RE: Struggling with Single Rotor basics  
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RE: ... - 5/12/2008 2:22:09 PM   
UTM


 

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From: Indianapolis, IN, USA
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quote:

Cool stuff UTM! Told ya you would get a rush once ya started FFF Congrats on getting there so very quickly also! You know, everything you experienced and wrote about is in my reports a few days ago with my vid. (except the crashing part ). I'm very glad you learned, and remembered to fly it down instead of chopping the throttle or you would have been in deep doodoo Makes me feel very good to think that I may have helped you in some small way on your first day of FFF


RMG - I did take some lessons out of your post and apply them to my first attempt outside. Not only did I fly it down but the bit about keeping the nose down and throttle positions when coming down up etc. My flight was not nearly as smooth as your however. I was pretty jerky with my stick inputs while raising the nose out of dives. I was certainly overcorrecting and was occasionly pulling out of the run prematurly due to it. It did feel good though! All weekend I wanted so badly to get outside and give it a go again but it rained and blew and thundered here in good ole central Indiana all weekend. Today it's sunny but the wind is blowing a little. Another thing I learned just as you did is that you can fly the Falcon in some wind so long as you keep your momentum up. The wind where I was flying on Friday was 3-5 mph with maybe some 7-8 mph gusts and I was having no real issues during flight. It was tricky taking off and landing due to the wind. Maybe I will get another chance this evening. I'll try and talk the wife into taking some video.

Jmhh - Welcome to the forum. A bunch of great guys here with a wealth of knowledge. They have helped me out a great deal. I'm fairly new to the group as well. I've only been flying my FP Falcon 40 for about a month and started posting here shortly before. Follow solo's advice. That advice helped me to get into the air. Particularly the bit about adjusting RH lean in the flybar. It'll help to achieve an overall more stable bird in flight. Take it slow at first but don't be afraid to pop it up out of ground effect. The FP helis are much more difficult to fly in GE. It's an instinct to not want to gain any altitude at first and try and get her up to just a few inches off the floor so that a dump will not be so bad but I found that I did more damage with worse crashes just by tipping the heli over from 3". Once I got to ba#$s to pop her up to about 3' I was suddenly able to keep it there. Not that I didn't crash there also but by an large the bird will be more controllable without GE and with the higher headspeed required to get it there. SuperSkids are priceless. I have crashed my FP several times in a manner that basically destroyed the bird and have not had to replace a single skid. I also took Mark's advice and removed the vinyl from the supports and replaced it with 1.5mm id carbon fiber tube. It's much more rigid and actually supports the boom. One more thing I would agree with Mark on is the fuse for the main motor. I have popped 2 - 7.5a fuses and had I not had them that would have been the 4-1 instead. You don't want to be putting $50 out there every time you don't dump the throttle fast enough. I did mine slightly different than Mark though. I put some car audio connectors further down the wire and shrink wrapped them to keep them from grounding out and the fuse will fit into them without solder. Now if I pop one I can just pull it and replace and am back in the air in 2 minutes. That very thing happened to me on Friday! If you go back a page or two and check the post I made on Friday talking about crash damage there is a pic where you can see the fuse I installed on the tail motor using this method.

Some exciting happenings in the world of the Falcon Chronicals. I think I have my wife talked into letting me buy a DX6i with the uncle sam bail out. We should be getting it any time and I'm on the cusp. It's not a done deal but she's starting to break. I hope it comes through. Of course I could afford a Belt with that money but I think that a TX would benifit me more at this juncture of my heli flying. I'll keep you all updated.

Have a great day all!

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Rules are made for people who aren''''t willing to make up their own....Chuck Yeager

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RE: ... - 5/12/2008 8:51:29 PM   
RMG2


 

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Three packs this morning at the park in conditions from still air, to mild gust a few mph. No crashes but darn close once Low to the ground and flying nose-in back toward myself, I made a cyclic correction that was the wrong direction! That error started a chain reaction of cyclic over correction in all axis, and the M24's buzzing like a swarm of angry bees as they changed angle rapidly! Some how, some way I managed to save it and ended up back at hover! Like they say, "it's better to be lucky than good"

The more I fly the FP outdoors in fast forward flight, the more facts about flying the FP become clear to me.

