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RE: Struggling with Single Rotor basics - 1/3/2008 3:30 AM   
J-MICHAEL



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From: SEQUIM, WA, USA
Status: offline 		Xyster--

That is the neatest little thing in your video...Lol.. Looks like a big bug ! That would be a fun thing to 'mod' out. I understand your lack of space to fly... I to have just a small yard to fly in. It makes it a little challenging to try and fly my CPP which reminds me of your Walkera and likes to go all over the place...! It's tameable, but with lots of practice... So with that, I'am still working on who's the boss thing with the CPP...lol.. The new Trex lets you be the boss almost instantly with my same skills that I give the CPP... It does just gets easier as you move to a belt driven heli. I found the light... But I still like my CPP, as challenging as it is.....

Have a good one,


-- Jeff

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RE: Struggling with Single Rotor basics - 1/3/2008 4:07 AM   
stump3r



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Status: offline 		Jeff, do you have the Belt CP? If so what's your honest opinion on her? A winner?

Thanks,
Shane

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RE: Struggling with Single Rotor basics - 1/3/2008 4:31 AM   
J-MICHAEL



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Status: offline 		Shane--

No, don't have the Belt CP...Just the CX2, 2 CPP's & the Trex... But I've heard good things about them. If ya posted that question on whether there good or not, in the Esky forum, you would hear the same... For the price, you get a lot of heli... I'am choosing the HBK2 for my next, as the size is a little smaller for my yard, but still belt driven.

Take care,


-- Jeff

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RE: Struggling with Single Rotor basics - 1/4/2008 1:02 AM   
choppersrule


 

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Status: offline 		xyster101,

I watched both of your videos, enjoyed both, loved the bug one. I just wanted to pass this on to ya, I notice that with the Walkera video, that your are having some "tail bob" going on. The two most likely causes are a bent spindle/feathering shaft or your blade grips are to tight.

Dave / Choppersrule

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RE: Struggling with Single Rotor basics - 1/5/2008 11:29 PM   
Mortocaster


 

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From: Oslo, NORWAY
Status: offline 		Hi.

I'm new to this hobby, and as fresh as you get'em.

My first heli was the CX2, and it didn't last long before I rushed to the www to get some
more info on how the heck this works ;-) this is now two months ago.
After a few minutes I stumbled over Soloboss's very informative and very well written and explained
setup guide to the CX2. I have to thank you for putting that up. Thank you

Also it didn't last long before I started buying upgrades fore my "new love" either.
Yes, I see that it's not necessarily a wise thing to do, and in a lot of ways have the opposite effect than intended.
But who cares, this is so fun, and my cards are all dancing in my wallet..
(Paypal even sent me a Christmas card this year, and hoped for a good relationship for 2008 as well)

Now, of course I have taken the step a lot faster than whats sensible, but I got myself a Walkera 4#1 FP as a Christmas gift
"to dad from Santa..." (works every time, the "better half" is so exited about her own presents, she hardly notice )
I don't even master the CX2 fully, so it's plain stupid, but I had to have it... I'm sure you all know the itch..

How hard is it to understand this heli without any guidance... very.
I see these videos put up by you guys, and I am very impressed by the skills and how fast you master to hover them in your living room and gardens. J-Michael it's inspiring to see how you fly between fences and trees.. makes me wanna go down in my garage and do yet another "half-a-pack of battery before i spread the heli all over the place

As I have gathered from reading this tremendous thread for the last couple of days, setup is everything.
I follow with great interest solos posts, and have to say that the support from the rest of you are really warm and up cheering, when
a man is about to crack from frustration (at least thats what i imagine he's about to do sometimes. I know I do).

Now, since this thread is all about the FP, and how to get a good and stable flight, I am a little surprised that none of you have
posted this link I'm about to post (as fare as I have seen). Maybe you have all seen it, and I'm making a total a$$ of myself here,
but if not, this have been useful to me at least. Hopefully this is of some value to you as well, and to Soloboss in particular, since
you have given (probably) a lot of fresh CX2 owners a proper guideline trough their frustrations.
So I hope to contribute with something useful to this thread.
It's made on the basis of a Honey Bee FP, but I believe it's about the same issues.
And a lot of it are covered here already... well, enough excuses, here it is:

http://www.eflightwiki.com/eflightwiki/index.php?title=HoneyBeeFP

Best,
Morten, Norway.


