Shoot down airplane or not for noise???

Shoot down airplane or not for noise??? (Full Version)

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[Poll]

Shoot the ^%$# down, he is a menace and deserves it!

40% (29)

Even if you can safely shoot him down, that is wrong.

59% (42)

Total Votes : 71

(last vote on : 8/28/2008 1:06:37 AM)
(Poll will run till: -- )

Message

PilotSmith -> Shoot down airplane or not for noise??? (4/16/2008 6:12:06 AM)
I have a dilemma. A friend has asked to borrow my radio to shoot down an airplane. Here is some background of why. There is a guy that flies a combat type wing airplane in a field that runs adjacent to residential homes. He has a small prop with a high speed brushless so the wing is obnoxiously loud. The dude has a habit of flying over the homes and diving down over their back yards and then pulling up over their yards. Many people that live along the park are pi$$ed at the noise and they are calling the police and the city to try to get them to ban flying in that park. I spoke to the guy a couple months ago and politely suggested that he should consider doing something to cut the noise so the neighbors don''t get all of us banned from using the park. He said he knew the law and what hours he can fly, etc. He pushes the hours to the limit and that plus the noise and the flying over the homes is getting people pretty upset. A couple neighbors went and spoke to him and he told them to f^(# off. So here is where I get involved. One of these upset neighbors has asked that I loan him my radio so that when he is flying over his house he can turn on the radio and bring the airplane down. I don''t think that is right but the guy is a total a$$ and if he keeps flying the way he does I would guess soon nobody will be able to fly at that park. He has not listened to courteous warnings. He has cussed out neighbors that have asked him to curtail the noise. So in a way I think the guy deserves to lose the airplane. What would you do any why? Talking to the guy will not work as that has been tried and it got ugly pretty quick. I don't think anyone wants to get in a fist fight over this with him. I added a poll. Please vote!

tIANci -> RE: Shoot down airplane or not for noise??? (4/16/2008 9:22:03 AM)
Pilot - yeah since he is so darn pig headed about it and since so many hate him then shoot his plane down. I mean its easy, just ensure the frequency is correct and voila ... immediate problem solved! He deserves it too!!! Now then it might get even more fun ... the shooter can be sued for criminal damage by the pigheaded man since the shooter maliciously did it, sued by the neighbour for damage to property because the plane crashed through the upper floor bedroom window, sued by the neighbour for negligence because the plane crashed into their kid''s face ... the list can realistically go on. So why not? :) Shoot them down! Seriously, this is so simple, there are laws for noise pollution ok. Its not about what time he starts or ends. Its about how loud it gets. Then you also have civil rights, this man is causing a nuisance, so tell him if he is keen to face a lawsuit, getting an injunction against him, then please by all means continue to do so. How nasty can he get facing a mob? Why no mob? Because all those affected wanna just b*tch and not really do something about it. Let's get real here ... he is not only a nuisance, if what you describe is accurate then he is a danger to those around him. Oh yes ... if you knew what the radio was being used for, you can also be sued. :)

PilotSmith -> RE: Shoot down airplane or not for noise??? (4/16/2008 9:36:57 AM)
yeah, it is a touchy one. If - I say IF - I loaned my radio I would loan it with an airplane and tell him that I am loaning it to him to fly my airplane. [;)] He is out there several days a week including early Saturday morning when people want to sleep in. One neighbor really got in his face with another but the guy is very rude and defiant. Nobody is going to waste the time and money to file a lawsuit. The cops have been out a couple times but as long as he is not flying outside of certain hours where they restrict noise they do nothing. I''m sure when the cops come around that he just throttles back and it is nice and quiet. Part of me says to loan the radio to let him shoot the **** down and another part also says it is not the right thing to do. Neighbor was so pissed a few days ago that he got out his air rifle and was going to try to shoot it out of the air with that! [X(] I convinced him that was not a good idea. With several people complaining it will probably be a matter of time before we see a sign go up saying RC models not allowed in the park. Too bad idiots like that keep shrinking the available places where people can fly.

