30% 300S mod to mid wing?

30% 300S mod to mid wing?
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30% 300S mod to mid wing? - 1/8/2008 8:43:01 PM

80stars

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From: Hastings, MN, USA
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To all Carden builders,

I have yet to have the pleasure of building a Carden, but am anxiously looking at an older 30% 300S kit. I do not like the low wing design of the kit and want to ask for your opinions to modify this kit to a mid wing. Can or better, should it be done?

Post #: 1

RE: 30% 300S mod to mid wing? - 1/8/2008 11:34:49 PM

as722

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I've built a few of these back in the early 90's and they flew great for their time. It will depend on how much you enjoy building because if you do the extra few hours it will take for the mod. will only add to the joy of building. On the other hand if you don't enjoy building too much, build it stock since the difference in flight will not be that big unless you're building it with "contests" in mind.
BTW this kit as well as any kit of that era were heavier than we are used to now so don't be afraid to take some material off here and there as you see fit. Good luck with your project.

Albert

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RE: 30% 300S mod to mid wing? - 1/9/2008 12:11:54 AM

zzw26n

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quote:

ORIGINAL: as722

I've built a few of these back in the early 90's and they flew great for their time. It will depend on how much you enjoy building because if you do the extra few hours it will take for the mod. will only add to the joy of building. On the other hand if you don't enjoy building too much, build it stock since the difference in flight will not be that big unless you're building it with "contests" in mind.
BTW this kit as well as any kit of that era were heavier than we are used to now so don't be afraid to take some material off here and there as you see fit. Good luck with your project.

Albert

What he said!
I like Albert's answer to the question for a couple of reasons; he Builds them (Cardens) and Flys them, and he does both very well.

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RE: 30% 300S mod to mid wing? - 1/9/2008 1:25:50 AM

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Thank you very much for your valued input. The only reason I would make the mod is for the experience and looks. I really want to do a 40% 260, but it's just not in the budget yet, and I thought a warm up would be good.

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Post #: 4

RE: 30% 300S mod to mid wing? - 1/9/2008 9:37:54 PM

as722

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Nothing wrong with the 30% 300s, you can always build a 40% later on when time and money allows.

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RE: 30% 300S mod to mid wing? - 1/10/2008 2:47:24 AM

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Good advice, thank you.

I did it, I purchased this kit, the seller indcated it was one of the last 300s Carden sold back in 94. I would like anyone with experience to give me their suggestions on building this model and or point me towards any build threads on this kit.

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Post #: 6

RE: 30% 300S mod to mid wing? - 1/11/2008 1:23:34 AM

as722

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I don't know of any build threads on this model but I will help you in anyway I can. I flew mine with a G-62 and if Remember correctly it was around 21 pounds but that was with two ni-cad packs, aluminium spinner, a heavy pilot etc. I think this model can be built today at around 18.5 pounds which even by today standarts is good.

Albert

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RE: 30% 300S mod to mid wing? - 1/11/2008 1:53:29 AM

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Thanks Albert,

I think I will do a build thread on this one, sort of a "throw back", there may be others out there looking at the same project. That way you and others with experience can help me better during the build with my questions. Albert you addressed this earlier in this thread that the kit is perfect as is, that making a modification to a mid wing will only be for my challenge as a builder, not performance to the aircraft. In your experience building this kit, can the mid wing mod be performed and sill allow room inside the fuse for equipment? My concern would be the fuel tank. In your aircraft did the tank sit on top of the wing tube? Forgive me, I have not yet looked at the plans for this kit, I'm not even sure it's a two piece wing with a tube. From other owners pictures it is hard to tell the design and layout of the airframe for me to make a decision if the mid wing mod is even feasable.

