Video at Youtube - Patriot at 168 mph from méxico!! plane belong to our friend Hector...  
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Video at Youtube - Patriot at 168 mph from méxico!! pl... - 3/4/2008 5:20:51 PM   
stg61abc


 

Posts: 168
Joined: 4/19/2005
From: Catuaba do Sul SP, BRAZIL
Status: offline 		Found this incredible video in youtube from our friend Hector from Monterrey/méxico
GP Patriot powered by Rossi 53, tuned pipe, retracts and APC 10X8 prop
various!!!! 168 mph (271 km/h) passages verified by radar!!!
incredible
congratulations Hector!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KRIbC7_8U_0

< Message edited by stg61abc -- 3/4/2008 5:29:17 PM >
       Post #: 1

RE: Video at Youtube - Patriot at 168 mph from méxico!... - 3/4/2008 5:29:12 PM   
YUKONFLYR



Posts: 255
Joined: 4/18/2007
From: WHITEHORSE, YT, CANADA
Status: offline 		Gotta love those Rossi's

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My Speed Demon made me do it!!! <Possessed since 1968>
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RE: Video at Youtube - Patriot at 168 mph from méxico!... - 3/4/2008 5:55:58 PM   
wjvail



Posts: 375
Joined: 9/5/2002
From: Meridian, MS, USA
Status: offline 		They must have the MOTHER of all Rossi's. To do 167mph with a 8" pitch prop takes about 22,000 rpm! I have a Rossi 53 and it will NOT turn an APC 10x8 at 22K. Not even close.

I have doubts. It may be possible, but I have doubts.

Bill

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RE: Video at Youtube - Patriot at 168 mph from méxico!... - 3/4/2008 6:34:44 PM   
stg61abc


 

Posts: 168
Joined: 4/19/2005
From: Catuaba do Sul SP, BRAZIL
Status: offline 		Hi Bill, just see the radar readings, and the ballistics passages !!!!
enjoy ...

(in reply to wjvail)
       Post #: 4

RE: Video at Youtube - Patriot at 168 mph from méxico... - 3/4/2008 8:59:31 PM   
Fxrs_tim


 

Posts: 301
Joined: 4/4/2005
From: Austin, TX, USA
Status: offline 		Congratulations Hector!! Plus, he's at approximately 3000' MSL, so he's REALLY got that thing going.

Tim

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RE: Video at Youtube - Patriot at 168 mph from méxico... - 3/4/2008 10:55:39 PM   
gsoav8r


 

Posts: 208
Joined: 1/17/2002
From: Huntersville, NC, USA
Status: offline 		Heres all you need to know (lol)
Hectors Patriot rules.
Cheers.

http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_6693939/tm.htm

< Message edited by gsoav8r -- 3/4/2008 10:56:55 PM >

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RE: Video at Youtube - Patriot at 168 mph from méxico... - 3/4/2008 11:09:21 PM   
mumblety-peg


 

Posts: 310
Joined: 3/14/2002
From: Alameda, CA, USA
Status: offline 		All right then... that's it. I'm dusting off my Patriot and I'm going to finish building it. I was going to re-enter flying with an ARF. But what the heck, just about all that's left to do glass and paint. The wings already primed.

< Message edited by mumblety-peg -- 3/5/2008 12:44:20 AM >

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RE: Video at Youtube - Patriot at 168 mph from méxico... - 3/4/2008 11:31:49 PM   
wjvail



Posts: 375
Joined: 9/5/2002
From: Meridian, MS, USA
Status: offline
quote:

Heres all you need to know (lol)
Cheers.

http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_6693939/tm.htm


I have a Q-500 with a Nelson and a $1,500.00 radar gun. With 15% nitro, 7.5 x 8.25" pitch pylon APC prop, pizza-cutter wheels, hidden controls, gap-less hinges, and pointed straight down for 3,000 feet, it will do about 185. Tops. Really that's what it will do. Tops

In the above post he mentions about 15,500 RPM.... 16,000 revolutions/min x 8 in/revolution is 128,000 inches per minute. That is about 121 miles per hour. I have spent MANY days with my radar gun and pointed it at hundreds of planes and that's about all you're going to get with this RPM and pitch.

I once went to a fly inn with my son. We met a fella there that had a honking Ultra-Sports 40 with retracts and a piped 60 that said it would do 200mph. It was crazy fast but I said I was skeptical. He pointed to a kid (my son) with a radar gun and said he saw with his own eyes 212mph. I explained to him that it was most likely a hit off the prop and that his plane would not do 200. (I've gotten hits off planes not moving at over 100.) He spent the next 15 min going past my radar gun consistently clocking about 145. I only point this out as an example that had I not been there, this individual would be posting here his Ultra-Sport does 200mph.

As a rule, you will NOT go faster than the prop. If he really was using an 8" pitch prop and doing 185mph, it was at about 22,000rpm. (By the way, 19,000 is the max recommended RPM for an APC 10"dia.)

I'm not saying it didn't happen... I just am a doubting Thomas. I would need more information to be convinced.

Bill

< Message edited by wjvail -- 3/5/2008 2:55:29 PM >

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RE: Video at Youtube - Patriot at 168 mph from méxico... - 3/5/2008 12:29:21 AM   
SPEED JUNKIE



Posts: 447
Joined: 5/2/2005
From: WHITTIER, CA, USA
Status: offline 		People are fickle.
LET IT BE, LET IT BE, LET IT BE, LET IT BE (BEATLE'S)
Looked like somewhere between a 156.875 and 187.875 to me but hey.
Bring that Mexican Patriot up here to the "Revver's Get Together" and let Razor fly it!
I bet he get's 200 mph easy!

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I'm wealthy, the shop is full of jets and heli's, the wife is happy, life is good! More please!

