RE: RCGF 100cc Petrol Engine  
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RE: RCGF 100cc Petrol Engine - 3/4/2008 3:52:03 AM   
Tired Old Man


 

Posts: 11367
Joined: 2/25/2002
From: Central, CA, USA
Status: offline 		post irrelevant and edited accordingly.

< Message edited by Pat Roy -- 3/5/2008 3:47:10 AM >

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If you can''''t fix it with a hammer, you have an electrical problem.

(in reply to Mitsu1)
       Post #: 51

RE: RCGF 100cc Petrol Engine - 3/4/2008 5:11:03 AM   
T3beatz


 

Posts: 199
Joined: 10/21/2007
From: Florissant , MO, USA
Status: offline 		Hey,

yeah, I would have though someone would already be selling them over here. They are pretty good for the price if you ask me,engines to get into it yet. I have a small video showing some of the pull power on this engine, this is me landing on a very windy day... This is the third flight with the engine ( still working on the tunning)... xoar 22x10

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9QWrRyKmhSA

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       Post #: 52

RE: RCGF 100cc Petrol Engine - 3/4/2008 7:23:26 AM   
Tired Old Man


 

Posts: 11367
Joined: 2/25/2002
From: Central, CA, USA
Status: offline 		I've got one of the 100cc engines arriving in the next day or so for evaluation. If it works out to my expectations and I believe the quality was high enough I would consider becoming a distributor.

The problem that comes up is everyone would want to buy them for the same amount I did. That's where the eastern manufacturers screw themselves out of distributors. When they openly post pricing on their websites they destroy any possibility of a distributor to make any money from doing all the importing, handling, testing, packaging, ops manual development and publishing, customer shipping, parts warehousing, and customer service. Adding to that the distributor has to front the money to the manufacturer well in advance of product delivery, denying the distributor any interest on the money while waiting a month or more for product. All of that costs time, labor, and money, and lots of it, not to mention any product liability insurance. You would be a damn fool to commercially sell an engine without it in this country. Everyone seems to think somebody else should work for free or provide them something for nothing. If you were to want those same customers to sell you something in the same manner they would scream to high heaven about how you were trying to take advantage of them or be taking money out of their pockets.

You can't expect someone to shell out many thousands of dollars up front for product and receive even money in trickle back return.

_____________________________

If you can''''t fix it with a hammer, you have an electrical problem.

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       Post #: 53

RE: RCGF 100cc Petrol Engine - 3/4/2008 9:54:40 AM   
drewbags



Posts: 185
Joined: 1/27/2005
From: NorwichNorfolk, UNITED KINGDOM
Status: offline 		Does anyone have the measurement between the exhaust bolts for attaching headers and cans?

(in reply to Tired Old Man)
       Post #: 54

RE: RCGF 100cc Petrol Engine - 3/4/2008 10:10:16 AM   
driesbabe


 

Posts: 210
Joined: 4/14/2004
From: Windhoek, NAMIBIA
Status: online 		42MM ANY 100 HEADER WILL FIT

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RCGF Engines Africa
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       Post #: 55

RE: RCGF 100cc Petrol Engine - 3/4/2008 2:38:42 PM   
triangle



Posts: 199
Joined: 9/3/2002
From: Lake Worth, FL, USA
Status: offline 		SO....the price in the us????

(in reply to driesbabe)
       Post #: 56

RE: RCGF 100cc Petrol Engine - 3/4/2008 4:22:45 PM   
Tired Old Man


 

Posts: 11367
Joined: 2/25/2002
From: Central, CA, USA
Status: offline 		Nothing firm at this time. Anticipate approxmately $875.00 (+/-) with stock mufflers and ignition.

_____________________________

If you can''''t fix it with a hammer, you have an electrical problem.

(in reply to triangle)
       Post #: 57

RE: RCGF 100cc Petrol Engine - 3/5/2008 3:19:34 AM   
Tired Old Man


 

Posts: 11367
Joined: 2/25/2002
From: Central, CA, USA
Status: offline 		I received one of the 100cc rear induction engines today. First impressions on the visuals are overall not bad, but needs a little work. There's more casting flash on the externals than I like to see. That usually means I need to go inside and look at the bottom of the cylinders for more.

