Posts: 50
Joined: 11/24/2005 From: Madison, AL, USA Status: offline
Is there any significant organized electric pylon racing here or abroad?
I've seen some threads about specific electric planes usable for pylon racing (like the Slipso400 and the Adrenaline Rush), but have not found much about where or how they are actually raced - whether it's on the same courses and general procedures and rules as glo-racers, or in completely different formats.
I got wind of some electric pylon racing in New Zealand, but have not found much about it other than they fly electrics on the same courses as glo-planes, using the same procedures, etc.
Can anyone point me in the right direction?
I got interested in this when a local former glo-pylon racer developed a Bluecor electric pylon racer and a set of club racing procedures and rules for some intra-club contests he hopes to get organized for 2008. I started looking around to see what's currently happening in electric pylon racing and did not find much online.
Posts: 183
Joined: 4/25/2005 From: Dickson,
TN, USA Status: offline
Jim;
There doesn't seem to be much electric pylon racing activity that I know of. I'd like to see more of this type of racing.
Don Stegall of RCPro http://www.rcpro.org/html/rules/electric_p-51/rules.htm has proposed a small electric racing class. I have seen this plane fly at a little race for GWS warbirds that I ran a year ago last October in central Florida. We ran a short 330 foot 2-pole course, according to the AMA rulebook. Since then, I've moved away from Florida and now live near Nashville TN.
Last summer I did talk to someone in your area about pylon racing and that person told me something about electric pylon racing in your area. I wonder if it was you that I had talked to then.
I'd be interested in your rules and your races. Is this "Bluecor" board you mentioned the blue fan-fold styrofoam insulation board sold at places like Lowes and Home Depot that is about 3/16" to 1/4" thick? What power do you propose, etc.
I would suggest that fly your proposed class on a standard AMA course using a format and procedures similar to what AMA suggests. Use a course size appropriate to the speed and power of your planes.
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Joined: 12/10/2001 From: Castaic,
CA, USA Status: offline
F5D is quite popular in Europe. About as many fly it in the USA as F3D. They fly the standard FAI pylon course. They fly about as fast as Q40s. The worlds are in the Ukraine this summer. Troy Peterson, Dan Kane and Travis Flynn are on the USA team. Gary Freeman is the alternate.
Denis
< Message edited by djlyon -- 12/24/2007 3:59:45 PM >
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Posts: 558
Joined: 8/8/2005 From: Monroe,
NC, USA Status: offline
There is not a lot of organized electric racing in the US. There is some racing in California, San Diego in particular.
The electric racing class that Doug provided the link to has a lot of potential. The airplanes go together easily, and fly pretty nicely. They are not for beginners however. I actually sold 4 in one day at the race at Firetower Flyers in Greenville, SC on 12-15. I think we will be doing some racing with them in 2008. The E194 with the geared motor has been superceeded by the E194B P-51 Mustang - EP ( Brushless). And it has the same motor as the Voodoo Mustang EP.
The airframe is the same for both planes. The Voodoo just has a different canopy. The stock motor is not a powerhouse, but it gets the job done at a really nice price. The ARF kits come with the motor and replacement motors are just $25.
A 3 cell 2100 mAh LiPo battery is perfect for these planes. And any 25 amp brushlessESC will do, as they only pull about 20 amps depending on the prop used. AirBorne has a TWM 25 amp ESC for only $33.
They come with a folding propeller. But I switch out the spinner for the 1.5" The World Models plastic spinner and use an APC 9x6E prop.
The only issue for racing is battery replacement. You have to take the wing off to change the battery. That means taking off the scoop. But that is only 1 screw plus the 2 wing bolts. I actually cut the covering away from a lightening hole in the fuselage just in front of the wing. I can then connect the battery to the ESC, or charge the battery without taking the wing off.
If you only fly a 10 lap heat and then land, you might not even have to charge the battery for the second heat. They will fly for 10-15 minutes at full throttle.
If you have an questions about this plane or racing class, please feel free to ask away. I have one set up and I have a lot of experience with the plane.
Oh, one more thing. The wheels that come with the plane are not suitable for grass fields. They are only 1.5" or so in size. I replaced mine with 50mm wheels from a TWM J-3 Cub EP and taking off of grass is now no problem. The 50mm wheels are available from AirBorne Models for $3.30 a pair. AirBorne also has a great 3 cell 2100 mAh LiPo battery wired for balancing. It works great with the Great Planes ElectriFly Equinox LiPo Cell Balancer 1-5.
Technology has been a barrier for electric racing. This plane, along with the accessories mentioned is a great plug-n-play setup that any modeler can handle with just a little advice.
