RE: WALKERA 4#3B 2.4Ghz Metal Upgraded Edition Helicopter

RE: WALKERA 4#3B 2.4Ghz Metal Upgraded Edition Helicopter
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All Forums >> RC Helicopters >> Electric RC Helis >> Walkera Helis - Dragonfly, etc.. >> RE: WALKERA 4#3B 2.4Ghz Metal Upgraded Edition Helicopter

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RE: WALKERA 4#3B 2.4Ghz Metal Upgraded Edition Helicopter - 9/13/2008 11:51 PM

jasonjetski

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Don't give!
The last thing you want to do is be old and sitting in a nursing home years from now and wondering what it would be like to have been able to fly that 4#3B.

Trust me,These helis are a serious addiction,but a healthy addiction that is very rewarding.
Try to practice when you are in the right mood.
Double check the heli.Make sure the paddles are even angles.Make sure the tail has not twisted either way.
There is a chance that you can hover it fine,but there is something out of adjustment on the heli.
I have had days where I think it is just me being tired from work,but a slight adjustment of the paddles and Iam flying with a grin on my face again.
Make sure the heli is balanced too.Hold it in the air by the flybar and see if the boom is level.The skewers might be good at saving on damage,but they might be puting the centre of gravity out of whack and causing all sorts of classy flying.
Don't give up!
At least get that first hover for a full pack in and then try to quit.I bet you can't then!
Jason

quote:

ORIGINAL: rockinro

well to update you on my progress (or lack of it)...

I started reading radd's flight instructions and then I fixed my heli, made a training gear with two wood bbq skewers and decided to give flying another shot...

I followed radd's lessons and then got to hovering. I couldn't control it at all! I just kept crashing, but its good I have the training gear because the damage now is limited.

My main problem is that I'm learning to fly in my living room, and so I don't have enough space or time to react.

I need to go outdoors to a grass field with no wind and start learning control. It's just impossible to learn in a small area when all you're worrying about is damaging your heli and your furniture!

Anyways I still haven't quit yet despite my frustration...

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RE: WALKERA 4#3B 2.4Ghz Metal Upgraded Edition Helicopter - 9/14/2008 12:32 AM

klaze

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I don't suggest taking it out doors in the grass.. the grass can cause a bunch of new annoyances...

The reason why you are crashing is because you are trying to do too much too soon. All you should be trying right now is tail in hovering.. don't try forward flight! just focus on keeping it in 1 spot infront of you until you are extremely comfortable with that..

You would think forward flight would be just as easy as hovering but it's not.

Also your finger movements are likely too fast and too much.. Your brain will eventually get the idea it just takes time.. and patience..

You will get the hang of it.

Never try and fly if you are bitter... you will just be farr too aggressive with it..

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RE: WALKERA 4#3B 2.4Ghz Metal Upgraded Edition Helicopter - 9/14/2008 12:42 AM

jasonjetski

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I was never a big beer drinker,but I will never try to fly if I have had a beer also.
It kills the flying skills.
I agree to simply try to just hover tail in until you can do it without any training gear on.Then keep practicing like that for another week or so until you can do without really concentrating.
Another good thing is to spend less time flying and more time thinking about how the heli reacts to inputs.While the lipo is charging maybe.
Jason

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RE: WALKERA 4#3B 2.4Ghz Metal Upgraded Edition Helicopter - 9/14/2008 12:30 PM

rockinro

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thanks guys for all your input...i'll keep you all updated

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RE: WALKERA 4#3B 2.4Ghz Metal Upgraded Edition Helicopter - 9/14/2008 1:34 PM

HeliStyle

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like everyone said this flies like a dream when you get the hang out it.

In the next couple of weeks I'm converting my walkera 4#3b to brushless, ill keep u all posted

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RE: WALKERA 4#3B 2.4Ghz Metal Upgraded Edition Helicopter - 9/14/2008 11:40 PM

HeliStyle

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well I have 25 flights logged on my new motor I installed, see how long this one lasts

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RE: WALKERA 4#3B 2.4Ghz Metal Upgraded Edition Helicopter - 9/15/2008 12:37 AM

HeliStyle

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well after the 26 run, it seems like the new motor is toast lol which is about 3 hours of flying time, the two motors I have went through only have had about 25 packs on them, luckily I have 2 new motors that came in. Looks like its brushless time.

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RE: WALKERA 4#3B 2.4Ghz Metal Upgraded Edition Helicopter - 9/15/2008 1:06 AM

HeliStyle

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actually the other motor isn't dead yet, I put acouple of drops of trinity royal oil in the holes of the motor and its working like brand new again lol

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RE: WALKERA 4#3B 2.4Ghz Metal Upgraded Edition Helicopter - 9/16/2008 1:40 AM

HeliStyle

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anyone else been flying the 4#3b lately?