1, If there is even a breath of wind your FP is gonna gain altitude once it leaves hover and moves to forward flight. Without the ability to go negative pitch at the blades (CP) the translational lift will wisk your FP up, up, and away! If you try to reduce throttle to control altitude the heli's head speed drops so much that the heli simply loses cyclic control and falls out of the air! The only way to control altitude is by applying forward cyclic (pointing the nose down), and flying the FP back down toward the ground! Once you have flown the heli back within 5-6' altitude you can bring it in close and move to hover where you can carefully reduce throttle to get it on the ground. Getting the FP in the air and flying it is the easy part, getting back on the ground is much harder I know I sound like a "broken record" with this advice, but it is so important to success flying the FP outdoors I really want people to be ready for this when they move outdoors with their FP for the first time!

2, It's very easy to lose perspective of your heli's roll/aileron position when it's up fairly high. I watch the heli's skids as my indicator of attitude as the FP goes zooming past on high speed passes. Often the heli is far enough away that I get confused about what I am seeing??? This has been the single biggest problem for me trying to stay consistent with my flight heading.

Along this same line of thought, swash setting becomes very obvious. We are told that our heli's swash is suppose to be level, but when we are just learning to hover we cheat and trim our heli's swash out of level to achieve a stable hover with minimum stick input. Problem with doing that is when we start forward flight our heli will not track a straight heading with the swash not level in the roll/aileron direction. If the swash is tipped back a little the FP's tendency to "pitch-up" in forward flight is enhanced. Bottom line, when you start fast forward flight make sure your heli's swash is level!

3, Setting-up your FP's center-of-gravity to be a little nose heavy is a good thing for forward flight in the wind.

4, You can add a couple minutes of flight time to your timer when flying forward flight verses just hovering. When flying forward flight the heli is so often cruising and letting translational lift do it's thing that throttle position is pulled way back (down).

5, The light weight, single rotor fixed pitch can be flown in much more wind than we originally thought so long as the pilot keeps the heli's nose down, and momentum up! The FP heli will cut nicely through the wind if it remains at fairly high speed!

6, Has become very obvious to me that a white colored canopy is NOT the way to go when flying against an overcast sky! Very hard to keep track of the heli's attitude! However, a white colored canopy is just fine against a blue sky background.

Just rambling out-loud about thoughts passing through my brain after flying this morning. Hope some person new to single rotor benefits from my thoughts


(in reply to UTM)
       Post #: 1352

RE: ... - 5/13/2008 1:42:14 PM   
UTM


 

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RMG - Good post. I think that I have found everything you say to be useful and true. I trimmed my swash out of level to achieve stable hover. It's about 5 degrees to the right and I noticed immediatly that when pushing straight forward on the stick the heli will want to track right with the lean. I compensated for this with the stick inputs but never the less I think that the more FFF I get into I will certainly have to level the swash out. Right now I am going to keep the 5 degrees because I am still mostly hover training in my small garage. I will just use the stick to correct for this shorcoming during FFF.

As far as flying the heli down goes.. Not only is it the only real way to get her down but man it's fun to build that kind of speed. Long sweeping passes are a blast.

Right now I've got my heli balanced between front and back. I will try moving the COG forward for my next outdoor foray. I like the info on the post and keep it coming. Get us some more video also. I have not had the chance to get any of my FFF attempts on video yet but will be doing so the next time the wind will cooperate and let me get out. I did get a little last night during twilight when the air was calm. Only 1 pack though still a blast. I did get some video of my hover training in my garage with some piros in a small space. Have a look.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=ENgo48rH3uc

Have a great day all!

_____________________________

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RE: ... - 5/13/2008 8:48:47 PM   
RMG2


 

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WOW Uri, very good solid hover and piros in a confined space! You are learning single rotor at a very fast pace! Way to go, you'll be ready for a CP heli in two weeks

Speaking of CP..., mine will be here in a few days

I went down to the park to fly this morning but the rain never would completely stop so I got zero flying

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RE: ... - 5/13/2008 9:10:02 PM   
UTM


 

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RMG - Sweet congratulations. Finally getting that CP huh? There won't be anyone left for me to talk FP with I'd like to get ahold of one but I am sticking to my "mastering" the fp first. I think once I get nose-in and some more FFF under my belt I will be ready. I haven't even attempted to go nose-in yet so that'll be some time on. I feel pretty good about my side-ins though. I am fairly comfortable with either side at this point. Not perfect but getting better. I certainly need more time outside! Darn Indiana spring getting me down. Another day of 10-15mph wind with stronger gusts. I did do one pack last night right as the sun was going down but the wind was still strong enough that I cut it short after almost crashing into my neighbors roof

Thanks for the compliment on my flying. I've been working hard. It's hard sometimes to keep focus on hover training when I really want to be ripping it up!

Have a great night!

_____________________________

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RE: ... - 5/13/2008 9:56:16 PM   
USHobbySupply


 

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Very nice hover!

