Help needed in picking servos for V1 edge  
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All Forums >> RC Airplanes >> Giant Scale Aircraft - 3D & Aerobatic >> WildHare R/C Support >> Help needed in picking servos for V1 edge
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Help needed in picking servos for V1 edge - 3/17/2008 6:08:54 PM   
ROBCAR


 

Posts: 123
Joined: 5/14/2006
From: Cortland, NY, USA
Status: offline 		I aquired a 1st version 28% 84" edge airframe the other day and was wondering what would be a good servo to put in the bird? The plane will just be a regular flyer and no 3d at all ( I dont know how to 3d). Would 100-120 oz servos be enough on all the surfaces? Loops and rolls and maybe some lazy snaps here and there. Its going to be powered by an older 3w 60 if that makes a difference.
       Post #: 1

RE: Help needed in picking servos for V1 edge - 3/17/2008 6:53:23 PM   
Tired Old Man


 

Posts: 11367
Joined: 2/25/2002
From: Central, CA, USA
Status: offline 		As always, the better the servo the better the performance. Everything that works in the v-2 Edge works for the v-1. Metal gears with 100 ounce inches of torque at the elevators for "relaxed" flying would be fine, but the first time you start to fly 3d the rudder could be a problem. Go with a mimimum of a 120 ounce inch servo there. The ailerons on version 1 are not as wide so an 80 ounce inch servo would work until you used 3D rates, then a 100 ounce inch servo would be needed.

Better to use 100 ounce inch servos at minimum everywhere except the rudder, where more is needed. The problem is not with the "relaxed" type flying. You don't need as much servo. But once you start flying the Edge and see how well it performs at all speeds you will just have to start pushing the envelope and more servo will immediately be required. The difference in cost between a better servo and a minimum servo isn't that great. Perhaps $50.00 to $75.00 for the entire plane. Don't you want the plane to fly as good as it could? I haven't met anyone yet that could maintain a "normal" type of flying with either version of this Edge. The compulsion to do more is absolutely irresistable.

_____________________________

If you can''''t fix it with a hammer, you have an electrical problem.

(in reply to ROBCAR)
       Post #: 2

RE: Help needed in picking servos for V1 edge - 3/17/2008 10:51:19 PM   
nedyob


 

Posts: 1189
Joined: 2/5/2002
From: NORTHWOOD, IA, USA
Status: offline 		Pat Roy is right, don't play down your servo requirements because if you do you might get board with the performance and think of it as just another aerbatic plane. The V-1 Edge was designed as a aerobatic performance plane and a extream flying plane to suite the pilots needs.
I don't know what brand of servo you are useing, but I put a Hitec 9555 on rudder, and Hitec 5945's on Elevator & Ailorons. And I have the intetions to fly IMAC and maybe get a little crazy on 3D with my V-1 Edge.
Oh, Pat ! What type of battery sould I use with my set up. Im looking at going with Nimh 6 volt batteries on both the RX and ignition. Would the A123's work for me? or do I need to look else where. Im going to call Tom after he gets back from Toledo and see what he thinks.
NEDYOB

(in reply to Tired Old Man)
       Post #: 3

RE: Help needed in picking servos for V1 edge - 3/17/2008 11:28:14 PM   
Tired Old Man


 

Posts: 11367
Joined: 2/25/2002
From: Central, CA, USA
Status: offline 		If you don't have batteries now I would truly consider the A123's. I fly with Altavillan and he's using them in and on everything. His 35% planes are taking 100 to 150 millamps after a hard 3D flight and that just impresses the heck out of me. For those that are going to fly a 2.4 system the A123 is a far better battery choice since it maintains a higher voltage for much longer than anything else out there. Those 2.4 systems will dump the plane in a heartbeat if the battery voltage drops below a certain threshold. That's a terribe reason to lose a plane. If you're flying 72 mhz there's no real benefit (imo) to using A123 batteries. Altavillan and I had just this discussion yesterday.