The engine case is milled aluminum. I don't know if it's CNC r not. I suspect so. The finish level is not milspec but is acceptable. Having a milled case instead of cast means the mounting lugs on this one will stand the test of time. That's a good deal. Engine weight, with spark plugs, prop washer, and prop mounting bolts is 5 lbs. 2 oz. Muffler weights are 5 oz each. Ignition weight is 6 oz. The four supplied aluminum standoffs are 1 oz. each. the engine comes lighter than a DA-100, Brison 6.4, or a 3W-106. No manual is provided but it's a gas engine with a two needle carb so what's hard to figure out? Rough dimensions are noted in the pics with the tape measure.

The induction method is case porting and reed valves. Massive intake ports and metal reeds. There was quite a bit of debris inside the engine when it arrived. I don't know if that was from a lack of closed packaging around the engine and was ingested during shipping around the world or if someone in the shop had a sloppy work area. Either way it requires that the engine be disassembled for inspection and cleaning prior to use. That would have happened anyway, so no big deal.

The included mufflers are of the same quality as those provided with 3MM engines. Not the highest quality but pretty light at 5 ounces each. A Bisson or J&A for a 52cc engine weighs in at 7 ounces each. The mufflers will not fit a 3w-106 so that cross over is ruled out. One thing that I find troubling is the thickness of the exhaust mounting flanges. On one cylinder they are very thin and could be prone to breaking from engine vibration. I'd like to see them increased in thickness to a minimum of 5mm across the entire flange, with the screw boss made deeper still to accept a threaded screw instead of a screw and nut for better longevity and a little peace of mind.

Pistons are a two ring design which is very good for heat transfer. There is plenty of fin area for shedding heat. The carb is similar to a Walbro, but at the same time not. It looks like an SDC 80 would be a straight swap if ever needed. The throttle linkage is the standard yard tool type that you see most of the time and not a custom made lever designed specifically for RC use. No big deal since the throttle lever has a hole in it that will accept a 4-40 screw without any trouble. Opening the throttle is a "push", not a "pull". Rigid linkage would be much better than using a cable and easy to connect.

The provided ignition is RCexl. I'm reasonably certain it's not the version with input from CH but it should be just fine. The prop bolts are 5mm. The threads in the pilot shaft for the spinner are also 5mm but appear to be reverse threaded. If so, I cannot understand why it was done that way.

So, first impressions are not bad at all and worth the risk of the expense on my part. It needs a little work to meet my standards for externals and cleanliness. Internals will be explored a bit later, along with running and flight tests. I'd like to put it on a stand and run it for about 100 hours but that's not possible at the moment. It's well worth further testing. Likely it will end up on the front of a Wild Hare 40% Giles that's curently powered with a Brison 105. The Brison has plenty of power for the plane and the RCGF would shave a couple of ounces off the nose, which would not be a bad thing.

My thanks to Driesbabe for being my agent for this purchase and for the opportunity to check this one out as a sample unit. More on this engine to come.

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< Message edited by Pat Roy -- 3/5/2008 3:44:32 AM >

_____________________________

If you can''''t fix it with a hammer, you have an electrical problem.

(in reply to Tired Old Man)
       Post #: 58

RE: RCGF 100cc Petrol Engine - 3/5/2008 5:35:13 AM   
driesbabe


 

Posts: 210
Joined: 4/14/2004
From: Windhoek, NAMIBIA
Status: online 		Good Morning,
Pat, I'm more than happy that you received your engine. I hope there was no trouble in getting it?
Now we have it, all and everything that we ever want to know about the workings of this unit, we do already know that these RCGF engines run very well, now Pat is going to tell us everything else that we need to know.

About Pat's concerns about the exhaust mounting on the Jug! This is a quote that I received from the Factory yesterday concerning that problem!

"I have checked the problem which you mentioned for our engines, for the exhaust of 50cc and 100cc. We have already adjusted the exhaust of our 100cc engine and 50cc engine this time ,now it's easier to handle .You can check the goods when they arrive"

So, It seams that these people are responding to their customer’s requests.

As for the Carb, Pat, I have check it against as you say a SCD80 from Walbro, and it’s a perfect copy, apparently the carb is manufactured by the Chinese partner of Walbro and parts are interchangeable.