< Message edited by Mortocaster -- 1/6/2008 12:09 AM >

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RE: Struggling with Single Rotor basics - 1/6/2008 12:04 AM   
xyster101


 

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Status: offline 		That is an excellent post about the HB!! Good read. I already wore out one tail motor. Very odd when it happens. I was close to the ground when it happened. Heli just spun around about 10 times as I lowered it. I am able to land on my coffee table now!

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RE: Struggling with Single Rotor basics - 1/6/2008 1:13 AM   
soloboss


 

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Status: offline 		Mortocaster,
You are very welcome for the CX setup guide. To create that guide was a labor of of love. These little helis are a wonder. Every time a new guy posts a thank-you note I know that the time taken was well spent.
In return, thank you for the FP link. I'll spend some time and go over that information.
When a new flier stops at this forum for a chat, I always note where he is from. Oslo, Norway. Fantastic. These little helicopters bring like-thinking people together from all over the world. Truly Excellent!

You may have noticed that I make no mention of alloy upgrades in the paper. That's not because I'm not a believer in the upgrades. Upgrades have different requirements for different people. At one time, I would do anything to save 2 grams weight. Then I wanted more power. Then a different look. Now I have the full Xtreme Sport Performance package and the look is great - for me. See photo. Others need to have as much alloy as possible. As you upgrade, think about what each part is supposed to provide, ask other's opinions of the part, then spend wisely. Upgrade one part at a time so you know the effect of each part and the interactions of parts. And don't forget to have fun.

And about the Walkera and it's siblings. Great fun and a great challenge. Again there are so many variables and I am still learning. My reflexes aren't what I want them to be. Today I realized that I do need to apply white marking so the paddle tops so I can readily see the plate. As long as I fly the plate, I fly level. Adjustments to compensate for the air movements are getting more controlled. I'll get this. Several of us are looking toward our next heli already and there is ongoing discussion about what to get.
For now, my Falcon 40 is my primary subject of discussion. I have the Super Skids on it and I fly using NiMH 9.6 volt Blade CP battery packs. Those packs are easy to come by - many fliers with a Blade CP will give them away if you pay the postage. Motors (main and tail) from the Blade CP are a perfect fit and work very well with the larger power packs and are very good for use in a trainer. Not like brushless, but good to learn to fly.I find them hugely energetic, they charge quickly and they aren't fussy like LiPO packs. I have LiPO packs for when I can actually fly this thing. And one day I will fly it. The rampage is over, and I'm back in learning mode.

Welcome to the Collective. When you are here, you are among friends.
We are all students.
We are all teachers.
We are the Collective.
You will be assimilated.

Soloboss




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RE: Struggling with Single Rotor basics - 1/6/2008 4:10 PM   
scale_edge



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Status: offline 		another cause for fp death wobble (read the wiki) is a fragged but not totally broken off bearing pin in the rotor head, or not having the bearing in there lol - still don't have a clue where that bearing went, just wasn't in there - flight was bag of cats at lift-off with instant death wobble - also can happen with only 2 o-ring dampers in a cp head instead of 4 (don't know where they went either, just weren't in there at repair time - i can see how the fp's bearing could come out cause they are outside, but the o-rings are inside the head on the feathering shaft and held in with the grips) - i suspect the helicopter gremlins stole them

edge

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RE: Struggling with Single Rotor basics - 1/6/2008 4:49 PM   
soloboss


 

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Status: offline 		If you have an infestation of helicopter gremlins, you need an exterminator. I thought that my gremlins would fall off the heli with my lousy piloting skills (Lousy skills - there's an oxymoron). Seems they have a good grip on the blades. I've not had a bad enough crash to dislodge them from my heli.

And I did check. I have all my bearings and my bits are properly pinned. At this juncture I am solely to blame for the wild heli excursions.

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RE: Struggling with Single Rotor basics - 1/6/2008 5:37 PM   
stump3r



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Status: offline 		xyster, so you are landing on the coffee table now. Very nice, I'm coming down for lessons, I still have no control over my #4, I do know now that it is pilot vs. the machine. I'm gonna win come hell or high water.

