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RE: 25% Cessna L-19/0-1 Bird Dog build - 5/7/2012 6:17 PM   
swift bill



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Status: offline 		good question.

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RE: 25% Cessna L-19/0-1 Bird Dog build - 7/21/2012 7:30 PM   
skipper_gr


 

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Status: offline 		Gentlemen: Let me introduce myself. The L-19 brings memories of my time in SEA. I'm retired USAF & traveled as part of a team ot of PACCOMAREA supporting the USAF Comm squadrons throughout Vietnam & Thailand during 1966-1969. Now long retired and a novice rc pilot & would like to build a Bird Dog In the 1/5 scale. I think the Vallicourt plans & parts are the best choice for me and either cut the kit myself or buy the PKC kit. I have been "lurking", reading all of your efforts, and thought I should "come out of the closet" and be visable.My email address is skipper_gr@msn.com and am living in Columbia SC. I hope to decide next week as to proceed with the project and get items on order. Well, I'll try not to be a pest with too many questions.

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RE: 25% Cessna L-19/0-1 Bird Dog build - 7/21/2012 10:48 PM   
gblas777



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i used this guy to cut many of my short kits including the bird dog. he has always done a great job. it is a short kit. he does all the parts. you have to buy
the sticks and sheeting..everything fit perfect on the bird dog..mine is the 1/4 scale version
feel free to ask any questions you want
thanks for your service

gene

http://a-mmodels.com/

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RE: 25% Cessna L-19/0-1 Bird Dog build - 7/23/2012 9:12 PM   
RICMOD5634



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Status: offline 		skipper, my kit was cut by RKC and althought there was a problem with the wing mounting. PKC made it right and was very easy to work with and your not getting a shourt kit. Every thing is there and packaged and marked.
Rich

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RE: 25% Cessna L-19/0-1 Bird Dog build - 7/23/2012 9:19 PM   
RICMOD5634



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Status: offline 		skipper, The only thing you have to keep stright in your head, IF you follow along fom the start of this tread is your building the 1/5 size and most posts from the starter of this post are building the 1/4. When they talk about wing servo placement you don't have the added room they do. Have to use your head to get the added room.
Rich 1/5 Dawg

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RE: 25% Cessna L-19/0-1 Bird Dog build - 7/23/2012 11:05 PM   
skipper_gr


 

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Status: offline 		Many thanks for the advise! Plan to call Valli tonite & order plans & photo kit.
Skipper USN 1949-54, USAF 55-70

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RE: 25% Cessna L-19/0-1 Bird Dog build - 7/28/2012 3:52 PM   
redtail


 

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Status: offline 		Hello everyone, this is Redtail, so glad to say I'm back. Been watching you fellows post your builds and photos, very informatiive and very helpful. Now after finding and picking up all my parts and pieces and wondering what went where, slowly, very slowly, my mind is beginning a necessary recall of parts, techniques, and what needs done. However, a wake up call email from a wonderful modeler, builder, and designer, Charles Kellogg (TBM Avenger, Skyraider) made me take a careful look back on what I had completed. My DAWG was completed, primered, and awaiting only paint and decals. You have all seen the detail in my build. What a dumb, stupid, thing I did. Based on Charlies' email, I checked the washout incidence on my wings and the digital gauge reading between the root and tip ribs was 0 degrees. I had somehow screwed up - BADLY. Both wings read 0 degrees. I had built the wings straight and true yet without any washout. That would of meant disaster the moment the DAWG took to the air. I checked with Roy and Charles and repair was option 3. Option 2 was to twist one and build another wing panel to match the panel I twisted. Trying to twist both would have never been a match. Option 1 was to rebuild both panels. After a sincere look see, I have no choice but to rebuild my wings. How I screwed up, I'll never know. That will dog me forever. That is history, now on to the rebuild.

Thanks to Ken Hodges (page 13+), I will build a set of his wing jigs today and proceed with the build. How did I miss the washout (1.5 degrees) which is printed by the right wingtip on the plans. I may add just a bit more to the suggested washout degrees. Again, Many Thanks Charlie, Roy, and Ken. Will keep you posted on the rebuild. Chic

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RE: 25% Cessna L-19/0-1 Bird Dog build - 8/6/2012 2:49 AM   
redtail


 

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Status: offline 		OK, before I take my wife on a short vacation to Charleston, SC, I framed up the first of two re-build wing panels. As Ken stated on page 12 of this thread, I built the new panel just as Roy Vaillycourt told me to do BUT for the life of me, I can not see the washout. I'm trusting what Roy told me and I will press on when I return from my WIFE'S vacation and build the other wing panel. I will sheet the right panel before I move on to the left panel. I installed the flap and duffle bag release servos, not yet the aileron servo. The control arms for the flaps and ailerons will be hidden as before.

