RE: 4* 60 first time build by 67 yr. old  
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RE: 4* 60 first time build by 67 yr. old - 3/20/2008 2:38:12 AM   
mred33


 

Posts: 267
Joined: 5/12/2006
From: Glenwood, GA, USA
Status: offline 		Anywhere you have a hole that a screw is going into in wood you put some thin CA in it and make sure it it dry before you put the screw in, or you may not get the screw out again. If you tapped the hole for wing hold down screws or something like that you can run a tap in again. Other wise, just run the screw in and out to retap the hole.

You can use just about anything to fill a void, but I like balsa filler because it is easy to sand and light. Epoxy is my last choice unless I want strength. RTV is my choice because it is cheap, easy to find and is very elastic after it dries. It does a fine job of holding fuel lines in the firewall, but that is what I use. You can use anything as long as you seal the hole in the firewall from fuel. I have also drilled the hole a little undersized and sealed it with CA then put the tubing in. You kind of have to work at it to get it to go in the hole, but it seems to work OK and I haven't had any chaffing problems yet, but then it's only been in there a year. I change my fuel tubing about once a year anyway, so I'll find out pretty soon how it looks.

Your doing a great job on the plane, keep up the good work. Just remember that anything we all say is probably just our own way of doing things. That does not mean you have to do it that way. How much experence do you have covering with film? If you are a little new, then I would advise you to get a book on coverning by someone that really knows how to cover. You will learn a lot.
Ed

_____________________________

SOME PEOPLE ARE LIKE SLINKIES. NOT REALLY GOOD FOR ANYTHING, BUT THEY BRING A SMILE TO YOUR FACE WHEN PUSHED DOWN THE STAIRS

(in reply to SeamusG)
       Post #: 101

RE: 4* 60 first time build by 67 yr. old - 3/20/2008 2:48:00 AM   
SeamusG


 

Posts: 184
Joined: 6/16/2007
From: Westminster, CO, USA
Status: offline 		At the recommendation of a LHS owner that is one of the area's best builders I bought Harry Higley's Tom's Techniques.

Here's a TOC for the book to see if it's something that you'd be interested in:
Book Chapter Desc Page
Tom's Techniques 1 An Introduction Is this book for you 1
Tom's Techniques 1 An Introduction How to use this book 1
Tom's Techniques 1 An Introduction About the authors 1
Tom's Techniques 2 Plastic Films Characteristics Introduction 3
Tom's Techniques 2 Plastic Films Characteristics Advantages over paint 3
Tom's Techniques 2 Plastic Films Characteristics Film's limitations 4
Tom's Techniques 3 Tools and Other Things Tools and other things 6
Tom's Techniques 4 Fundamentals Learn with scrap 9
Tom's Techniques 4 Fundamentals Slack and excess 9
Tom's Techniques 4 Fundamentals Flat balsa surfaces 9
Tom's Techniques 4 Fundamentals An open structure 10
Tom's Techniques 4 Fundamentals Film connecting methods 13
Tom's Techniques 4 Fundamentals Kinds of curves 13
Tom's Techniques 4 Fundamentals Finishing compound complex surfaces 14
Tom's Techniques 5 Ailerons Introduction 19
Tom's Techniques 5 Ailerons Ailerons 19
Tom's Techniques 6 A Typical Wing Introduction 21
Tom's Techniques 6 A Typical Wing A simple wingtip 21
Tom's Techniques 6 A Typical Wing The entire wing 25
Tom's Techniques 7 Four Special Wingtips An introduction 27
Tom's Techniques 7 Four Special Wingtips A bevel tip 27
Tom's Techniques 7 Four Special Wingtips A balsa sheet wingtip 27
Tom's Techniques 7 Four Special Wingtips A built-up tip 28
Tom's Techniques 7 Four Special Wingtips A horner wingtip 28
Tom's Techniques 8 Trim An introduction 33
Tom's Techniques 8 Trim Fundamentals 33
Tom's Techniques 8 Trim A typical example 35
Tom's Techniques 9 Fuselages Planning ahead 37
Tom's Techniques 9 Fuselages Prefinish checkout 37
Tom's Techniques 9 Fuselages Covering the fuselage 37
Tom's Techniques 10 A Built-up Deck A built-up deck 42
Tom's Techniques 11 Fillets An introduction 47
Tom's Techniques 11 Fillets Multiple film pieces per fillet 47
Tom's Techniques 11 Fillets One piece per fillet 48
Tom's Techniques 12 Radial Cowls Radial cowls 51
Tom's Techniques 13 Graphics An introduction 54
Tom's Techniques 13 Graphics Patterns 54
Tom's Techniques 13 Graphics Application 54