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RE: Struggling with Single Rotor basics - 1/6/2008 5:52 PM   
soloboss


 

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Status: offline 		Me too, Stump3r. My nephew has a plastic helicopter with wheels and a friction motor. Ya push it on the coffee table and let go and it rolls along and lights flash and the rotor goes around. I caught on to that one pretty quickly. I seldom drive off the coffee table after only 90 minutes practice. Blades aren't replaceable, but the whole helicopter is only a buck. I think I found my niche. I'm selling the RC version.

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RE: Struggling with Single Rotor basics - 1/6/2008 6:28 PM   
stump3r



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Status: offline 		Well after trying to fly this morning I'm thinking you better send me one of those too Solo. Chewed up another rotor core, going to try to Goldslinger the broken one as I'm on my last one. I'm going to rebuild the entire top end. I have a hell of a wobble, not sure if it's a bent shaft or what the hell. I have more coming so it's not an issue. I'm really really getting tired of not being able to fly this damn thing. I can hover it in the sim but no luck in real life. Maybe it's time to look into something else for a hobby. Anybody know anything about basket weaving?

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RE: Struggling with Single Rotor basics - 1/6/2008 6:51 PM   
Mortocaster


 

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Status: offline 		Thank you for the kind welcome to the forum.

I'm glad the page in the end of the link was of some value to you guys.
As I said, it's mostly covered here already, but it's nice when it's gathered like that.
Just like your paper, Soloboss. Large value in time of frustration.

Even tho this thread is dedicated to the FP helis, I have to comment on the CX topics.
I have now the alu frame in order, and can't wait to get it per snail-mail.
Also got the battery holder in CNC, cause the old one came to peaces in a crash (that woke my wife O:-) )
flying in the kitchen late at night.
Got a lot of parts from www.bladecx2.com in Canada, and their stuff really looks great (in my opinion)
all tho, I have to say your Xtreme upgrade heli looks quite intriguing as well Solo.
Got the Xtreme 180 bb motors lying on the shelf, waiting to get the new frame..
Loose some waight, gain some...

As for the Walkera, i found out after ordering, that it's no upgrades available as for now. This most likely since it was
launched in 2007, as 4#1. So far I only find the stock replacement parts on the web, and don't really know what other brands or
styles that will fit. The rotor head seems to be one of a kind style, but I'd like to upgrade the head to take a little more beatings.
It comes apart big time when I strike something, making me crawl all over the place looking for those darn little ball bearings, and shafts..
(maybe it's my head that needs an upgrade :-\ ) It has a different swash plate as well, and in a pour quality i might add. Tore one of the
ball ends of when adjusting it. It came right out of the box with the Chinese setup (everything upside down)... well good for learning tho.

I've been eyeballing the T-Rex 450SE v2, and the TT minititan 325, and will go there some day.
So maybe it's a positive thing that my Walkera is not on the top when it comes to upgrades.
Saving a lot on whats not there. Gathering cash to go further in to the madness..
I don't dear to calculate what the CX2 have hauled out of my pocket..

Yeah, it's cool that these things bring people together from all over the world.
As for the scene in Norway, it's some forums, but not in this scale. The ones posting there is just taping down what they read
in other forums, so I rather hit the "mother load";-))
The guys at the different LHS's are really not interested, looks like they think it's a pain in the but to answer all the Q's one might have
after blowing $150 in their store.
So, the Collective her is of great value us newbe's

Question: I use a Macbook laptop, and have bought a flight SIM from www.alphamacsoftware.com.
But does anyone know of a better sim for mac?

stump3r theres always next time... next time you'll do it differently....


Best, Morten.

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RE: Struggling with Single Rotor basics - 1/6/2008 7:37 PM   
stump3r



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Status: offline 		Thanks Morten, I went through similar frustrations with my CX2. I have pretty much mastered that little guy. Just having fun mastering nose in orientation with it now. I'll figure it out eventually. Spending loads more time on the sim. It will help. Just too tempting to fly the bigger more stable models in the sim. Welcome to the collective. You will not find a greater collection of minds anywhere on the web. These guys are great around here. Solo put it best that we are all students and teachers alike, and sometimes just a good sounding board for clearing our frustrations.
The Sim I am running unfortunately is just for Bill Gates hellware. If you find something please post it as my next machine is going to be a mac. But that's a whole can of worms not worth opening.

