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RE: ASP/MAGNUM FS400AR Rebuild/Overhaul - 6/3/2010 5:49 PM   
Primi


 

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From: Jimboomba, AUSTRALIA
Status: offline 		Congratulation Kmot,

you did a excellent job on this engine, I always followed your build and learned a lot. Especially how you made the exhaust for your engine. I like to make also one for my nine cylinder Seidel the problem I have is how you seal the connection between exhaust bent and the ring, as it looks you only plugged the bends into the ring, does this not blow oil out on the sites when the engine runs? Alternative I would silver solder the two pieces together could you tell me how you did it and how good it works?

Thanks
Primi

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RE: ASP/MAGNUM FS400AR Rebuild/Overhaul - 6/3/2010 7:15 PM   
Kmot



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ORIGINAL: dragonfly60

Please tell me there is video?


Yes! And it's a very large file for a very special engine (to me anyway)!

Youtube version:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7bvhd67Za88

Hi resolution Full HD version:

http://www.vimeo.com/12261417

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RE: ASP/MAGNUM FS400AR Rebuild/Overhaul - 6/3/2010 7:18 PM   
Kmot



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Status: offline 		Primi, the chrome exhaust pipes only slip into the tubes of the exhaust ring. I drilled the tubes so that the fit was very snug. No oil or exhaust blows past the slip connection between the two.

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RE: ASP/MAGNUM FS400AR Rebuild/Overhaul - 6/4/2010 1:57 AM   
dragonfly60


 

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Status: offline 		Loved the video, great work, it's running soooooo sweeeeeet!

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RE: ASP/MAGNUM FS400AR Rebuild/Overhaul - 6/4/2010 3:28 AM   
Dad_Roman



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You da man!

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RE: ASP/MAGNUM FS400AR Rebuild/Overhaul - 6/4/2010 7:18 AM   
Kmot



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Status: offline 		Thanks fella's!

Now, here is the rest of the story........

I set up the engine on the test stand. I filled the fuel tank. Making sure the glow plugs did not have any current, I closed the choke on the carb, opened the throttle wide, and started pulling the prop through to prime the engine. I could not see any fuel traveling through the lines. (Could have been because of the bright sunlight). I must have cranked it over 20 or 30 times. Now, no way in heck was I going to try to start this engine by hand, if I was not getting fuel up to it. All those videos on Youtube showing hand starting this engine, I was like "BS!!" lol...

So I thought I had better hit it with the electric starter (plugs still off) to see if I could get some fuel flowing. I had that brand new Tru-Turn spinner hub on there. I had also polished it nicely. I was using a new to me, Sullivan 24V starter that has a metal cone, as compared to my old Sullivan 12V starter with a plastic cone. The motor was hard to crank, and I did not apply the starter forcefully enough and so it jumped off the spinner and the metal cone, spinning wildly fast, proceeded to dig into my nice, new, shiney spinner hub. All the way across it!

Aye yie yie........

I have already sanded out the gouges and re-polished it good as new.

Well I still did not see fuel travelling through the line, but I figured it MUST have after I spun it up a fair amount with the starter on the second try.

So I turned on the glow driver, and you saw in the video what happened. It started immediately.

Some other things I learned.........

Stay-Brite brand silver bearing solder will not hold up to the heat of a four stroke engine. After all was said and done, the solder had softened and 4 of 5 inlet stubs had come undone.

I was quite surprised, about that. I thought sure it would be just fine. It melts at 430°F, so the exhaust is getting fairly hot. I can repair the ring muffler though, and I will. I did some quick researching and found some "sil-phos" brazing rod for copper.

Another thing I learned, is that Rustoleum high heat BBQ paint is not fuel proof. After the engine cooled off and I was wiping it down, the paint came right off on the rag.

Oh well, live and learn!

Thanks everyone, for following along on this overhaul thread.

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RE: ASP/MAGNUM FS400AR Rebuild/Overhaul - 6/9/2010 3:02 AM   
Kmot



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Status: offline 		Just a quick update:

I repaired the exhaust ring by brazing it with something called "Sil-Phos" rod.

It did the trick.

I just ran the engine again, full power and leaned out to peak rpm and nothing came loose like the Stay-Brite silver solder did.

Something I noted, was with the exhaust ring the maximum rpm attained is down about 300 from running with all straight open pipes. So it's a bit of a trade-off. But the sound of the ring muffler is just so awesome!

