RE: 1/8 scale functional Hamilton Standard hub for RCV SP engines. (Full Version)

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Juice -> RE: 1/8 scale functional Hamilton Standard hub for RCV SP engines. (5/8/2008 9:14:58 PM)

Ken... You're in. Just out of curiosity, what airplane and engine are you planning to use the hub on? I remember reading about your Kyosho Corsair. Is the hub for that? Which engine?

Josh



SCALECRAFT -> RE: 1/8 scale functional Hamilton Standard hub for RCV SP engines. (5/8/2008 11:18:39 PM)

Hi All

i thought I would post some info on my RCV 120SP powered VQ hurricane. I flew it with a 2 blade 15x14 wood blade. No cowl,no spinner. The engine ran well, idle was low and perfect.

in flight the muffler came loose from vibration, notorious for this, and the engine quit due to no pressure. Ok my fault.

So i slope soared the model in. the prop broke and the plastic back plate took a little hit. Not bad, however I noticed the crank was now binding against the cylinder drive gear. Nothing broken, just a gear clearance problem. I'm sure I can disassemble and reset the clearance with some patience.

From what I have seen in the past, the RCV seems a bit fragile on the frontal impact compared to a conventional direct drive engine.

So be careful with blade strikes and hard nose overs.

Steve



snurckle -> RE: 1/8 scale functional Hamilton Standard hub for RCV SP engines. (5/9/2008 12:30:31 AM)

Scalecraft - good to know, just means I have to be more careful.

All who have built the TF 1/8th scale Corsair - What is the distance from the Prop nut to the ground when the plane is level - and not on the tailwheel? Just curious whether an 18" blade will be too big for the plane, or if I should consider the RCV 90 with a 16" prop.

I'm currently building a list of all the mods I have seen on the corsair, and when I get home (on Saturday), I'm going to go through the manual with a fine tooth comb, and put stickies in it, showing where I need to consult the mods. The kit arrived at home today, the wife was sure to let me know- conversation went something like - "What the h!@#, yada yada yada" I tuned out after the h@#$, and simply said "So, I take it the plane arrived in the mail". -That didn't go over so well. I'm away TAD/TDY right now, but will be able to get to work on it Saturday....after I build the table to build the kit.

I'll probably still put the RCV120 in it....not like I have to decide any time soon, but I have allocated the funds for the hub, so I'm definately tied in to one of the two engines.



77chickenhawk -> RE: 1/8 scale functional Hamilton Standard hub for RCV SP engines. (5/9/2008 2:23:56 AM)

i think 19.5 inch is scale for a 60 size corrsair. based off areotechs site. just dont strike the prop..

http://www.aerotechmodels.com/static.htm



Skaweee -> RE: 1/8 scale functional Hamilton Standard hub for RCV SP engines. (5/9/2008 3:08:47 AM)

Josh, the hub may get used with the Kyosho indeed, with an RCV90-SP and the 16" blades. With a wingspan of 58-1/2", it's not a lot smaller than a 60 sized corsair. Still, the 16" Solo-Prop blades may look a little fat and stubby for this size airplane. Most likely, I'll use a KMP 16 X 13 Signature Prop with that model:

http://www.kmp.ca/product_info.php?cPath=27_31&products_id=177&osCsid=5b0b52a4f6b4c647277b5980d90d4a50

I was originally planning on using the RCV60-SP and 16 X 10 3-blade Master Airscrew, but I think I want to go with a little more power.

I do have a Royal Corsair 60 kit as well as a Marutaka Corsair 60 kit, at least one of which will be built some day. The hub will certainly be used on this build with the 120-SP and 18" blades if possible.

Ken



Juice -> RE: 1/8 scale functional Hamilton Standard hub for RCV SP engines. (5/9/2008 6:02:02 AM)

Steve... I've only had one hard blade strike when my TF Corsair crashed. The engine got really dirty, but no damage. I have had plenty of nose overs. Especially on the H9 Corsair which has a very stiff tail gear that will make the tail bounce high on any little bump. I have never used a wood prop. The composite props leave a big divets in the grass, but engines (RCV 60 and 90SPs) are always fine. But I agree, with the big props the RCV's turn, you always have to very careful about prop strikes and nose overs. RCV makes the worst mufflers in the industry!