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RE: Struggling with Single Rotor basics - 1/6/2008 8:36 PM   
xyster101


 

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Status: offline 		Stumper and Solo,

Still no luck? This thing is very sensative and I can not fly outdoors yet. I think it is pretty durable. I let one of my students fly it at school and he slammed it into a wall at about 8 feet up and she dropped. That broke the flybar only, which was a pain to replace. I just hovered through a whole battery pack (11 min) in my tiny living room. I lied earlier, the CX2 batteries only last about 6 minutes. It just felt longer as I kept having to restart with them. The CX packs are also very light (43 grams) and it makes the #4 harder to fly. The 11 min pack is a 7.4v 1300mhA 25C (73 grams) from ushobbysupple for around $30. Well worth it. After I took this picture the wind blew the heli off the railing and being on the 3rd floor it fell 30 feet to the ground. Landed on the skids and broke just a blade.
I have replaced many blades, tail rotor, tail motor, skids twice (many CA glues in between) before super skids, flybar twice and currently have one of the flybar weights in about 1.5 inches from the end for balance. About every 8th bad landing I have to balance or adjust something. Usually the flybar paddles get knocked out of whack.
I feel I picked this up so quick because of the amount of hours I put on the CX2 (350+ batteries). I was able to fly that nose in, side in, backwards, forwards, and land almost anywhere before I got the #4. I also have about 1.5 hours or so on the #4 now. Keep practicing. Remember to watch the head and after each move to then give it the opposite stick to stop the movement. Push right to move right, then give it some left just before you need it to stop. Make a video for us to see. I like videos.
Max

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RE: Struggling with Single Rotor basics - 1/6/2008 9:25 PM   
stump3r



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Status: offline 		Flashes of success all of a sudden. I read through the FP setup guide Morten posted and took a few tricks ran with it.
Rebalanced everything, main blades, tightened the grips, balanced and set the flybar paddles, checked and set gear mesh.
The only issue I currently have is a slightly out of balance tail blade. It creates a nice bouncing effect of the tail. Just can't get it perfectly balanced but I will win. Removed the flybar weights, and moved my swash linkages to the long swash horns vs. the short ones.
Eagerly ran outside and spooled her up, what a difference! I can almost fly this silly machine now. I have discovered now that it's the CX pilot in me causing all sorts of issues vs. a nasty squirrelly machine. Once you take the squirrel out of the machine it's all up to the pilot, and this pilot has some work to do. As Max posted above, remembering to counter your input is the big key. I have to keep telling myself how to fly this bird, my biggest problem right now is I let it get away from me, then make big inputs to get it back and it just keeps getting worse from there. However I did succeed in getting back everytime, finally! Now if the kids playhouse and a gust of wind didn't do me in I would still be out back given her! I think I have finally found the answers I have been looking for! I'm pretty sure I'm on the verge of something big here. I'm excited again

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RE: Struggling with Single Rotor basics - 1/6/2008 9:30 PM   
Mortocaster


 

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Status: offline 		stump3r I'm so glad your out of your frustration for now

More power to ya !!

M.

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RE: Struggling with Single Rotor basics - 1/6/2008 9:40 PM   
xyster101


 

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Status: offline 		Stump3r,
So glad to hear! Balance the tail rotor, I never thought of that and my first tail rotor I did have a wobbly tail. I thought it was what this heli does. The new tail does not bounce. Excellent insight! I will balance them from now on too.
I think I am more successful so far due to being inside. Once I go out, it gets away from me too and I have a hell of a time bringing it back. I usually just land it 30 feet way (hard) and walk over and get it. I can see where a CP will be easier since the head speed will stay the same. The FP needs more throttle to get out of breezes which leads it to going higher. As you mentioned this causes the loose loose situation. Videos? I just use my digital camera on movie mode.
Glad to hear your success. It is nice to learn together like this. The Walkera #4 forum is dead, I like this group of people here much better.
MAx

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RE: Struggling with Single Rotor basics - 1/6/2008 9:55 PM   
stump3r



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Status: offline 		Thanks gents!

Max your so right, it seems all over these forums that certain groups of guys band together, then stick together I can hardly ever get answers on some of the other forums. This one is the best. Besides we are the collective, you can't beat us, we will just assimilate you We don't even ask you to join, we just suck you in, kind of like this hobby!