< Message edited by DonStegall -- 12/24/2007 2:19:58 PM >
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Posts: 50
Joined: 11/24/2005 From: Madison, AL, USA Status: offline
Doug:
Thanks!
I appreciate the link to the RCPro P51 electric racing class. I had not seen that interesting single-plane class!
Nashville is just about 2 hours from Huntsville, depending. Perhaps we can see you at a race this summer, perhaps many! Or at a NASF Sailplane TD event over at New Market if you're into sailplanes.
Yes, this is the fan-fold blue stuff from Lowes. Makes a very inexpensive, repairable, tough plane. And it's Blue unless you do something about that!
The plane I've seen is called the Blue Ray. with a 24 inch wingspan, 10 oz min. weight. The developer and organizing ramrod, Tim Batt, is proposing club racing quite different from the AMA 3- or 2-pylon glo-racing formats to reduce racing manpower requirements and to fit their flying field (Epps Field, a real airport!) His thinking so far is: Boat-race-type start, 100 feet between two pylons, count laps for 2 minutes, two classes: 2S and 3S power, no motor or prop limits, limit contestants to two LiPo packs and 1 charger, with 2-minute heats run every 15 minutes to keep the flying field level. Looks like fun to me!
I've practiced by myself some on a 100 foot course with a Diddlerod (3 oz!) and then with an Ultrafly Outrage biplane. That's a pilot's course as compared with an all-out-speed course. You can really see the pylons and the planes. It should be exciting!
Thanks so much, and hope to meet you this summer! Jim Marconnet
quote:
ORIGINAL: dwbebens
Jim;
There doesn't seem to be much electric pylon racing activity that I know of. I'd like to see more of this type of racing.
Don Stegall of RCPro http://www.rcpro.org/html/rules/electric_p-51/rules.htm has proposed a small electric racing class. I have seen this plane fly at a little race for GWS warbirds that I ran a year ago last October in central Florida. We ran a short 330 foot 2-pole course, according to the AMA rulebook. Since then, I've moved away from Florida and now live near Nashville TN.
Last summer I did talk to someone in your area about pylon racing and that person told me something about electric pylon racing in your area. I wonder if it was you that I had talked to then.
I'd be interested in your rules and your races. Is this "Bluecor" board you mentioned the blue fan-fold styrofoam insulation board sold at places like Lowes and Home Depot that is about 3/16" to 1/4" thick? What power do you propose, etc.
I would suggest that fly your proposed class on a standard AMA course using a format and procedures similar to what AMA suggests. Use a course size appropriate to the speed and power of your planes.
Posts: 5912
Joined: 12/8/2002 From: Valdese,
NC, USA Status: offline
The lekky guys in SoCal have some Sick fast models. Single blade carbon fiber props and stuff like that. 2 bills plus not even trying. Very cool stuff.
If my Voodoo makes it past my son we look forward to racing it this year.
Posts: 183
Joined: 4/25/2005 From: Dickson,
TN, USA Status: offline
Jim;
I am SO interested. I fly electrics now quite a bit - - anything from 100 Watt foamies to 400 Watt Q-500 type planes.
The "race-boat" start you mentioned sounds just like the "flying start" we use for our races here in Nashville and in Florida and elsewhere. I really enjoy that kind of start. With hand launched models, this type of start would be a logical method to use.
The race course size you propose should be about right for the planes you show. You're right, it should be a pilot's race rather than an all-out speed dash. It should be fun. You might find that after trying that short course for a while, that a longer one may be better. Try it first and see what happens.
That model you show looks like it would be cheap, easy to build, fairly durable, and a good flyer. A one design such as that is an excellent way to start out. I'm in. Let me know of your progress and keep us all posted on this forum and other forums.
I would suggest that you also correspond with Don Stegall about pylon racing. He is a strong proponent of entry level and other types of pylon racing.
Also, find out what next year's pylon schedule is (as it develops) so you don't hold races same day as another one relatively nearby. The Nashville races for next year haven't been set yet. Watch the sites http://www.mtrcs.com/ and http://www.mtrcca.org/ for race scheduling in and around Nashville. You will learn where other races are by perusing the various pylon discussion forums.
Doug Bebensee
< Message edited by dwbebens -- 12/24/2007 6:37:14 PM >
Posts: 50
Joined: 11/24/2005 From: Madison, AL, USA Status: offline
Doug:
Thanks for the enthusiasm and the great suggestions and specific links.
Tim tells me that the Blue Ray wing is really tough! Ask him how he knows! :-) It is rubber-banded on, but not too tightly, and I'm sure that helps.
The one design suggestion has caught some local flack from pilots who bought other (balsa wood!) pylon plane kits (Slipso400 and Adrenaline Rush) some time ago, but who have not gotten them assembled, much less flying. The Blue Ray looks quick to get into the air, especially with Tim making some wings up for local sale. He made some glueing and sanding jigs that speed up that process a lot. He mentioned making up a dozen or so wings. If this takes off, then that dozen will be a drop in the bucket!