If you want to go with nimh then an 800 mAh ignition battery on most single cylinder engines will be great for about 2.5 to 3 continuous hours of flying. You could go with a nicad instead for the ignition and be able to fast field charge it if needed. Same capacity, same amount of running time. I switched from Li-ons to nicads at my ignitions for that reason. Cheaper too. I would not use less than a 2,400 mAh receiver battery. As always, monitor you battery's condition and level to know where you stand.

_____________________________

If you can''''t fix it with a hammer, you have an electrical problem.

(in reply to nedyob)
       Post #: 4

RE: Help needed in picking servos for V1 edge - 3/17/2008 11:31:54 PM   
ROBCAR


 

Posts: 123
Joined: 5/14/2006
From: Cortland, NY, USA
Status: offline 		Thanks for the info guys. I think I am going to use hitec 645mg all around. They are about 133 in oz at 6 volts.

(in reply to Tired Old Man)
       Post #: 5

RE: Help needed in picking servos for V1 edge - 3/18/2008 1:37:38 AM   
rlmcnii


 

Posts: 419
Joined: 7/3/2005
From: Pocomoke City, MD, USA
Status: offline 		I have a lightly-flown V1 Edge with 5645's on the ailerons and elevators. I do not notice this personally ( nothing to compare), but many people write of poor centering with the 5625's/5645's. According to Hitec's specs these servos have an eight micro-second deadband.

Has anyone on here ever reprogrammed, that is reduced, the deadband?? If so, was an improvement in centering noticed?? Is lack-of-centering truly an issue, or just an issue here in cyberspace?

I am planning a V2 of the 50cc Extra and the 5645's look pretty good, except for the deadband, on paper. Just wondering what others have done about the centering.

Thanks

(in reply to ROBCAR)
       Post #: 6

RE: Help needed in picking servos for V1 edge - 3/18/2008 4:12:00 AM   
Tired Old Man


 

Posts: 11367
Joined: 2/25/2002
From: Central, CA, USA
Status: offline 		If you've ever had a servo that did not center consistently you would find that it's a very big issue indeed. It's impossible to trim a plane with servos that do not center well. A very tight dead band is what makes good centering happen. A perfect example was the older Hitec 225mg. You could set a surface up any way you wanted and rarely see the same place twice with the servos at neutral. It can be pretty ugly.

_____________________________

If you can''''t fix it with a hammer, you have an electrical problem.

(in reply to rlmcnii)
       Post #: 7

RE: Help needed in picking servos for V1 edge - 3/18/2008 4:18:30 AM   
nedyob


 

Posts: 1189
Joined: 2/5/2002
From: NORTHWOOD, IA, USA
Status: offline 		Thanks Pat Roy, Yess I am going to fly it on a 2.4Ghz TX & RX systom. I will call Tom and see what he has in the Nicad so I can fast chage at thefield if I have to. So you say 2400's for the RX and 800 on the igition systom right??
Will give Tom a call. Thanks for the help. Cant wait for spring to get my V-1 Edge in the air.
NEDYOB

(in reply to rlmcnii)
       Post #: 8

RE: Help needed in picking servos for V1 edge - 3/18/2008 6:25:25 AM   
Tired Old Man


 

Posts: 11367
Joined: 2/25/2002
From: Central, CA, USA
Status: offline 		If you're going to do the 2.4 get A123's for everything. That way you only carry one charger. The money you would save on a nicad for the ignition would be seriously offset by having to buy two chargers. Or you might have to charge the receiver and ignition batteries separately on one charger. The A123's field charge quite rapidly if not run down too deep.

Tom's the man to talk to since he has all the info he developed using the A123 battery. One thing he does that I have a lot of respect for. He's always looking for ways to provide the customers with the best possible product and superior performance at the lowest possible price and he's done the same again with the A123 work. Plus once he decides he wants or needs to know about something he digs deep and when the dust settles he's an expert on the subject.