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RE: Struggling with Single Rotor basics - 1/6/2008 10:02 PM   
xyster101


 

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Status: offline 		You will be sucked in one way or another. It all starts with the simple question we all asked at one point or another "Are Xtreme upgrades worth it?". $150 later the CX2 is now more durable, which is good because the Xtreme makes us do things we never should with a CX, like take it outside, put pontoons/lights on it, banked turns, cameras and smash it into cement walls at full speed which a stock CX would just EXPLODE doing.

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RE: Struggling with Single Rotor basics - 1/7/2008 12:56 AM   
scale_edge



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Status: offline 		its sucking all right, i just killed the 4#3 again - another one of those sudden sideways dash suicide runs ruining a perfect pack of low approaches - stupid non-scale designed for 3d pod and boom flybar helis with violent overcompensating controls and light blades just so you can flip it around like a chimp with a rock - well, i want to hover motionless and fly scale patterns, not play with this stupid rock anymore - its frigging re-design time !!!!! - flybarless, stable and far more like scale

edge

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RE: Struggling with Single Rotor basics - 1/7/2008 1:05 AM   
soloboss


 

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Status: offline 		Yep, It's one of those nights. Sorry to hear about your misery. Here's some of my own. It won't make you feel better, but you are not alone.

I tried one last adjustment per the setup guide. I was good with all of the others, so I balanced the tail rotor - it was off ever so slightly. Nothing different from that change. Then I removed the weights from my flybar. It is a bit more responsive, but before I could determine if that was good or bad, I took out my fore / aft servo. My east / west servo went all glitchy. It's no wonder every flight went straight for the garage door. When I plugged in my new servo (JM Sport Sub Micro 15 in oz [SM 15]- $29 on sale at half price) everything seemed to settle. Even the east/west servo works a bunch more smoothly.
Do your servos work smooth or do they have about 10 steps from neutral to full range? My old one has steps. The replacement is far smoother.
Here's another quirk. When I run my link in the servo horn outboard hole and go to full range in the UP direction, it pushes the drive shaft up far enough that the drive gear binds on the underside of the frame and loads the motor enough to slow it noticeably.

So tonight I took out one main blade and a servo.
Since I got the heli this is the second servo, I've lost 2 tail rotors and a tail motor, two tail booms (blade strikes) and a flybar and countless skids until I got the Super Skids. For what it's worth, the CP landing gear fits these, weighs nothing and it is stronger than original. This may not be a lot cheaper than a larger heli.

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RE: Struggling with Single Rotor basics - 1/7/2008 3:26 AM   
xyster101


 

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Status: offline 		Solo,
My servos twitch a lot too. I am positive once we master these then a Trex should be easy! This thing is so twitchy I can't even touch the trims while it is flying. Also my small apt space does not help either. One more short video with a 3 out of 10 landing!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bP2oBRSVTbo

Max

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RE: Struggling with Single Rotor basics - 1/7/2008 4:08 AM   
stump3r



Posts: 1662
Score: 100
Joined: 10/21/2006
Last Login: 3/18/2010
From: Morinville, AB, CANADA
Status: offline 		Nice job Max, loved the 3 point landing at the end. Thats usually something I pull off, bounce off something then put her down hard but on the skids. It's sure nice to see that your #4 flies identical to mine. Your certainly way ahead of me on the learning curve. Keep up the great work, maybe one of these nights I'll get some video of mine in the air. Oh I know...I'll have to shoot some video of the heli eating chest in the front room going after the #4.

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Gaui 200SD, 200EX, 255 coming, HK250GT, CX450SEV2, CX500SE, DX7

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(in reply to xyster101)
       Post #: 99

RE: Struggling with Single Rotor basics - 1/7/2008 4:02 PM   
scale_edge



Posts: 134
Score: 100
Joined: 1/2/2008
Last Login: 5/10/2008
From: , AL, USA
Status: offline 		oh that makes me feel so much better!!!!! thanks - the words 'perfect landing' at the end helped considerably to pull me out of the dumper - now if i was only home, but alas, we all must work to buy parts - maybe they have a lhs here

edge

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through the glass:Blade 400 A-Star 3-Blade, Gaui EB1003B 3-Blade - hotel room flyers:Walkera 5-5B, Walkera 4-3

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(in reply to stump3r)
       Post #: 100

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