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Posts: 7453
Joined: 6/11/2003 From: Northridge,
CA, USA Status: offline
Hey guys, just in case you ever want to know what something is really made of just do a search for the MSDS. It's very handy to know. Here is the MSDS for the copper cream:
Posts: 311
Joined: 3/15/2002 From: GraftonNSW, AUSTRALIA Status: offline
G'day Ernie, I'm using a very fine fibre cotton cloth & simply rubbing it on - I obtained these yellow cloths in a $2 shop (2 cloths for $2 - a real steal). The cloth very quickly goes black in colour confirming the cream is doing its thing. And for in between the cooling fins on the mufflers, a medium to hard bristle toothbrush seems the way to go. I expect the same technique will work for the cooling fins on the engine.
When I get time, I will apply some of the Mother's cream to a small buffing wheel on my dremel & compare the results against the hand rubbing
Posts: 156
Joined: 4/17/2005 From: goolwasa, AUSTRALIA Status: offline
Hey Boner I remember you recommended marine 66 instead of corrosion x. I was at super cheap the other day and had a complimentry squirt of 66 and I noticed it doesnt expand like corrosion x does from what Ive read in other posts concerning corrosion x . Any body have any thoughts on this. Cheers the pope. Ps Boner does the mag cleaner clean really grotty engines or does it just polish up clean ones ?
< Message edited by the pope -- 4/29/2008 5:31:27 AM >
Posts: 311
Joined: 3/15/2002 From: GraftonNSW, AUSTRALIA Status: offline
G'day Pope - you are misquoting me - I did not recommend Marine 66 instead of Corrosion X but I did say the following:
quote:
ORIGINAL: Bone
G'day Pope. No luck here in NSW in the hunt for the Dawns Power Dissolver either.
Corrosion X is available in NZ http://www.corrosionx.co.nz/home.htm but despite the website saying there are distributors in Oz, I've yet to find one. However, SuperCheap Auto stock a product called "Marine 66" (about $12 AUD a can) & whilst the data sheets for both products are not identical, they are VERY similar. Next time you are up Noarlunga way, you might want to check it out
I haven't used either product yet so I certainly can't provide any recommendation. Anyway, with that out of the way, I can now answer your questions:
Cleaning really grotty engines - I use "Coles Reliance Non Caustic Oven Cleaner" from Coles Supermarkets (Woolies does not stock it). You will find it in the general cleaning isle of Coles. A predominately blue spray can with a blue cap - can capacity is 300 grams. The active ingredient, and this is VERY important, is ETHANOLAMINE. Why? 'Coz it's user friendly towards aluminium & will not eat it or turn it grey or strip the flesh from fingers - unlike that nasty Sodium Hydroxide found in other oven cleaners (Woolworths Home Brand Oven Cleaner for example).
Each time I visit Coles I buy 2 cans of the Reliance brand oven cleaner. I've now have about a pallet load under my work bench [)]. I worry that one day it will disappear off the shelves & don't want to be caught short. About 10 years ago you could buy "Speedie Aluminium Cleaner" - it was truly excellent stuff - but it literally disappeared from the supermarkets overnight & I've never seen it since. One bitten, twice shy.
Liberally spray the engine or parts in the Reliance Cleaner - it will foam up wonderfully. Leave for 5 / 10 minutes & rub briskly with an old toothbrush. The muck will fall off the engine / parts. Wash under warm running water again brushing briskly. Allow to dry naturally or if you are impatient, the heat gun hastens the drying process.
Polishing commences ONLY after the cleaning. That way, the polish can work more effectively on a clean surface. The Mother's brand Mag Wheel & Aluminum Cleaner really does an excellent job. I recommend that you check it out
jetpack, that Webra that you painted black is beautiful. One question, though. The parts that are not black appear on my computer to be gold colored. Are they really, as the glo plug appears to be gold also? If they are gold, did they come that way or did you do that somehow also?
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"In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice; In practice, there is"
Posts: 1439
Joined: 10/2/2002 From: Portage,
IN, USA Status: offline
Hi Jolly, thanks.
The bright gold parts that you'll see on the carb are brass. The glow plug comes plated gold color, it is a Dynamite HD plug.
All the parts were treated to a good first cleaning, then they all went to the bench to be de-burred, sanded or hard stoned where necessary especially all of the machined edges. These corners are usually never treated to any kind of attention at the factory and pick up dings and dents very easily.
Putting a nice smooth radius on all the corners and making sure mating surfaces are smooth and flat mean a lot when doing a restoration I think.
Parts on the bench get handled quite a bit, and taking care of the edges right away keeps damage among the parts that your trying to polish up a lot safer. Makes them easy on the hands too when rubbing and polishing.
Edges of parts that should stay sharp that will be polished, I'll just simply mask with good quality 3M plastic masking tape (thin 1/8th inch) till all the work is done. It sticks and holds up good under wet sanding and while your working on the part.
Here's some of the tools I go through. KISS brand cushioned finger nail files. Waterproof and hold up great...all kinds of grit sizes. Wallgreens or any cosmetic counter should have them. Excellent with building with balsa besides wet sanding engine parts.