tIANci -> RE: Shoot down airplane or not for noise??? (4/16/2008 9:52:39 AM)
Dude - I got a real jerk from some forum who I would love to shoot down, he truly deserves it but then its like honour. We are in it for the hobby, let''s not start using our stuff to shoot things down. Once it starts there is no stopping it. Got to have some honour. What you can do is to go see your local council and go in one big group. That usually works. You stopped the air rifle, its no more dangerous than using your radio ... so the same should apply for you loaning your radio to a friend to fly his new plane ... :)

-pkh- -> RE: Shoot down airplane or not for noise??? (4/16/2008 6:06:10 PM)
First, I would never loan my equipment out to someone to "shoot down" another pilot. Second, what band is this a$$ flying on? 72MHz? 2.4GHz? 27MHz? If he's flying 72MHz or 27MHz, you'd need a transmitter with all the channels in that band to try to shoot him down (a frequency synthesizer module or a bunch of crystals/modules). If he's flying on the 2.4GHz band, you can't shoot him down. I'd suggest this: Tell your friend that you really don't want to loan out equipment for such a purpose, and even if you did, the liklihood that your transmitter was on the same channel as the a$$ in question is slim to none, so it wouldn't do any good anyway.

vicman -> RE: Shoot down airplane or not for noise??? (4/16/2008 6:18:08 PM)
First, the poll isn''t working properly. Second, you are a lawyer yourself and have most likely taken an ethics class or two. Third, posting your evil plan in here most likely wasn''t too good of a plan just incase one of the other neighbors gets the same idea and a Tx from another source. Fingers will probably be pointed in your direction. An accidental mid-air would be more appropriate. There is a good chance the neighbor would replace your killer bird too.[8\|]

Mr. Mugen -> RE: Shoot down airplane or not for noise??? (4/16/2008 6:26:16 PM)
Wow...good luck man! Touchy situation for sure. Where I am from the cops might understand if he was shot down in a fair battle....

tommythecat -> RE: Shoot down airplane or not for noise??? (4/16/2008 6:31:22 PM)
If he is flying over people''s homes, the park rules and noise ordinances aren''t the issue. It is a safety issue. If he truly flies low over houses and backyards then all a person has to do is call the police and file a complaint. I would guess that a fine for reckless endangerment would quickly curb his behavior.

PilotSmith -> RE: Shoot down airplane or not for noise??? (4/16/2008 7:18:53 PM)
Hey Vicman! Yeah, I think I have been lawyering this over my head a bit and that is why I have not loaned my gear and stopped him from using his air gun. Simple things like this can turn into expensive lawsuits. He is flying 72mhz and I have a scanner and synthesizer radio. Would take less than 30 seconds to acquire and terminate the target. But even while the guy is a total @$$ it still didn''t seem right to do. I''m hoping you guys come up with some good ideas keeping in mind the following: 1) The police have been called out a couple times already and will not take any action unless he is flying during designated "quiet hours." 2) He has been asked politely asked by a modeler to tone it down so we don''t all get banned and he blew off that request. 3) When confronted with a small group of neighbors, he told them all to F off and it got pretty intense. Nobody is going to want to start a fight. So I am hoping the collective wisdom over here can give some less drastic suggestions. If he would just quit dive bombing the yards that would cut down 80% of the tension. He is a newb as has been in the hobby less than a year. I actually gave him advice on setting up his gear, etc. hoping that when I spoke to him about his flying habits he would be amenable to listening to me. Was no use.

PilotSmith -> RE: Shoot down airplane or not for noise??? (4/16/2008 7:37:06 PM)
As a funny side note, the guy that wants to use the air rifle is retired law enforcement. And by the way, 2 different neighbors which are not modelers have asked about "jamming" the frequency. People are reaching their patience limit...