_____________________________

Experience is what ya get when ya don''t get what ya want - me - SeamusG

(in reply to mred33)
       Post #: 102

RE: 4* 60 first time build by 67 yr. old - 3/20/2008 2:52:53 AM   
mred33


 

Posts: 267
Joined: 5/12/2006
From: Glenwood, GA, USA
Status: offline 		Looks like a very good book. I just may add that to my collection. I have a couple on using film, but not this one. I am always interested in learning more. Thanks for the information. This is a new book to me.
Ed

_____________________________

SOME PEOPLE ARE LIKE SLINKIES. NOT REALLY GOOD FOR ANYTHING, BUT THEY BRING A SMILE TO YOUR FACE WHEN PUSHED DOWN THE STAIRS

(in reply to SeamusG)
       Post #: 103

RE: 4* 60 first time build by 67 yr. old - 3/20/2008 8:27:54 PM   
dapam03


 

Posts: 125
Joined: 1/8/2008
From: Morrisburg, ON, CANADA
Status: offline 		Thanks for the help guys, i appreciate your input. That looks like a good book. I'll see if I can pick one up. I read a lot of forums here before I started building. I learned a lot from them. And the support on here is fantastic. I'm sure there would have been a lot of screw ups on my part without the forums and people willing to help. On covering, I have a dvd on monocote. I also bookmarked a couple of sites on covering. I think I'll use ultracote. They say it's easiest to use. After all this work, I want it to look nice. Today i'm doing some sanding. Then I'll be starting on the tail section.

< Message edited by dapam03 -- 3/20/2008 8:39:49 PM >

(in reply to mred33)
       Post #: 104

RE: 4* 60 first time build by 67 yr. old - 3/20/2008 8:51:00 PM   
SeamusG


 

Posts: 184
Joined: 6/16/2007
From: Westminster, CO, USA
Status: offline 		Just a note on covering materials, Ultracote adhesive has a much lower heat threshold than Monokote. If you want to use Monokote for trim over Ultracote use the Windex technique or Monokote Trim Solvent - don't use heat as Monokote's adhesive heat low threshold is hotter than Ultracote's heat limit.


_____________________________

Experience is what ya get when ya don''t get what ya want - me - SeamusG

(in reply to dapam03)
       Post #: 105

RE: 4* 60 first time build by 67 yr. old - 3/21/2008 4:34:00 AM   
dapam03


 

Posts: 125
Joined: 1/8/2008
From: Morrisburg, ON, CANADA
Status: offline 		Thanks for the heads up on the covering SeamusG. I sanded the wings and fuselage today, then this evening, I built the horizontal stab. I sheeted one side, waiting for the glue to dry ( I used the alphetic glue for sheeting). Those sheetings are really warped. I had to sand one to get them to fit together. I glued them together with thin ca. I put some kicker on the waxed paper as Sig suggested, and it still sticks to the paper. Only in a couple of spots. It wasn't too bad.

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(in reply to SeamusG)
       Post #: 106

RE: 4* 60 first time build by 67 yr. old - 3/21/2008 6:01:10 AM   
SeamusG


 

Posts: 184
Joined: 6/16/2007
From: Westminster, CO, USA
Status: offline 		I'm smiling 'cause I ended up recreating both the stab and fin after warping them both by using poor technique when gluing with aliphatic resin - warped the heck out of them. One of the other builders suggested having some 3/4 ply pieces around that can be used to cover the piece completely before adding the weight.


_____________________________

Experience is what ya get when ya don''t get what ya want - me - SeamusG

(in reply to dapam03)
       Post #: 107

RE: 4* 60 first time build by 67 yr. old - 3/21/2008 10:55:19 PM   
mred33


 

Posts: 267
Joined: 5/12/2006
From: Glenwood, GA, USA
Status: offline 		I use Titebond for almost everything, but it is a water based glue and that is why it warps everything. Either pin or weight everything down until it is dry of you will be doing things over again. I found that out the hard way myself the first time I used it, but it is a great glue and cheap.
Ed

_____________________________

SOME PEOPLE ARE LIKE SLINKIES. NOT REALLY GOOD FOR ANYTHING, BUT THEY BRING A SMILE TO YOUR FACE WHEN PUSHED DOWN THE STAIRS

(in reply to SeamusG)
       Post #: 108

RE: 4* 60 first time build by 67 yr. old - 3/22/2008 12:21:59 AM   
SeamusG


 

Posts: 184
Joined: 6/16/2007
From: Westminster, CO, USA
Status: offline 		Ed - I agree with what you said. Titebond (AR) is my #1 go-to glue during construction unless strength needs to be upgraded then 30 min epoxy. An experienced friend uses AR with thin CA to speed up the process. One small exception: balsa spar webs. On my current project (Kadet Senior) I clamped the heck out of each one but you can't clamp the entire surface (unless you make custom clamps for every conceivable situation). They all had something that twisted or pulled the wrong way. Next wing (I'm very much a rookie) will get epoxy - maybe medium / thick CA - I'm open to alternatives.


