Post #: 83

RE: Formation of two tank leagues - 11/30/2007 6:17:39 PM

heavyaslead

Posts: 850
Joined: 11/18/2002
From: Loganville, GA, USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: YHR

quote:

ORIGINAL: OliverLove

I am a huge fan of YHR's idea of using the tank speed instead of the shape for what qualifies as a medium or heavy. That way its fair again, exactly the way it actually way, the faster tanks represent light tanks and can take fewer hits and depend on speed, while a geardowned tank that rumbles along will qualify as a heavy no matter its shape.

Then again the Texas mindset seems the best so far, throw rules out the window and have a blast!

The bottom line is to have fun. To keep it simple let the tank velocity determine how many hits it can take.

0- 20 SMPH= heavy
20-30 smph= medium
30-40 smph= light
>40 smph= super light

A guy shows up. He runs his tank through the speed trap, and it is classified.

A Tiger moving along > 40 is classified a super light, and that is the price you pay for not wanting to run it at scale speeds. Seems pretty simple to police and implement without a whole bunch of cost to the partcipants. If a guys goes to the trouble of regearing or electronically controlling the top end then he can then reap the benefits in battle as his tank falls into line with what it is supposed to prototypically be.

There seems to be some imperical validity in this over-speed idea, had not thought of it from that viewpoint.

For instance, instead of penalizing the entrant, it is simply reclassified based on the TBS system which is the electronic judge on the battlefield.

It is interesting that this method is not saying they are too fast and can't play, but more like (this is what you need to) slow it down then you can be re-classed (to more hits).

_____________________________

Cheers
Eric Scott

(in reply to YHR)

Post #: 84

RE: Formation of two tank leagues - 11/30/2007 6:20:47 PM

Panther F

Posts: 2131
Joined: 12/31/2005
From: Franklin, IN, USA
Status: offline

You're right Bill. I forgot not everyone lives in America and believes in free speach, then goes and cries wolf about the forum rules.

As far as speed dictating class. Play that rule into your own club, no one else will agree to that at all. Sign me up icecreamslick. I have a stock Sturm that isn't a light tank.

My PM box is awaiting.

Jeff

_____________________________

HL StuG III, Tamiya: M4 Sherman, M4A1E8 Sherman, Sturmtiger, T-34/85 and an M26A1 Pershing

(in reply to b.bullfrog)

Post #: 85

RE: Formation of two tank leagues - 11/30/2007 6:22:10 PM

YHR

Posts: 1776
Joined: 11/29/2006
From: Grande Prairie, AB, CANADA
Status: offline

I am just throwing ideas out there.

I know it goes against the grain to consider a heavy tank, light and I hear where you are coming from. It was just a suggestion if the speed is a problem.

Personally If my "Heavy" tank was running circles around tanks that were supposed to be faster, then I wouldn't have a problem considering my tank a light for IR combat.

If it bothered me too much I would probably look at ways of gearing it down so my heavy would be classified as a heavy.

(in reply to icecreamslick)

Post #: 86

RE: Formation of two tank leagues - 11/30/2007 7:58:01 PM

icecreamslick

Posts: 2576
Joined: 1/5/2005
From: Conroe, TX, USA
Status: offline

I wonder...

Does anyone at one of the tank clubs have a radar gun? Someone could just calculate without a radar gun, but I would love to know the exact speed at which each of the Tamiya models moves in the stock, out of the box, form. I think that if we had those figures (I realize that EVERY Sherman tank made by Tamiya will not have the same speed as every other Sherman made by Tamiya), we would likely see that they are all too fast to be classified as heavy or even medium. If that were to be the case, everyone would be in the lightweight class, we would all be even again and there would be no need to set rules.

Maybe if we all used the exact same formula or method, we could each measure and post our current scale speed, as a basis for comparison. A country-wide experiment.

Who knows the best or easiest way to measure the scale speed of your tank? I'm sure I can figure out my own, but we all need to use the same method if we are going to get a good estimate.

_____________________________

"I find television very educating. Every time somebody turns on the set, I go into the other room and read a book."

(in reply to heavyaslead)

Post #: 87

RE: Formation of two tank leagues - 11/30/2007 8:26:24 PM

heavyaslead

Posts: 850
Joined: 11/18/2002
From: Loganville, GA, USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: icecreamslick

quote:

everyone would be in the lightweight class, we would all be even again and there would be no need to set rules.

Quite true, quite true!

Many of us calculate speed by runing a 25 foot straight flat level course (like driveway) and stopwatch the seconds then divide 272 by this number. (applies to 16th scale only)

For 25 foot course:

272/sec = scale mph

< Message edited by heavyaslead -- 11/30/2007 8:27:26 PM >

_____________________________

Cheers
Eric Scott

(in reply to icecreamslick)

Post #: 88

RE: Formation of two tank leagues - 11/30/2007 9:12:11 PM

YHR