Free Bird -> RE: Shoot down airplane or not for noise??? (4/16/2008 7:58:08 PM)
Get the city or who ever runs the park to require AMA to use the site. If the butt head doesn''t have AMA, problem solved as he can be run off by the cops for not being complaint. If he has AMA and is flying over homes, that is a big no-no according to AMA safety rules. He could then be banned from using the park for violation of established safety rules.

rogerswin -> RE: Shoot down airplane or not for noise??? (4/16/2008 8:22:47 PM)
Instead of a total "shoot down", how about a bump or two with your transmitter to where he knows there is interference and he quits flying? Just don''t let him see where it''s coming from!

tommythecat -> RE: Shoot down airplane or not for noise??? (4/16/2008 8:42:11 PM)
Well. If going to the fuzz with a wreckless endangerment (rather than a noise disturbance) complaint doesn''t get you anywhere, maybe you should just go tell him what is being discussed and explain that if he can''t learn to be respectful then he can expect to be shot down. Explain that you know what frequency he is on, and that you have a frequency scanner and a synth TX, that should get his attention in a hurry. I still think (but I''m not sure) that if he is flying over homes and yards you can get the police to stop him, but you need to be persistent in explaining that your concern is over safety not noise.

mongo -> RE: Shoot down airplane or not for noise??? (4/16/2008 9:43:27 PM)
once the shoot down door is opened, it can be done both ways. what is to stop butthead from showing up with a scanner and synth module wherever you and others are flying in an appropriate maner and returning the favor, several times over? never ending circle of lost models best to just not start down that road.

PilotSmith -> RE: Shoot down airplane or not for noise??? (4/16/2008 10:06:13 PM)
I've converted most of my stuff to 2.4 GHz so not that concerned about retaliation. Plus, I doubt he would ever put 2 + 2 together if at the bottom of his dive the airplane did not pull up and went into the yard. So far I like rogerswin's idea the most of giving him a "bump". I think my radio would be able to control his airplane as it would be quite a bit closer to his airplane when he is dive bombing the yards as he is across on the opposite side of the field when he does that. Perhaps after he pulls up and is going back up vertical to take over and keep him going vertical until he starts to see the light. I would think doing that a couple times would be a big hint to stay back! I have a hard time with the concept of wrecking someone's plank even if they are an idiot. Dealing with the city is not an option. The easiest thing for the city to do is just put up a sign like in many of the other fields that say "No RC models permitted." The homes in that area are mostly owned by retired folks that are easily annoyed and have all the time in the world to make a stink about it. But admittedly, it is loud. Inside the house with double insulated windows you hear the whine of the airplane going repeatedly over the homes. Keep the ideas coming!

bdavison -> RE: Shoot down airplane or not for noise??? (4/16/2008 11:28:10 PM)
A visit to the county is the best solution to this problem. Especially if you have a large group of flyers. Get the AMA membership requirements for the field...then its easy to get rid of him...or make him follow the rules. Also you better contact the county/city BEFORE this starts to be a headache for them.

zirconx -> RE: Shoot down airplane or not for noise??? (4/17/2008 8:53:07 PM)
Can't you just get the police to do their jobs? Is it really legal to purposely fly over people, their yards and homes? I doubt it. Nuisance, endangerment, trespass, I'm sure they can come up with something. Show them a video of him doing it. Better yet if he does this regularly, have a police officer hide and wait for him to do it. If the people in this neighborhood are really that upset, they shouldn't mind all going down to the police station together to ask them to do something about it. I would hope that would kick thier buts into action. I know if you live in a big city though, the police sometimes don't seem to care about anything. You could also take lots of video of him doing it (I would video his responses to your requests also), and then take him to small claims court. You don't need a lawyer, and it costs like $30-$50 to file a suit. And what is it with apostrophes and this forum? $100 spent with a decent web developer would be money well spent.