I have been going to the park lately (well, at least before it rained 5 days straight) and been really letting it rip. Each day ends in a crash, but I am learning quick. Getting good at going out and flying back towards me. I also practice nose in up high.

I just cant bring myself to do that with my bigger birds. Even though parts supply is not an issue ( ), i just dont want to crash. The #4/Falcon40 is perfect for that. Sometimes, even after a bad crash, I can just straighten the blades and go! Sometimes not, but sometimes yes :>

If the wind dies down, it will be really nice tonight! Have to charge the camcorder!

Michael

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RE: ... - 5/13/2008 10:04:46 PM   
RMG2


 

Posts: 498
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quote:

ORIGINAL: UTM

RMG - Sweet congratulations. Finally getting that CP huh? There won't be anyone left for me to talk FP with I'd like to get ahold of one but I am sticking to my "mastering" the fp first. I think once I get nose-in and some more FFF under my belt I will be ready. I haven't even attempted to go nose-in yet so that'll be some time on. I feel pretty good about my side-ins though. I am fairly comfortable with either side at this point. Not perfect but getting better. I certainly need more time outside! Darn Indiana spring getting me down. Another day of 10-15mph wind with stronger gusts. I did do one pack last night right as the sun was going down but the wind was still strong enough that I cut it short after almost crashing into my neighbors roof

Thanks for the compliment on my flying. I've been working hard. It's hard sometimes to keep focus on hover training when I really want to be ripping it up!

Have a great night!


Uri, no worries about me quiting with the FP for a while anyway! I plan on continuing to fly it for a long time to come! I'm just finished building on it so I decided to build the CP for something to do at home while I'm not flying (or hangin' on the puter)

Michael, thanks for your post. I didn't know you flew an FP heli

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RE: ... - 5/13/2008 11:54:03 PM   
xyster101


 

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UTM,
That looks excellent!! Now it is time for some FF and that is easier IMO.

Finally got the B400 flying again after a few set backs. Now we have the frankenstien heli. I have zip ties holding the landing gear on, epoxy on the fram, chipped and dented tail rotors, duct taped canopy, and the new rear plastics have no stickers on them. Flew again today and it was like a new bird except for some weird whining noise, I had sweaty palms and my heart was racing. Flew two packs and then later in the day went to fly again and after 2 minutes, the wind was tossing it around too much and I was scared of loosing it again. I also flew the FP, but something is wrong with the battery or motor, it seems to have no power. It is also supposed to rain here the next week! ARgh.

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RE: ... - 5/13/2008 11:58:59 PM   
RMG2


 

Posts: 498
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From: Private, OR, USA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: xyster101

UTM,
That looks excellent!! Now it is time for some FF and that is easier IMO.

Finally got the B400 flying again after a few set backs. Now we have the frankenstien heli. I have zip ties holding the landing gear on, epoxy on the fram, chipped and dented tail rotors, duct taped canopy, and the new rear plastics have no stickers on them. Flew again today and it was like a new bird except for some weird whining noise, I had sweaty palms and my heart was racing. Flew two packs and then later in the day went to fly again and after 2 minutes, the wind was tossing it around too much and I was scared of loosing it again. I also flew the FP, but something is wrong with the battery or motor, it seems to have no power. It is also supposed to rain here the next week! ARgh.


Max, you are my hero buddy! Learning to fly is your top priority, and how your heli looks is low on the list Just think, some day we might all be able to fly well, and have helis that look like new all the time (98% of the time)???

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RE: ... - 5/14/2008 2:18:56 AM   
UTM


 

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From: Indianapolis, IN, USA
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Max glad to hear the 400 is airborn once again. Hope you don't break the head off again Thanks for the encouragment. i've started some FFF. Got a couple of pack in on a football field friday. Was a blast. Did another last night but spent more time fighting the wind than flying. It's getting there!

Michael i didn't know you flew a fp either. Good idea on the nose-in at a higher altitude. i'm gonna have to give that a try.

RMG - glad to hear it. Seems like everybody is moving on while I and a handful of others still battle with the fp helis. I can't wait to pick up a CP but all in due time. I have to admit though putting together a list for the inevitable purchase. Then there is convincing the little lady....

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RE: ... - 5/14/2008 2:38:33 AM   
stump3r



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UTM very nice hover, I'm coming over for lessons! I'm still hung up on left side in. Having a horrible time with it.
Randy, what did you order for your first CP? Fill us in buddy!!!! Oh don't forget about pictures.

Max I'm happy to see that the learn at all costs is working for you. Awesome stuff mister!

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RE: ... - 5/14/2008 6:19:26 AM   
RMG2