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RE: ASP/MAGNUM FS400AR Rebuild/Overhaul - 6/9/2010 5:46 AM   
Jazzy



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Status: offline 		I bet it does sound great!! Glad it's working well. I wonder if another exhaust opening, say at around 4:30, would help with the RPM drop. Of course that would mean relocating the pressure nipple to 10:00 or 1:30 or thereabouts The idea of symmetry with respect to the exhaust openings does appeal to the engineer side of me!
Maybe we could HEAR what the exhaust ring sounds like? (Hint, hint, hint.)

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RE: ASP/MAGNUM FS400AR Rebuild/Overhaul - 6/9/2010 8:10 AM   
Kmot



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ORIGINAL: Jazzy


Maybe we could HEAR what the exhaust ring sounds like? (Hint, hint, hint.)


You mean from behind the engine, Jeff?

Yeah, that's coming. I did record the next run on video. And since there were no issues with the exhaust pipes I was able to take my camcorder and walk around the running engine.



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RE: ASP/MAGNUM FS400AR Rebuild/Overhaul - 6/10/2010 4:11 AM   
Kmot



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Status: offline 		Here you go Jazzy. I warn anyone else, this video is for gearheads only and model engine fanatics in particular. Anyone else will quickly get bored.

In the middle of this video there are a couple of short segments where I walked around the running engine with the camcorder.

It's 11 minutes long and too long for Youtube. Even at that it is about half of the footage shot of this run.



http://www.vimeo.com/12423224





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RE: ASP/MAGNUM FS400AR Rebuild/Overhaul - 6/11/2010 6:42 AM   
Jazzy



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Status: offline 		Thanks Tom! Great video.

You were right - the sound of the radial with the exhaust ring makes an "I gotta have one of those!" sound! Just imagine how four of those would sound on one aircraft...

Fantastic! Keep us posted.

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RE: ASP/MAGNUM FS400AR Rebuild/Overhaul - 6/18/2010 7:46 PM   
Kmot



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ORIGINAL: Jazzy


Fantastic! Keep us posted.


Okay.

Here is an update, and a WARNING to other FS400 owners:

I decided to try another propeller, a Zinger 20x6-10. I had been using a Master Airscrew wood prop.

When I inserted the internal jam nut and tightened it down, it took more turning than normal to tighten the jam nut. I did not think anything of it. When I installed the Tru-Turn spinner hub, it did not seat against the prop. The screw tightened all the way, but the spinner "spun". This had me confused so I took the spinner hub off and went to loosen the jam nut and have a look.

Well, the problem was the Zinger prop was slightly thinner than the MA prop. This caused the jam nut to seat against the tip of the crankshaft, before it was actually tight. Big ol' dumb me, I just kept tightening it until it was 'tight'.

So when I went to remove the jam nut, it was dragging hard as I backed it off. I knew right away what had happened. I managed to pull some threads off the crankshaft!

A problem I have had all my adult life, is that I do not know my own strength. I am very strong, and will easily overtighten things. I did it to the crankshaft. When I got the jam nut and major nut off, I had ruined the top two threads of the crank. Fortunately, I have a 3/8-24 die and I repaired the tip of the crank so that it is virtually unnoticeable and the nuts spin on effortlessly.

So the WARNING: Be careful and pay attention to the thickness of the prop. The jam nut only needs to be snugged up, not reefed on. And if you are a gorilla like me, you can and will damage your threads if you try to take up the slack from a too thin prop.

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RE: ASP/MAGNUM FS400AR Rebuild/Overhaul - 6/18/2010 10:12 PM   
JNorton



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Status: offline 		A buddy of mine installed 3/4" galvanized pipe with a pair of 12" pipe channel locks. It took me a 36" pipe wrench to budge them 2 years later.

John

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RE: ASP/MAGNUM FS400AR Rebuild/Overhaul - 6/20/2010 7:18 AM   
Kmot



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Status: offline 		Hahaha, yeah John I know the type.

My family always complains when I put a lid on a jar or a cap on a soda bottle. I swear I only 'snug it up' but they can never get them open again. Sissies........

I have made another version of the collector ring. This one has the exhaust outlet pointing straight down. I also inserted a length of tube in the outlet where I can attach the drain line from the crankcase. The muffler is a little more restrictive than the other one, but that's okay. I tested a big prop today, a 22x10. I could really hear the difference in the load applied to the engine as it was making it work harder. It also idled much lower, 1350 RPM.