PilotSmith -> RE: Shoot down airplane or not for noise??? (4/17/2008 9:46:55 PM)
I don't live there and don't have time to spearhead a posse to go to the police. This has been going on for months. The police probably won't take any action until some punches get thrown out in the field. Hell, they won't even investigate minor crimes like stolen checks from your mailbox being used. An RC plane would be low in their list. The stuff I fly now it very quiet. I can fly anywhere with no complaints. I just hate that idiots like that cause trouble for the 95% of the modelers that are responsible. I only see fields being restricted to RC and people like him are one of the big reasons.

cyclops2 -> RE: Shoot down airplane or not for noise??? (4/17/2008 10:35:56 PM)
Is this guy flying in the USA ??????? Lots of other flying fields are lost every year for a lot less noise & safety problems. Get a petition to remove the park administrators. They are under some town or county control. They say no. Fine. Get the legal petitions to remove them first. This IS a strong election year to get changes like this DONE right the first time. That IS a correct way to change the hours and flight patterns. Geeez. Do I have to do all civil battles, myself & in person ?

getmorc -> RE: Shoot down airplane or not for noise??? (4/18/2008 1:53:09 AM)
I like the bump deal too. Don't get the ama isue going. all they care about is the money.

Mr. Mugen -> RE: Shoot down airplane or not for noise??? (4/18/2008 4:11:59 AM)
I say you go over and shoot he breeze with him. Be as annoying as possible. Ask the stupidest questions. Make it miserable for him. Heck get a mob together and get them all asking questions. Ask personal questions. Ask until he leaves.

wings 540 -> RE: Shoot down airplane or not for noise??? (4/18/2008 5:33:14 AM)
hack into the plane and buzz him and see how he likes it, or just freak him out a bit[X(]. he is giving all modelers a bad name. that buggs me.[:@]

tIANci -> RE: Shoot down airplane or not for noise??? (4/18/2008 5:48:37 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: PilotSmith Hey Vicman! Yeah, I think I have been lawyering this over my head a bit and that is why I have not loaned my gear and stopped him from using his air gun. Simple things like this can turn into expensive lawsuits. He is flying 72mhz and I have a scanner and synthesizer radio. Would take less than 30 seconds to acquire and terminate the target. But even while the guy is a total @$$ it still didn't seem right to do. I'm hoping you guys come up with some good ideas keeping in mind the following: 1) The police have been called out a couple times already and will not take any action unless he is flying during designated "quiet hours." 2) He has been asked politely asked by a modeler to tone it down so we don't all get banned and he blew off that request. 3) When confronted with a small group of neighbors, he told them all to F off and it got pretty intense. Nobody is going to want to start a fight. So I am hoping the collective wisdom over here can give some less drastic suggestions. If he would just quit dive bombing the yards that would cut down 80% of the tension. He is a newb as has been in the hobby less than a year. I actually gave him advice on setting up his gear, etc. hoping that when I spoke to him about his flying habits he would be amenable to listening to me. Was no use. I got a blow pipe with some poison ... that works pretty fast ... it will go quiet really fast. Your best action is NUISANCE. There has to be some law for that and also noise controls, in my town there is law for how much noise you can make. I am sure the US would have it too. Noise is not only about making noise during the prescribed quiet hours ... it can't be just that. I think the police can do something to warn him ... any other altenative seems very confrontational and may lead to a fight with someone like that. I still like the blow pipe ...

PilotSmith -> RE: Shoot down airplane or not for noise??? (4/18/2008 7:01:25 AM)
tIANci, that sounds pretty cool. Do you think anyone will notice me doing it in this outfit?

PilotSmith -> RE: Shoot down airplane or not for noise??? (4/18/2008 7:03:45 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Mr. Mugen I say you go over and shoot he breeze with him. Be as annoying as possible. Ask the stupidest questions. Make it miserable for him. Heck get a mob together and get them all asking questions. Ask personal questions. Ask until he leaves. I could hover my heli about 3 feet over his head... [>:]

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