Ken... I've flown the 1/8th scale TF Corsair with the 90SP and APC 18x12 2-blade props. It had Robart retracts and struts. There is plenty of ground clearance with 18" props, even on grass runways.

Josh



HellcatAce -> RE: 1/8 scale functional Hamilton Standard hub for RCV SP engines. (5/11/2008 8:27:41 PM)

So...if for no other reason than a bump, have you done any flight testing yet?



Juice -> RE: 1/8 scale functional Hamilton Standard hub for RCV SP engines. (5/12/2008 5:10:20 AM)

HellcatAce... No test flight yet. I've been wanting to do it for almost 2 weeks now. But instead, I've been struggling trying to get a good idle on the engine. It turns out the fuel that I just taken out of storage was bad. Actually I think it was bad before I put it in storage, which is the reason why I put it in storage in the first place.

Anyways, just this morning, I used a fresh jug of 15% Coolpower and I'm now getting a nice reliable idle at 1600 RPM with the APC 15.75x13 3-blade prop. I may have been able to get it lower, but I ran out of time to fiddle around with it. 1600 RPM is low enough I think. Now I can do a test flight with the hub.

The test flight is the last thing I need to do before I feel comfortable placing the final CNC order and selling the hubs. I hope to do it this week. I'm very sorry for the delay.

Josh



Juice -> RE: 1/8 scale functional Hamilton Standard hub for RCV SP engines. (5/14/2008 2:48:43 PM)

The Test Flight

I finally did the test flight. As you can see from this video, the hub performed well. The pilot was a little rusty.
First Flight with the 1/8 scale Hub

Here are some details...

1) On May 5, the last thing I did with the hub was to bolt on 16" props set to 11" pitch do to an RPM test (Post #: 141). I have removed and re-installed the hub from the airplane (a few times), but the props had always remained bolted into the hub. This detail is good to know, because it's nice that you don't have to set the pitch every time you mount the prop. Once you find the right pitch for your setup, there's no reason to take the assembly apart.

2) Fuel used: Coolpower, 15% nitro. I could get a nice reliable idle with this fuel.

3) Not shown in the video, I started the engine with a chicken stick. My electric starter had the wand, but I have no access to the starter bolt with the cowl on (the typical rubber cut was at home).

4) I had two prop strikes. Once on a nose over during the taxi out. Another on my hard landing. After each time, I checked that the props and hub didn't break. They didn't.

5) I was a little nervous. I kept the flight short. I forgot to do a loop and a vertical manouver.

I am very happy with the performae of the hub and props. Both in the air and on the unfortunate ground strikes. Actually, the prop strikes are a blessing in disguise, becuase it proves tha the hub and props are robust.

Josh



Juice -> RE: 1/8 scale functional Hamilton Standard hub for RCV SP engines. (5/14/2008 3:07:08 PM)

I forgot to say what next.

I feel comfortable now to place the final CNC order. I'll give the last few undecided people until Friday May 16 to decide.

I need to the Tru-Turn dome spinners and the 6-32 socket head cap screws.

For those that have signed up for a hub, you need to order your props and extension bolt from Soloprops (http://www.soloprops.com). Make sure you instruct Carl of Soloprops to combine the order with the others to ship to me. Also let me know what you ordered so I know how what is yours when the order arrives.

I will give each of you a bill after I've paid for everything first and divided the costs. I will ship your package when I receive your funds.

Question to all: How do you prefer to make the payments? I prefer Paypal, but I'm flexible.

Josh



Rocketman612 -> RE: 1/8 scale functional Hamilton Standard hub for RCV SP engines. (5/14/2008 8:56:43 PM)

Josh,
Way to go. Knew the Coolpower 15 would be good. Looks like the wheel dug in at touchdown??

Glad nothing broken. She fly's great.

Pete



Skaweee -> RE: 1/8 scale functional Hamilton Standard hub for RCV SP engines. (5/14/2008 9:23:49 PM)

Boy, that looks great!

I have the funds for the hub, but not so sure I can swing the blades etc. from Solo-Prop at this time. Do you have to make adjustments to fit the blades? If so, I'll find a way to scrape together the $ for the blades. If not, can I just purchase the hub for now? PayPal would be perfect for me.