The start Tim uses is as follows: Starts: A designated starter shall be used for timing. Each race shall begin with a flying start. Pilots will have 30 seconds to launch airplanes. After 30 seconds time, a 10 second countdown will start. The time shall be called out by the starter 10-9-8-7-6-5-4-3-2-1-GO! Each pilot must time their crossing of the start finish line so that they do not cross the line before the GO call is given. If a plane crosses the line before the GO command is given, the pilot will receive a one lap penalty.
I'll certainly be watching the Nashville schedules as they are announced and will consider coming up to see one of your races this summer.
Posts: 183
Joined: 4/25/2005 From: Dickson,
TN, USA Status: offline
Jim;
The race starting procedure you described is just like the one we and others use for our "flying starts". Also, this type of start is like the Reno racers use. It is a lot of fun to fly in and a lot of fun to watch that kind of start.
I think the plans for your races are very sound. You should "stick to your guns" and proceed as planned. If you try to please everyone, you'll end up pleasing no one. Clearly formulate and settle upon your rules - - the earlier the better. One word of advice I'd like to give you after over 30 years in pylon racing is - - make sure your rules prevent cubic dollars from becoming a factor. The "any motor" rule might be a problem.
I would like plans (or a kit) for that plane ASAP. Like I said before, I'm in.
Posts: 50
Joined: 11/24/2005 From: Madison, AL, USA Status: offline
Doug:
I love your term "Cubic Dollars"! That says a lot.
I've talked to Tim Batt a little about his thoughts on the rules set he is circulating for discussion. The open motor and open prop rules are to let people run whatever they have and/or what seems to work best for them. If they use a really expensive motor, yes, there could be a performance advantage. But then again they are risking more $$ when crashes occur. Tim pointed out to me that crashes are a When not an If.
Limiting a pilot to two (LiPo) packs and one charger is to equalize things. The guy with a little tiny light battery (plane still within the minimum weight limit, of course) may not be able to keep it charged sufficiently to go fast all the heats. And it may sag a lot under load. The guy with a huge pack may not ever need to charge it, but he pays a weight penalty. So there is a balancing act that will give pilots a lot of leeway to run what equipment they already have, instead of having to buy a specific set of motor, LiPos, etc. for this racing. I just hope enough locals like it too to make it a great start in 2008.
Tim will be back focused on this some time early in 2008. I hope to catch up with him then.
Jim Marconnet
quote:
ORIGINAL: dwbebens
Jim;
The race starting procedure you described is just like the one we and others use for our "flying starts". Also, this type of start is like the Reno racers use. It is a lot of fun to fly in and a lot of fun to watch that kind of start.
I think the plans for your races are very sound. You should "stick to your guns" and proceed as planned. If you try to please everyone, you'll end up pleasing no one. Clearly formulate and settle upon your rules - - the earlier the better. One word of advice I'd like to give you after over 30 years in pylon racing is - - make sure your rules prevent cubic dollars from becoming a factor. The "any motor" rule might be a problem.
I would like plans (or a kit) for that plane ASAP. Like I said before, I'm in.
Posts: 3
Joined: 8/2/2006 From: , WA, USA Status: offline
It looks like you guys are well on your way here, but I thought I'd provide a link to a local club that's been quite successful racing electric pylon racers over the last few years. Their turnouts are on the rise and they seem to have created a good set of rules to keep things competitive but allow for experimentation for those that choose to.
Posts: 50
Joined: 11/24/2005 From: Madison, AL, USA Status: offline
Jerrett:
Thanks so much for the encouragement and the link to that wealth of info and experience. It does look like they are doing well in several different classes of pylon racing and having fun!
I was a little confused by the mixture of new and older information, but that's OK. They have a work in process!
One thing that occurred to me as I read thru all this was that it may be quite different getting something started from nothing as compared to simply adding a new class/event to an existing club/flying site/schedule. Neither Tim's current NARCA Club nor the RCRC club that he's going to talk to in January about his proposed sport pylon racing currently do any pylon racing at all.
Also, I noticed that at one time they apparently flew the electrics right with the glo-planes. But this year they won't do that. I'd love to see a short "lessons learned" on that experience!
Thanks again, Jim
quote:
ORIGINAL: Jerrett
It looks like you guys are well on your way here, but I thought I'd provide a link to a local club that's been quite successful racing electric pylon racers over the last few years. Their turnouts are on the rise and they seem to have created a good set of rules to keep things competitive but allow for experimentation for those that choose to.
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Where, if anywhere, is electric pylon racing? - 