Polishing sticks. Actually are synthetic stones, bonded abrasives. Can be found in Garnet or Silicon Carbide grits, all grit sizes just like sandpapers up to 600 I think. 120 grit is pretty course. 220 is good all around, 320 can hide under a medium coat of paint, 400 on up is good if your headed for wet sanding and polish.
Use these where you need good control over what your doing, or giving a gradual consistent bevel on anything metal using its flatness. When brand new and flat they can be used to check flatness of parts, and rub down slight problems if it isn't.
How these are normally used is with a shaped end to make a tip to work with. A chisel point is what I usually start with, and the surface that your rubbing down with it will shape it as you go as it wears. Use oil. Mineral oil or ATF fluid works good (detergent oil) keeps the tips from getting clogged and making bad scratches bigger than the grit size your using. Tap Magic seems to works the best if you have it around.
Keep a flat piece of 80 grit or so silicon sandpaper next to you as you work to get the tip started, and rub on that to form the shape you think would work the best where your trying to polish. Use it to get the clogging out too if you notice it happening. Dont work with a clogged tip - use more oil, or lighter strokes...back off so it doesn't clog that is when it is using your energy the best, and let it wear and sharpen on its own while your working.
The twin-needle Space Hopper was all rubbed down with stones to remove all tool marks and start a proper consistent radius on all the corners before polishing.
Don't forget there's other finishes that can be had. The red .05 TD was all sanded smooth to remove all the tool marks, then was brought back to a coarser finish using a dry scotch bright pad to put 'mock' tool marks back on it. Parts still look machined, but all the sharp edges and different surface finishes are taken care of.
Steel wool has always been the old standard, and on aluminum can be used very well. The only problem I find with it, is it is a bit messy and can mis-shape parts too easily, or lay deep scores where it will pull through a corner. With practice though, it is one of the cheapest and fastest finishes.
The brass reed was cleaned and polished on a smooth, clean, flat sheet of copy paper treated with an even smear of metal polish such as Mother's, as Bone is having luck with. Mother's has one finer grade of polish that is outstanding and nothing compares and it is called "BILLET" polsih. If you use an all natural cloth, it will leave the hardest reflection you'll see on aluminum with VERY little work, and can usually stop at 320 or 400 grit and still be a respectable job. Mirror polishing it takes going to 600 for this to take care of. Of course you always try to go to the highest grade of wet sanding you have before polish creams.
< Message edited by jetpack -- 5/1/2008 2:24:04 AM >
Posts: 7453
Joined: 6/11/2003 From: Northridge,
CA, USA Status: offline
jetpack: You certainly have got your technique down pat and your work is stunning! I am learning lots from you. I have done some resto's as well and I have only been using needle files and clotch backed abrasive rolls to clean up the casting and tooling marks. I am going to get some of the tools you mentioned here and hope my work comes out better.
Posts: 1439
Joined: 10/2/2002 From: Portage,
IN, USA Status: offline
Glad you liked those, Jolly. The Cox engines that I had a box full of when I was a kid got me interested in polishing.
It actually started out as just cleaning them things to keep them running, and besides always building r/c from kits I work as a machinist mold maker where having to polish cavities occasionally and always working with removing burrs is a daily thing as parts are made.
Most my polishing efforts for myself are geared to my boat works with their engines and hardware. Boats stay in pretty good shape so if you dress one out proper from the start they stay that way and make a nice little hot rod to have around.
The 1/8 x 1/4 x 6" size is what I most commonly use and is a good size for what is needed. They can be brittle, so starting with a full 6" new one usually will snap in half on you if your using it too hard. Its a good learning experience to remember how much pressure that was when it broke. It is no biggie though, because they can still be used down to a nub, you just loose the advantage of having a long 6" flat stone to go across a part with.
Your green and black 4-stroker I have seen before in another thread, and gave me the idea to paint my Webra a two-tone scheme with the black color head and the iron color cases. I've painted a couple other motors also using what is on the Webra (Duplicolor High-Heat ceramic) So far haven't ran any of them yet so no reports on how its going to hold up, but the silver worked outstanding so far. Nice and shiny and does not pick up fingerprints or oil at all...and hard skinned. I found out it makes an excellent cheat on making an engine look bright without polishing.
How's our Bone comming along with his polishing?
Those last two pics is the first engine I bought used and took apart and cleaned. The case was as bright as new, and then I decided to boil it in water to try and get all the contaminates out of it..such as whatever was left behind with the creams or the hot anti-freeze soaking it first got.
Check out the color on it. It is an iron / bronze color now. When I boiled it, I dont know if it was the aluminum used, or the minerals in the water, or the chemicals left behind in the aluminum. I found out later by doing the same process with a K&B case, and then on to an OPS case, did not have the same result.
I later on bought more used Webras to restore, and with each case I simply boiled in water turned this golden brown color that I have really got to like.
< Message edited by jetpack -- 5/1/2008 3:56:54 AM >
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RE: How do YOU polish up your engines? - 