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RE: Video at Youtube - Patriot at 168 mph from méxico... - 3/5/2008 12:54:45 AM   
gsoav8r


 

Posts: 208
Joined: 1/17/2002
From: Huntersville, NC, USA
Status: offline 		My bad. I forgot the "rest of the story" by Mike Conner.
Cheers.

http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_6861620/tm.htm

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RE: Video at Youtube - Patriot at 168 mph from méxico... - 3/5/2008 4:00:36 AM   
z06kal


 

Posts: 144
Joined: 6/25/2004
From: Woodland Hills, CA, USA
Status: online 		I have clocked many airplanes on radar myself. Not sure how many but prolly over 3 digits. I have spent hours watching/clocking plane after plane cruise between 150-300mph (dynamic soarings). I have also clocked many a jet at jet rally's, fast guys at the field, and Q-500 and Q40 contests. From my impression that patriot was doing some pretty big monster dives and then leveling off. Also keep in mind he is at 3000 feet as well. 168 did not seem unreasonable at all based on what I saw in the video. If I had to do a visual analysis with no speed given I would say over 150 for sure. It is not usual to clock dive passes way in excess of prop pitch speed. For example I had a plane that did a very consistant 152-155 level but out of a big dive I saw over 170. There are no brakes that come on when a plane exceeds prop pitch speed just some extra drag. I'm surprised the Bushnell gun picked him up at all as those guns are generally horrible at clocking small objects at high speed. You would be surprised how much speed you can build in a dive with a decently slipery model and some weight.

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RE: Video at Youtube - Patriot at 168 mph from méxico... - 3/5/2008 2:31:57 PM   
wjvail



Posts: 375
Joined: 9/5/2002
From: Meridian, MS, USA
Status: offline
quote:

It is not usual to clock dive passes way in excess of prop pitch speed. For example I had a plane that did a very consistant 152-155 level but out of a big dive I saw over 170.


z06kal.. We are looking at the same numbers but stating the conclusions differently. Earlier I said " As a rule, you will NOT go faster than the prop." What I meant by this is that folks should begin with the calculated speed before posting they are doing _____ mph. It will save folks from posting they are doing 200 with a 10x6.

While you would say "It is not usual to clock dive passes way in excess of prop pitch speed", I would say "you will rarely see dive passes more than 10% of the prop pitch speed". Notice 10% above 155 is 170 so we are numerically saying the same thing but putting it differently.

Soo... a 10x8 at 15,500 rpm static unloads to, say, 18,000k (that is being very generous) and on the pipe, plus 10% for the dive is 149 MPH. 149 MPH corrected for 3,000 feet is 158 MPH ( http://www.csgnetwork.com/tasinfocalc.html ). Add a 10 knot tail wind and you get 169mph... I guess it's possible.

quote:

There are no brakes that come on when a plane exceeds prop pitch speed just some extra drag.

Agreed... but... the prop is increasingly acting as a source of drag (not thrust) as it exceeds it's theoretical top speed. At its theoretical pitch speed, the airplane only "sees" the airframe drag and varying degrees of prop drag (not thrust). That is why it is so difficult to exceed the prop speed... At that speed, there is only drag and gravity.

quote:

I'm surprised the Bushnell gun picked him up at all as those guns are generally horrible at clocking small objects at high speed.

I use this gun and highly recommend it.
http://www.stalkerradar.com/sport_images/sportinhardcase-big.jpg

I think we are generally in agreement and please understand, I gain nothing by proving or disproving Hectors claim. I got into this discusion only to suggest that a fairly draggy plane like the Patriot with a fairly low rpm engine like the Rossi, turning a sport APC 10x8 is going to be very hard pressed to go particullary fast.

I should have added much sooner that it is a VERY good looking plane. I got so involved in speed discussions that I forgot to mention it's a very nice model.

Bill

< Message edited by wjvail -- 3/5/2008 2:38:09 PM >

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RE: Video at Youtube - Patriot at 168 mph from méxico... - 3/5/2008 3:38:46 PM   
Mike Connor



Posts: 1381
Joined: 1/10/2002
From: Tulsa, OK, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: wjvail


Soo... a 10x8 at 15,500 rpm static unloads to, say, 18,000k (that is being very generous) and on the pipe, plus 10% for the dive is 149 MPH. 149 MPH corrected for 3,000 feet is 158 MPH ( http://www.csgnetwork.com/tasinfocalc.html ). Add a 10 knot tail wind and you get 169mph... I guess it's possible.
Bill


The two threads listed above by gsoav8r had many pages of discussions on if and how this Patriot made it to 170 mph.
The radar speed was confirmed with Doppler and they were very close. Doppler also showed the unload rpm of 17,647. Calculating pitch speed considering prop camber and a terminal velocity speed that allows no prop slippage, most agreed 170 was possible.

< Message edited by Mike Connor -- 3/5/2008 3:41:47 PM >

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RE: Video at Youtube - Patriot at 168 mph from méxico... - 3/5/2008 4:26:59 PM   
Mark 5


 

Posts: 72
Joined: 12/8/2004
From: lincoln park, NJ, USA
Status: offline 		The Doppler does not lie,if it shows Hectors Patriot doing 170mph and the radar gun confirms it,then I believe it.Here is my Patriot which hit 151mph.

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< Message edited by Mark 5 -- 3/5/2008 4:30:34 PM >

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RE: Video at Youtube - Patriot at 168 mph from méxico... - 3/5/2008 9:13:18 PM   
SpeedBoy



Posts: 177
Joined: 11/8/2007
From: Monterrey, MEXICO
Status: online 		stg61abc thanks for see the video and for take part of your time in this tread

Hey SPEED JUNKIE if you know the secret of your friend to reach that easy 200 mph