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RE: 25% Cessna L-19/0-1 Bird Dog build - 8/6/2012 2:15 PM   
frank99



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Status: offline 		retail, nice work i have kens l-19 and i am in over my head,but will get started some day, can you tell what the duffle bag drop was for, supplies or meds for the troops? would love to have that on mine and the rockets too cool thanks frank

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RE: 25% Cessna L-19/0-1 Bird Dog build - 8/6/2012 4:34 PM   
dumorian


 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: redtail

OK, before I take my wife on a short vacation to Charleston, SC, I framed up the first of two re-build wing panels. As Ken stated on page 12 of this thread, I built the new panel just as Roy Vaillycourt told me to do BUT for the life of me, I can not see the washout. I'm trusting what Roy told me and I will press on when I return from my WIFE'S vacation and build the other wing panel. I will sheet the right panel before I move on to the left panel. I installed the flap and duffle bag release servos, not yet the aileron servo. The control arms for the flaps and ailerons will be hidden as before.


Oh gee Chic.... I hate that. I'm on where as experienced as you building, but remember two things. My first wing I did with washout was on a Dynaflite Decathlon. The method was really simple on that model. Pin the spar lay on the plan and then there was a stick of balsa behind the spar that ran not parallel but getting closer to the spar as it neared the tip. Sounds like the method is not so clear/easy on the Bird Dog. the Decathlon does a very kind stall, dropping it's nose to gain speed instead of tip stalling.

And, I blew my first plans build wings.... a Merlyn which has around a 13' wingspan. I was all proud of my ribs on this wing as it tapers. The dihedral increases at about the halfway point which required a piece of 1/4" balsa for a rib at that joint. I made all the ribs, built the inners, built the first outer and nothing lined in spite of using the same pattern for the mid rib. I learned that when doing the tapers, the first inner rib for each section should be placed on the outside of the pattern or after sanding the extreme angle created by the stacked ribs between the patterns, they become a bit too small. Enough to make a big difference to the chord. I was missing by around 3/8". It was really hard to wreck that panel and toss those now 'scrap' ribs, but it was the thing to do. I can only imagine the feeling you have over what has happened with your build. I'm so sorry for you. I guess the 'only' positive is that the model will fly better and perhaps even enough better to not kill itself over a tip stall.

Enjoy that vacation with that beautiful lady of yours! And don't get all distracted by the model when you're supposed to be out on the town with her.

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RE: 25% Cessna L-19/0-1 Bird Dog build - 8/14/2012 1:41 AM   
WARBIRDRCER



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quote:

ORIGINAL: redtail

OK, before I take my wife on a short vacation to Charleston, SC, I framed up the first of two re-build wing panels. As Ken stated on page 12 of this thread, I built the new panel just as Roy Vaillycourt told me to do BUT for the life of me, I can not see the washout. I'm trusting what Roy told me and I will press on when I return from my WIFE'S vacation and build the other wing panel. I will sheet the right panel before I move on to the left panel. I installed the flap and duffle bag release servos, not yet the aileron servo. The control arms for the flaps and ailerons will be hidden as before.


Chic,

Thanks for the lead, I found you.

I was wondering about this washout thing. I have a flying buddy that really likes to build and I do most of his flying for him. His most recent build was the ¼ scale Vailly L-19.

I called and spoke to him to ask if he built washout into his wing, but he does not remember doing so.

Does the plan call for 1.5 degrees, or is it a recommendation?

The reason I am asking is because I currently have 3 flights on the plane and will be flying it again a week from Saturday. As of now it has been a great flyer both at cruse and slow flight.

One of the reasons I am aware of its slow speed characteristics is during my first take-off the left main tire continued it’s take-off roll as the plane when it’s own way into the sky. I flew the entire flight to become accustom to how it was going to handle during the first landing. I was able to fly a slow approach with a slight left crosswind keeping the right wing low attempting to touch the right main first hoping to cause a slow ground loop to the left when the gear leg contacted the ground.