Here is a video of todays run if anyone is interested:

http://www.vimeo.com/12703597

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RE: ASP/MAGNUM FS400AR Rebuild/Overhaul - 6/20/2010 7:26 AM   
Ram-bro


 

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Status: online 		Kmot, do you plan on opening her back up anytime soon to see if any other issues have arisen?

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RE: ASP/MAGNUM FS400AR Rebuild/Overhaul - 6/20/2010 8:03 AM   
Dad_Roman



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ORIGINAL: Kmot


Here is a video of todays run if anyone is interested:




Are you kidding???

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RE: ASP/MAGNUM FS400AR Rebuild/Overhaul - 6/20/2010 8:26 AM   
Kmot



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ORIGINAL: Ram-bro

Kmot, do you plan on opening her back up anytime soon to see if any other issues have arisen?



Umm.... actually yes I did already. After the first couple of runs I took a look inside. Except for a small bit of leftover polishing residue that I managed to miss cleaning out somehow (I tried!) it looked real nice inside. I also rechecked the valve clearances and took compression readings.











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RE: ASP/MAGNUM FS400AR Rebuild/Overhaul - 6/20/2010 8:33 AM   
Ram-bro


 

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Status: online 		glad to see that Kmot. So for us guys who have yet to run ours, any recommendations?

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RE: ASP/MAGNUM FS400AR Rebuild/Overhaul - 6/20/2010 10:02 AM   
Kmot



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Status: offline 		I would just check valve clearances. I ran mine out of the box, and as it turned out the valve adjustments were out of spec by quite a bit. The manual says how to set the carb needles, and when I set my LSN according to the manual my engine will not start. So my settings are HSN 3.5 turns out from closed, and the LSN 5 turns in from 'all the way out'. That is what has worked the best for me so far. YMMV.

Get a good battery for the glow plugs. 5 plugs eat a lot of current. The first time I tried running this engine I had two of those large 1.5V dry cells wired in parallel and the 5 plugs drained them in a matter of minutes. I then made up a 10A pack of C-cell NiCds which worked fine. Now I am using the Microsens Glow5LP and a 8A LiPo battery.

If you use a fuel filter in your line, be alert for it to cause any fuel delivery issues. Mine was giving me fits until I figured it out.

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RE: ASP/MAGNUM FS400AR Rebuild/Overhaul - 6/20/2010 5:16 PM   
Dad_Roman



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Status: offline 		You see that??? Gots his own compression gauge for glow motors



Whats the compression run on your motor and some others in general?

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RE: ASP/MAGNUM FS400AR Rebuild/Overhaul - 6/20/2010 7:05 PM   
Kmot



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ORIGINAL: Dad_Roman

You see that??? Gots his own compression gauge for glow motors



Whats the compression run on your motor and some others in general?


You can have one too!

https://myatomic.com/catalog/viewsku?sku=HCAP2600&itemname=engine_comp_gauge_0-60psi

Well, so far the compression readings are 54 psi to 60 psi on this ASP radial.

I am going to buy the Dynamite gauge as well since it goes to 160 psi.

http://www.rcplanet.com/Dynamite_Compression_Gauge_p/dyn2514.htm

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RE: ASP/MAGNUM FS400AR Rebuild/Overhaul - 6/20/2010 10:11 PM   
Ram-bro


 

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Status: online 		Kmot, appreciate that much. When I et done finishing the Beacat, I will be putting your experiences into service

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RE: ASP/MAGNUM FS400AR Rebuild/Overhaul - 6/20/2010 11:22 PM   
Kmot



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RE: ASP/MAGNUM FS400AR Rebuild/Overhaul - 6/20/2010 11:49 PM   
Ram-bro


 

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RE: ASP/MAGNUM FS400AR Rebuild/Overhaul - 6/22/2010 1:40 AM   
MarvinE255


 

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Status: offline 		Kmot , I finally tried the OS FR%-300 carb on the asp 400. It is not a plug and play swap. Here are the #

Os carb barrel ID .2750 ASP .2775
OD of rt. angle ASP carb mount .3930 ID of the OS carb .3440 above the o-ring.

All the screw holes line up and are even the same tread and length. The os spacer is identical to the ASP spacer. There might be a slight interference between the OS throttle stop screw and the right angle housing be this can easily be solved. It boils down to needing to enlarge the OS carb case bore about .050. This would probably destroy the o-ring groove on the OS carb. Perhaps .025 off the right angle adaptor and .025 out of the carb. bore. May try this soon and let you know. The other alternative is to see if the carb mount off the FR%-300 would mount right up. I will research this and see what I can find.

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