Ken



Juice -> RE: 1/8 scale functional Hamilton Standard hub for RCV SP engines. (5/14/2008 9:58:20 PM)

quote:

Do you have to make adjustments to fit the blades?

No.

My hub is like the original Soloprop hub in that all blade sizes and shapes will fit in any hub. This was good when I was experimenting with 16" and 18" props (someone will have to experiment with 18" and 20" props for their RCV 120SP). It will be especially good if you have a worse landing than mine and break a prop. Just unbolt, take out broken prop, put in a new prop.

That brings up another point. Now that I know that 16" props is the right choice for the RCV 90SP, I'm going to buy extras in case a prop does break. Then I don't have to wait for a shipment to get flying again. You guys should consider this also.

quote:

If not, can I just purchase the hub for now?

Yes.



snurckle -> RE: 1/8 scale functional Hamilton Standard hub for RCV SP engines. (5/14/2008 11:06:16 PM)

Ouch on the landing...

I need to make a better decision on the engine here, and I think that's going to require a better test. The video shows two nose overs, and while the taxi may have been caused by something other than the prop and hub combination, I can't make a good decision whether the 18" prop would be a good choice.

I do know - I'll be buying this hub, and I will not be purchasing the props until later on.

I will send you a pm about payment.



grinder-RCU -> RE: 1/8 scale functional Hamilton Standard hub for RCV SP engines. (5/15/2008 6:52:54 AM)

Pm sent. To bad the 18" blades didn't work out.

Grinder.



Juice -> RE: 1/8 scale functional Hamilton Standard hub for RCV SP engines. (5/15/2008 2:17:25 PM)

Grinder... Yes, I was disappointed too about the 18" props on the 90SP. Hopefully the 120SP owners will be able to use them.

Here's something I've been thinking about... On my 90SP, the 18" props set to 10" pitch turns at 4450 RPM. The H9 Corsair will fly on that. The engine will be overworked but only at full throttle for the take-off and climb. Then throttle down fo the rest of the flight. I'm very tempted to try this, but only once. Is it a good or bad idea?

Josh



snurckle -> RE: 1/8 scale functional Hamilton Standard hub for RCV SP engines. (5/15/2008 5:28:59 PM)

Juice-
Can you take a measurement for me. Measure the H9 Corsair from hub to ground and the end of the prop to ground, with the tail level...i.e - expected distance from hub/prop to the ground during takeoff and landing roll, given tailwheel up attitude.

I will be flying a TF Corsair 1/8th scale, and wanted to compare the distance on the H9 Corsair, since we have a visual representation on that aircraft, and should be able to make an educated decision on how other Aircraft will handle various props. The RCV 120 will handle a 22, but it'll be too long, and will no doubt become a lawn mower if used. I theorize that the 18 inch blade will be cutting it very close. I think somebody said 19.5 inches from prop center to ground.

Also, can you measure the distance from the end of the 16" prop to the ground with the same tailwheel attitude.

So, looking for two measurements - Hub to ground, and end of prop to ground, both with tailwheel in takeoff/landing attitude.



grinder-RCU -> RE: 1/8 scale functional Hamilton Standard hub for RCV SP engines. (5/15/2008 5:59:25 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Juice

Grinder... Yes, I was disappointed too about the 18" props on the 90SP. Hopefully the 120SP owners will be able to use them.

Here's something I've been thinking about... On my 90SP, the 18" props set to 10" pitch turns at 4450 RPM. The H9 Corsair will fly on that. The engine will be overworked but only at full throttle for the take-off and climb. Then throttle down fo the rest of the flight. I'm very tempted to try this, but only once. Is it a good or bad idea?

Josh


I was going to ask you if you thought of running 18"x 10 3 blade would work at 4450 rpm. I think i'm going to try it.



Juice -> RE: 1/8 scale functional Hamilton Standard hub for RCV SP engines. (5/15/2008 8:24:55 PM)

snurckle...

I'll get you those numbers when I get home tonight.