In short the ground was soft from a rain and as soon as the left main leg contacted the ground it cut into the earth like a hot knife causing the gear to be ripped from the bottom of the fuselage. Luckily Ray is a good sport and took it home, repaired it, and we have flown it twice since then.

We have a BME 58 on it for power and it fly’s it nicely.

Anyhow it is a great flyer and you will like it.


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RE: 25% Cessna L-19/0-1 Bird Dog build - 8/14/2012 2:29 AM   
redtail


 

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Status: offline 		Warbirdracer, great pictures. great build and yes, the plans do call for 1.5 degrees of washout. The way your DAWG is flying tells me the airframe must of been built per Roys' plans. Roy personally said without the washout, you will have more then your hands full. I will be using a DA50 instead of the Zenoah 45. Glad to know that the 58 flies the airframe well. Guess I am following your lead on powerplants. Was suspcious of the 45 with the weight that the DAWG was slowly building up. Frank99, the duffle bags supplied the troops with meds, tools, letters, ammo, etc. I saw the setup in the Squardon Series Book and also in the hard cover book on the BirdDog. How easy are the takeoffs, I have had a bit of a problem with taildraggers (cubs). Chic


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RE: 25% Cessna L-19/0-1 Bird Dog build - 8/14/2012 3:09 AM   
WARBIRDRCER



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Status: offline 		The DA-50 is a good choice for this aircraft. Even with our BME-58 we had to add some nose weight above the engine.

As for the take-offs, the wide stance of the gear removes the bad habits the narrow gear of a cub can have, and the weight of this bird also helps to keep her firmly planted until she is flying.

I made a few low powered runs to get the feel, and at first she had me worried because it kept wanting to weathervane into the crosswind. However after a few runs I calmed down and any unwanted deviation was me shaking.

Thanks for the washout update, I was hoping for no more unwanted surprises .


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RE: 25% Cessna L-19/0-1 Bird Dog build - 8/14/2012 6:44 AM   
frank99



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quote:

ORIGINAL: redtail

Warbirdracer, great pictures. great build and yes, the plans do call for 1.5 degrees of washout. The way your DAWG is flying tells me the airframe must of been built per Roys' plans. Roy personally said without the washout, you will have more then your hands full. I will be using a DA50 instead of the Zenoah 45. Glad to know that the 58 flies the airframe well. Guess I am following your lead on powerplants. Was suspcious of the 45 with the weight that the DAWG was slowly building up. Frank99, the duffle bags supplied the troops with meds, tools, letters, ammo, etc. I saw the setup in the Squardon Series Book and also in the hard cover book on the BirdDog. How easy are the takeoffs, I have had a bit of a problem with taildraggers (cubs). Chic


Chic thanks need to get on my plane , I got ken hodges plane and it is a work of art. Blood clot in leg now . Will try to get well and finish that great warbird, frank

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RE: 25% Cessna L-19/0-1 Bird Dog build - 8/14/2012 11:37 AM   
redtail


 

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Status: offline 		Frank, I truly understand those medical issues, I have had several myself. Hopefully, God willing, they are behind me and I pray you too will get well soon. Ken certainly did a wonderful build. I think everyone on this build thread has taught each of us something. I had the pleasure of meeting him and his family when they came to visit and perform here in Washington, D.C. Ken and I visited the new addition of the Smithsonian Air and Space Museum. We had a great time. Hey, if any of you DAWG fans come to D.C., let me know, I enjoy the trip to the mall, oooops, thats my wife speaking, I mean the museum. Smile. I believe I showed how I did the wing hard point brackets in this build. If not, let me know and I will email pictures to you. Chic

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RE: 25% Cessna L-19/0-1 Bird Dog build - 8/14/2012 1:43 PM   
frank99



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Status: offline 		Thanks for the kind words ,need a med kit dropped on the lz . Send the pics ,need all the help I can get on the l-19 ,might get one of you pros to finish this great warbird ,in over my head for sure thanks frank

< Message edited by frank99 -- 8/16/2012 3:37 AM >

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RE: 25% Cessna L-19/0-1 Bird Dog build - 8/14/2012 2:45 PM   
WARBIRDRCER



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Status: offline 		Chic,

I will keep the offer to visit the museum with you in mind. I have an office in DC in the FAA building on 55M street, but with the budget there has been no travel scheduled. I was there in March and once a quarter was scheduled until now. Maybe I will get there by the end of the year. I know a guy who has an office where mine is located and lives local and flys in VA, maybe you know him. His name is Ray Stinchcomb.