Doug

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Post #: 8

RE: 30% 300S mod to mid wing? - 1/11/2008 10:04:51 PM

as722

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To be honest it's been such a long time that I can't remember if the tank was in front or on top of the tank but I would try to center the tank on the CG if at all possible. You must remember that if you raise the wing it will not become a 300 since it still has the single place canopy, however there was a one of a kind extra called the extra "300 special" that started as an extra 300 and was later retrofited with a single place canopy which is basically what you will have if you raise the wing. I actually think that raising the wing might make it easier when it comes time to build the "pocket" around the wing.

Albert

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RE: 30% 300S mod to mid wing? - 1/11/2008 10:44:38 PM

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Albert,

Not having the kit and plans in my possession yet to know the details of the fuse build, I was thinking about not making the pockets and doing the fuse similar to your builds on the 40% Extra. Maybe the design of the structure wont allow but it was a thought, and it might give me some additional wing area. Any thoughts on putting the new DA-85 on this airplane?

Doug

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Post #: 10

RE: 30% 300S mod to mid wing? - 1/12/2008 2:06:25 AM

as722

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The 30% 300s is very different in the way it builds than the current carden aircraft but you can probably change and build it lighter at the same time. As far as the 85, I think is too much engine I would go with the 50.

Albert

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RE: 30% 300S mod to mid wing? - 1/12/2008 3:00:54 PM

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Thanks Albert,

After sleeping on this one for several nights, I have come to the conclusion that I am trying to make this kit into somthing it's not. From what I have learned about this kit, it is the perfect airplane for way it was designed. I will only be doing the design injustice by trying to modify it to somthing it was not intended to look or fly like. I think I will offer this kit for sale after I recieve it from the previous owner this week. Know anyone interesed in a sill in the box 30% Extra 300? I will take what I paid for the kit $350 plus shipping. I want the 40%er and will be looking for help when I start that project.

Thank you,
Doug

Ward if you are following this thread, thanks for the inspiration and I will square up with you at the end of this week.

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Post #: 12

RE: 30% 300S mod to mid wing? - 1/14/2008 12:58:47 AM

zzw26n

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Doug,

I would suggest that you go with your gut instinct first and build it. Not sure if you've done any Giant Scale stuff, but this would make a great entry into building, setting up and Flying Giant Scale. I don't know anyone who has gone from glow to a 40%'er. The steps of 1.20 size, 50cc, 100cc and 150cc make allot of sense after living thru them. I still have four 50cc size planes (2 Cardens) and there are days that you'll want to Fly them. (windy, fun fly, etc.) You'll get plenty of help here also.

Ward

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Post #: 13

RE: 30% 300S mod to mid wing? - 1/23/2008 2:02:18 AM

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I'm gona build it. Looked over the plans for the last few days, making the mid wing modificaton shouldn't be a problem from what I can see. Carden builders please weigh in with your tips or advice. My first question is regarding tapered ailerons, should I or should I not and please educate me on the difference needed for beveling the LE and TE for this set up.

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Post #: 14

RE: 30% 300S mod to mid wing? - 1/23/2008 5:06:24 PM

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Here are the three boxes. Big box is the foam wing, stabs, and decking which are nice and safe until needed. Medium box is the cowl, canopy and gear. The long flat one is the fuselage in the form of balsa sticks and sheeting. Just a few shots of my pilot for some perspective of size for those unfamilar with a 30%er. Wing span is 89" fuselage length 78", finished weight should be around 19lbs.

First thing for me was to lay out the plans and determine if raising the wing would be a building/structural issue. I have tried to examine every angle and the new wing centerline location will be raised 2" from the plan locations. I chose this location because it is a mirror image from the top of the truss as the plans show for the original centerline location. This places the wing centerline 7/8" below the center line of thrust.

I do not like the tap method through the wing into the wing tube as a retaing method. Therefore I will be adding retainers (1 each side) through the wing root into the fuse. Question? I have seen both methods 1. screw head inside root cap with threads into fuse with nut for retainer or 2. blind nut inside root cap with retainer screw from inside fuse into wing. Any advantages one way or the other? I think I would prefer method 2 myself, but this is my first model with this design.

Doug

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