_____________________________

Experience is what ya get when ya don''t get what ya want - me - SeamusG

(in reply to mred33)
       Post #: 109

RE: 4* 60 first time build by 67 yr. old - 3/22/2008 1:20:33 AM   
iron eagel



Posts: 1267
Joined: 7/15/2004
From: Middleboro, MA, USA
Status: offline 		When you glue together balsa sheeting t6o make up skins to sheath your airplane you need to do a few things to have it work out.
The first thing you need to do is insure you have a straight edges to butt up against the other. A metal straightedge is the first thing you need use it as a guide and trim back a small amount of the balsa on each sheet with a sharp blade. To glue the sheathing together you should use a cement such as Ambroid or Sigment. they dry fast and are perfect for edge joining sheets of balsa. I have done it this way for a long time with good results

If you have the time to read a tutorial I would suggest this:
http://www.airfieldmodels.com/information_source/how_to_articles_for_model_builders/construction/edge_join_balsa_sheet_skins/index.htm


I use titebond for most of my build also, and even some CA at times, for high stress areas I sometimes use epoxy. I have found that there is no one glue that will do everything and I have an issue with the fumes of CA, but there are times when there is no substitute for it.

_____________________________

The Wrights never crashed, they only had hard landings. I 've had some hard landings myself. AMA EAA AOPA revver #185

(in reply to dapam03)
       Post #: 110

RE: 4* 60 first time build by 67 yr. old - 3/22/2008 3:23:46 AM   
SeamusG


 

Posts: 184
Joined: 6/16/2007
From: Westminster, CO, USA
Status: offline 		iron - forgot about using wood modeling glue for joining balsa sheets as recommended on airfieldmodels.com. That stuff sands beautifully - unlike Titebond, CA or epoxy. It skins over extremely fast - gotta work pretty quickly.

I deciphered the primary uses for the different glues and posted it on wall above my bench. Also, I included what was needed to clean them up when wet and after they dry. FYI - acetone does a great job cleaning up epoxy (as well as alcohol) BUT it stinks for cleaning up acid brushes used to spread epoxy that are still wet. Instead use alcohol to clean 'em up.

I can't imagine learning to build kits without having the internet at our beck and call .... Only challenge is separating the good info from the bull (no mater how well intentioned)


_____________________________

Experience is what ya get when ya don''t get what ya want - me - SeamusG

(in reply to iron eagel)
       Post #: 111

RE: 4* 60 first time build by 67 yr. old - 3/22/2008 3:37:10 AM   
dapam03


 

Posts: 125
Joined: 1/8/2008
From: Morrisburg, ON, CANADA
Status: offline 		I finished up the horizontal stabilizer. It was warped in the centre after the first sheet, so when I did the other side I put more books on it for weight. It came back pretty straight, and by the time I sanded both sides, it's pretty much perfect now. Hope the fin will work out as good. I put more weight on it. I didn't take a picture of the weights. I got about 10 books stacked up, 3 encyclopedias and some other large books. That should do it.

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(in reply to SeamusG)
       Post #: 112

RE: 4* 60 first time build by 67 yr. old - 3/22/2008 4:06:24 AM   
mred33


 

Posts: 267
Joined: 5/12/2006
From: Glenwood, GA, USA
Status: offline 		Way to go with the books. That's one thing their good for. Used them myself many times. Also, when you have some strange things to clamp down, you can use pin clamps on a lot of that kind of stuff. It's amazing how many things you can clamp with them. Try some you'll, like them.
Ed

_____________________________

SOME PEOPLE ARE LIKE SLINKIES. NOT REALLY GOOD FOR ANYTHING, BUT THEY BRING A SMILE TO YOUR FACE WHEN PUSHED DOWN THE STAIRS

(in reply to dapam03)
       Post #: 113

RE: 4* 60 first time build by 67 yr. old - 3/22/2008 4:12:24 AM   
iron eagel