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RE: 25% Cessna L-19/0-1 Bird Dog build - 8/15/2012 10:39 PM   
sticktickler



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Status: offline 		I cut the best scale L-19 Bird Dog graphics in quality vinyl you can find anyplace PM me for more details. I will also do custom unit markings, tail numbers or any documented graphics you need for your L-19 Bird Dog. I cut the vinyl graphics on Gene Blasavage's L-19 seen the the Marines makrings.

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RE: 25% Cessna L-19/0-1 Bird Dog build - 8/16/2012 12:07 AM   
frank99



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quote:

ORIGINAL: sticktickler

I cut the best scale L-19 Bird Dog graphics in quality vinyl you can find anyplace PM me for more details. I will also do custom unit markings, tail numbers or any documented graphics you need for your L-19 Bird Dog. I cut the vinyl graphics on Gene Blasavage's L-19 seen the the Marines makrings.

My son is the army and I will getting that beautiful set of yellow army decals tks frank


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RE: 25% Cessna L-19/0-1 Bird Dog build - 8/26/2012 9:20 PM   
Firebar


 

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Status: offline 		A fellow club member built a 25% Birddog and it tip stalled on the second flight with the usual results. He never got around to fixing it and I decided to buy it from him. I checked the wings for washout by putting an incidence meter on the wing root and one on the wing tip and found that it didn't have any. This explains the short flying life. I am building new wings for the plane and making several changes that I learned from my Birddog. The plane as it was flown was very heavy at over 30 pounds. It flew on a G-62 as mine did.

Charlie

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RE: 25% Cessna L-19/0-1 Bird Dog build - 8/27/2012 1:06 AM   
redtail


 

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Status: offline 		Hey Frank99, trust me, we are all over our heads. I have learned soooooo very much here on this build thread. Ask any question and someone will certainly give you a very reasonable and sound answer. I'm building this DAWG and Charlie's (Firebar) Avenger (his design). I have learned so much just reading and asking how the h#%* they did that. Every question I have asked has received numerous responses that have taught me well. If I can help with pictures of anything I have done with the DAWG, let me know. Charlie is a great builder, and do not forget to email Roy, the DAWG designer. Chic

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RE: 25% Cessna L-19/0-1 Bird Dog build - 8/27/2012 1:15 AM   
WARBIRDRCER



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Status: offline 		Update on the L-19 wing status. I spoke to the builder and he did not incorporate the 1.5 degrees of washout. Although I have flow this aircraft 3 successful flights; one which was dragged in on the edge of a stall during an emergency landing after a left main tire departure as described earlier.

I do recall during my first flight while at altitude inducing a stall by reducing power and gradually applying up elevator to see how she would behave and she dropped the right wing at a very slow ground speed.

From now on I will be cautious of this during future flights and report back after our next outing with her.

Blue Skies,

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RE: 25% Cessna L-19/0-1 Bird Dog build - 9/1/2012 6:47 AM   
frank99



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Status: offline 		chic i need to get started , might get a pro to help too , and have 64 questions. the first one is what kind of finish should i use? The plane needs the stab, fin,wing tips, and the SCALE stuff you would not believe, installed . this might not be to hard but it does have a lot scale stuff , the seats are a work of art buy there self. If the plane gets to heavy will it fly ok ? ken built it straight and true , i have read the forum front to back and scared to get out the glue it is that nice, thanks frank

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RE: 25% Cessna L-19/0-1 Bird Dog build - 9/2/2012 11:40 PM   
Firebar


 

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Status: offline 		I am glad to say that I am making good progress on my Birddog rehab. I decided to make new elevators and a new rudder to lighten the tail. I have finished them and got them glassed yesterday. I have moved the servos in front of the CG and have installed new push rods. I made a repair to the fuselage needed from the crash and the whole fuselage has been sanded down to a light coat of primer. Now on to the new wings.

Charlie

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RE: 25% Cessna L-19/0-1 Bird Dog build - 10/4/2012 8:17 PM   
Firebar


 

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Status: offline 		My Birddog rehab is getting closer to completion. I have finished the work on the fuselage, one wing is ready for glass and the other wing will be ready to glass tomorrow. Pictures tomorrow.

Chic, How are your wings coming along?

Charlie

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