In the mean time, take a look at this video I took last year with a regular Master Airscrew 18x12 2-bladed prop. In particular, notice the 20 feet (+/-) of take-off roll when the tail is up. Also notice the hard landing and the 50 feet (+/-) when main wheels are on the ground and the tail is up. It even points nose down momentarily. There's plenty of ground clearance.

H9CorsairFlight2.wmv

I've even flown my RCV 90SP on my previous TF Corsair with an APC 18x12 2-bladed prop. Again, plenty of ground clearance. Every time has been on a grass runway.

Josh



HellcatAce -> RE: 1/8 scale functional Hamilton Standard hub for RCV SP engines. (5/15/2008 11:08:36 PM)

Congrats on seeing this through from concept to completion! I guess us guys who fly off hard runways have a little less trouble with those pesky nose-overs. Paypal sounds good to me for payment. PM sent.



Juice -> RE: 1/8 scale functional Hamilton Standard hub for RCV SP engines. (5/16/2008 2:20:03 AM)

snurckle...

The attached pictures have all the measurements you need.

In summary:
Uncompressed strut, ground to hub: 12"
Uncompressed strut, ground to tip of 18" prop: 3 1/4"
Compressed strut, ground to hub: 11"
Compressed strut, ground to tip of 18" prop: 2 3/8"

For ground to tip of 16" props, just add 1" to the above numbers.

Note: For those who noticed that 12-(18/2) doesn't equal 3.25... The size of my hub is approximately 1/2" smaller in diameter compared to the Soloprop hub. So 18" props on my hub are actually 17.5". and 16" props are actually 15.5".

Josh



impalacustom -> RE: 1/8 scale functional Hamilton Standard hub for RCV SP engines. (5/16/2008 4:47:27 AM)

Very sweet Juice, I just logged back into RCU for being away for quite some time and noticed this thread. You have some serious skills with CAD, I remember doing some CAD work at the University. I am curious if you did this at home or work? Do you have access to any FEA software? I'd be curious what some and where the stresses are at on the hub. Again, kick ass and way to go buddy, I am glad to see someone doing this stuff.



snurckle -> RE: 1/8 scale functional Hamilton Standard hub for RCV SP engines. (5/16/2008 2:24:04 PM)

Juice,
Thanks ALOT! Makes me feel that much batter about the RCV 120SP, and 18" props. I am likely to try 18" at the beginning, and step up to 20" after I've gotten more comfortable with the aircraft.

Again, thanks for all the hard work and effort you have put in to making this project a reality. I'm building the table this weekend or this evening, and will hopefully start my build on Sunday.

Just out of curiosity - how many are getting this hub?



Juice -> RE: 1/8 scale functional Hamilton Standard hub for RCV SP engines. (5/16/2008 3:59:21 PM)

quote:

Just out of curiosity - how many are getting this hub?

14.

I'm going to get one extra, for a total of 15, to get to the next discount level. While I'm at it, let me use this post to break down the costs so far...

Stuff from me (you pay me):
- 1 rear hub half , $87.60
- 1 front hub half, $87.60
- 1 actuator, $40
- 12 6-32 x 3/8" socket head cap screws, $2.78

Stuff from Soloprop (you pay Soloprop):
- 3 (or more) Prop blades, $ depends on what you want.
- 1 Extension Nut and Washer (Part #45624), $16.00

Other stuff:
- 1-1/4" B-Style Prop Hub from Tru-Turn (TTH-1250-B), $19.95 from Tru-Turn or $17 from me.
- 1 8-32 socket head cap screw (but it may already come with the Tru-Turn hub), $peanuts
- Shipping, $ depends on your location.

My LHS said they can sell me the Tru-Turn hubs for $17 each if I order at least 10.

Question to all: Who wants me to buy the Tru-Turn hub for them? I need to know how many to order. I ask because some people already have one.

Josh



snurckle -> RE: 1/8 scale functional Hamilton Standard hub for RCV SP engines. (5/16/2008 4:31:18 PM)

So, the sum of everything minus the Soloprop stuff is= $263.58

Is that American or Canadian Dollars - not that the exchange rate is that much of a difference.

I would prefer to just pay you for everything minus the soloprop stuff. It would/should be easier to do it that way, but the cost coming out of your pocket upfront is something that concerns me, so whichever is best for you works for me as well.



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