_____________________________

If you can''''t fix it with a hammer, you have an electrical problem.

(in reply to nedyob)
       Post #: 9

RE: Help needed in picking servos for V1 edge - 3/18/2008 10:30:42 PM   
rlmcnii


 

Posts: 419
Joined: 7/3/2005
From: Pocomoke City, MD, USA
Status: offline
quote:

I have a lightly-flown V1 Edge with 5645's on the ailerons and elevators. I do not notice this personally ( nothing to compare), but many people write of poor centering with the 5625's/5645's. According to Hitec's specs these servos have an eight micro-second deadband.

Has anyone on here ever reprogrammed, that is reduced, the deadband?? If so, was an improvement in centering noticed?? Is lack-of-centering truly an issue, or just an issue here in cyberspace?

I am planning a V2 of the 50cc Extra and the 5645's look pretty good, except for the deadband, on paper. Just wondering what others have done about the centering.



quote:

ORIGINAL: Pat Roy

If you've ever had a servo that did not center consistently you would find that it's a very big issue indeed. It's impossible to trim a plane with servos that do not center well. A very tight dead band is what makes good centering happen. A perfect example was the older Hitec 225mg. You could set a surface up any way you wanted and rarely see the same place twice with the servos at neutral. It can be pretty ugly.


Pardon me, my original post was written with insufficient clarity. I am aware of the necessity to use servos that center properly and repeatably.

My original post was asking specifically about the centering of the 5625/5645 servos and whether or not their reputation for poor centering was deserved. And, if the reputation was deserved, what experiences have people had with reprogramming those servos to reduce the deadband.

I ask because my V1 Edge seems to hold trim very well. Perhaps I just got a few good servos and would not want to press my luck by using them in another airplane and finding that they would, indeed, not center well enough to reliably maintain the airplane in trim.

Thanks

(in reply to Tired Old Man)
       Post #: 10

RE: Help needed in picking servos for V1 edge - 3/18/2008 11:22:10 PM   
Tired Old Man


 

Posts: 11367
Joined: 2/25/2002
From: Central, CA, USA
Status: offline 		The reputation was deserved. Some have been quite good while others not so good. The quality of the servo has much to do with how tight the deadband can be set. You may have a zero reading at the programmer but the servo will not hold that tolerance as well as it could. That's one of the reasons the better servos cost more. The accuracy goes way up.

_____________________________

If you can''''t fix it with a hammer, you have an electrical problem.

(in reply to rlmcnii)
       Post #: 11

RE: Help needed in picking servos for V1 edge - 3/18/2008 11:27:48 PM   
ROBCAR


 

Posts: 123
Joined: 5/14/2006
From: Cortland, NY, USA
Status: offline 		We sure got off subject of the original topic didn't we?

(in reply to Tired Old Man)
       Post #: 12

RE: Help needed in picking servos for V1 edge - 3/19/2008 12:22:05 AM   
rlmcnii


 

Posts: 419
Joined: 7/3/2005
From: Pocomoke City, MD, USA
Status: offline 		PR,

Thanks for the reply. I did not know that a servo would not necessarily hold the deadband with which it had been programmed. That answers my question about the 5625/5645 servos.

ROBCAR,

Not too far off the subject. At least now you know you may, or may not, want to use these servos.

(in reply to ROBCAR)
       Post #: 13

RE: Help needed in picking servos for V1 edge - 3/19/2008 1:42:05 AM   
Tired Old Man


 

Posts: 11367
Joined: 2/25/2002
From: Central, CA, USA
Status: offline 		Any time.

Funny thing about an original topic. They generally have the ability to branch out exponentially with various sub systems and components. The larger the component count or selection the farther a topic can move in any direction and still technically be on topic. This reply took everything in a new direction but I think still qualifies as part of the original topic...

_____________________________

If you can''''t fix it with a hammer, you have an electrical problem.

(in reply to rlmcnii)
       Post #: 14