As for the Manual not being present, that’s my doing, I removed it from the package, as it has some Chinese righting in it and that’s no good incase Customs opens the Box,,,,,,,,I will not elaborate any further on this point, lets just say that it's not always easy living in Africa.
The manual included with the engines are actually written by me, as the ones that where shipped with the first units where useless. The Manual is very straight forward, but as I am the DL engines agent in South Africa also, it very closely resembles that of a DL-50. It dose however include a parts list.

regards
Andreas

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RCGF Engines Africa
www.pilzers.net

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       Post #: 59

RE: RCGF 100cc Petrol Engine - 3/5/2008 6:33:26 AM   
Tired Old Man


 

Posts: 11367
Joined: 2/25/2002
From: Central, CA, USA
Status: offline 		Makes sense to me. No problems at all with the delivery.

I got into the internals a little after the last post. It looks like some pretty good machine work inside with no casting flash at the bottom of the cylinders. It more than offsets the slightly rough externals. If a company wants to concetrate on the inside rather than the out that's quite all right by me. The inside is the part that matters.

Looking at the ring stop pins shows that the manufacturer paid some attention to details. They are well offset from each other and located clear of any porting. That's more than I can say for a certain European manufacturer. I'm tempted to redesign the mufflers and send these off to J&A or Jtec for a major facelift. It's good to hear that the exhaust flanges have already been addressed by the manufacturer.

I'm a little surprised about the spark plug selection. I would have expected fitting a CM-6 or equalivalent rather than the larger 14mm plug. That would have lowered the cost of the ignition units slightly. Nothing at all wrong with these, and they are easier to obtain for many since they cross reference with several other plugs. If someone had a compelling desire to reduce the engine cross section a little they could fit reduction inserts and run the CM-6 but would have to change plug caps. Cheaper to change the entire ignition if they went that route.

_____________________________

If you can''''t fix it with a hammer, you have an electrical problem.

(in reply to driesbabe)
       Post #: 60

RE: RCGF 100cc Petrol Engine - 3/5/2008 7:09:41 AM   
driesbabe


 

Posts: 210
Joined: 4/14/2004
From: Windhoek, NAMIBIA
Status: online 		Hi Pat,
Thank god everything went well.
Just one comment regarding the Ignition and the plugs. I for one am very happy that they are using the plug they are, as C-M6's are almost impossible to get here. As for the pricing of the Ignition, you will actually be surprised to hear that the C-M6 Ignition is more expensive than the 14mm one. Don't ask me why, but I think it is because the CM-6 is a non-resistor plug and needs a resistor separately inside the cap???? I pay about 6USD more for a single and about 11USD more for a twin CM-6 ignition. I also pay 1 USD more for the cap and boot kit only??

As for the Internals, there is one thing that worries me, and that is the lack of a gasket between the two crankcase halves.

Regards
Andreas

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RCGF Engines Africa
www.pilzers.net

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       Post #: 61

RE: RCGF 100cc Petrol Engine - 3/5/2008 8:23:35 AM   
aussiesteve


 

Posts: 996
Joined: 10/12/2005
From: TEDA (Tianjin)Tianjin, CHINA
Status: offline 		Hi Andreas & Pat
I have the same thoughts on the plugs etc.

Andreas - for the lack of gasket between the crankcase halves, it is not really a problem. By not having a gasket, they can keep the fitting tolerances in check. I disassembled one of each of my motors when I got my first shipment - just to look inside. I was also pretty happy with what I saw in there (Or more to the point - what I didn't see).

When I put the crankcase back together, I used a small smear of red loctite flange sealant (I can't rememeber the number off hand but it is the high temp one) on the faces.

I'm also making up a set of bolt torque tables for the various engines - I'll send them to you when I finish them. especially now that I understand why the manuals are better than most (I wondered who assisted there).

Andreas - have you compared the DL 50 and this 50 side by side for power yet? - I have just completed a plane that is identical to another one I have that has the DL in it (RCLeague Yak) but have yet to fly it - It will be interesting to see the result - We all know that the DL is a good engine. I'll PM you with the results once I have them (It'll be few weeks yet because I have just come back to work after a small vacation)

Steve

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RCGF engines & Boxes, 33RC airframes, Tzone models, Super Kraft (SK) & others

(in reply to driesbabe)
       Post #: 62

RE: RCGF 100cc Petrol Engine - 3/5/2008 8:51:50 AM   
driesbabe


 

Posts: 210
Joined: 4/14/2004
From: Windhoek, NAMIBIA
Status: online 		Hi Steve,

No, No side-by-side comparison on the motors ye