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RE: WALKERA 4#3B 2.4Ghz Metal Upgraded Edition Helicopter - 9/18/2008 5:23 AM

gnaras

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hi all!
I'm new to this forum and I was happy to see all the replies for the questions posted here.
I have some experience with a .46 high winger aricraft and a picozo 2 channel helicopter.
I have problems similar to rockinro with my walkera 4#3b.

I have NEVER been able fly this even for 2 seconds even after 20 recharges.
If it takes off, it crashes.
The problems I am facing are:
1.) If I make the swashplate parallel to the ground, the heli rolls severly to the left. So I have to trim it right and the swashplate does not remain parallel to the ground. If the swashplate is not paralle to the ground does it cause any problems ? My servo throws are at maximum. If I reduce the throws I can't trim it.
2.) After take off it is uncontrollable. It does not stay at one place and does stuff on it's own. No matter what I do it does not stay in one place. I CAN"T FLY IT.
3.) I've had a lot of minor crashes or let's say all I have had is crashes and now what happens is by the time the I power up to take off speed the tail starts to go in the anti-clockwise direction even on full application of the rudder. And some times it does not rotate at all. I have to flick it to make it start rotating. Is the tail motor gone ?

In a bid to stablize the heli I tried putting a sping below the swashplate , but that did not help so I have now removed it.
I tried making the flybar paddles heavier by adding tape on them, but that didn't help either so I have removed them.
I have tried removing the play in the rotor head by adding tape to the gap (see picture)
Also once I had removed one of the flybar paddles to see how the angle could be adjusted. Since then the problem became worse and now I don't know how to set the flybar paddles to the original condition.
I have checked all screws are tight, there is no breakage anywhere.
I would really appreciate it if some one can help. I don't know how to go forward with this heli. All flying is stopped for the time being.

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RE: WALKERA 4#3B 2.4Ghz Metal Upgraded Edition Helicopter - 9/18/2008 2:25 PM

cenracer1

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I'm sure someone else with more adjusting experience on these heli's can chime in.. Mine flew perfectly right out of the box.. have over 25 flights on the 3 lipos that I got.. no issues at all.. The setup on this one is the same as my other heli's.. the flybar paddles have to be level to the ground.. 0 pitch.. My swashplate is set level as well.. It came that way and I didn't have to adjust it.. my friends 4#3B has a little tilt to the right.. only a small amount.. You can also adjust the linkages in very small increments as well... Its all a matter of setup with the heli as well as all others... these little micro heli's are tougher than the larger ones due to no margin for error.. unless your crashing caused something else to be broken in the heli, drastic adjustments shouldn't be needed.. As for adjusting the flybar paddles, I just twist them carefully to set them, but I haven't had to play with them much.. Haven't had anything that I would call a crash yet....This is just the indoor flyer when the weather is bad.. although it flies very well outdoors as well...

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RE: WALKERA 4#3B 2.4Ghz Metal Upgraded Edition Helicopter - 9/18/2008 4:47 PM

HeliStyle

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yeah I agree mine flew right out of the box, I was flying it out last night and it flew great, there was no wind and it was very fun. I did however have a crash and broke the tail boom, I'm going to replace it with aluminum tubing.

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RE: WALKERA 4#3B 2.4Ghz Metal Upgraded Edition Helicopter - 9/18/2008 9:54 PM

joizeex

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gnaras, i'll try to address your points:
1) swash plate doesn't have to be perfectly horizontal. in fact, in all my helis i set subtrim or mechanical linkages so that the heli doesn't drift to the left or other directions when in the air (i don't touch trim levers unless the linkage can't be moved in very small increments). that results in the swash being noticeably tilted to the right and the smaller the heli, the more tilt i have on it. so set up your linkages first, but only judging from heli movement in the AIR.
2) this heli is not a coaxial type, so it WILL move around, especially when there's furniture around and the rotor-wash bounces off that. you just need to be quick and patient with it and make SMALL inputs at a time. also, push the battery all the way forward.
3) check the wires going to the tail motor for breaks where they enter the motor casing; is the gear meshed properly on the tail? put a tiny drop of oil on the bearings of the tail rotor shaft.

do not add anything anywhere else because it's not needed. making flybar paddles heavier is probably the only thing you should adjust on the head. what problem are you having with putting them back to original? show us some pics and maybe we can guide you through it. if you have figured it out already, try this one last ditch effort:
tie a 1 meter long thread or light string to the battery holder as close to the middle as possible (underneath main shaft). on the other end tie a weight that's 10 times the weight of the heli. now try taking off again, high enough to make the string taut. as long as you give it enough throttle to keep the string taut and the heli has enough throttle given to it, it won't dart off to the sides as much and you'll be able to practice with it easier or see what's happening to it.
just keep in mind, that this heli is not the easiest to fly and won't stay perfectly still with hands off the sticks.

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RE: WALKERA 4#3B 2.4Ghz Metal Upgraded Edition Helicopter - 9/19/2008 1:22 AM

cenracer1

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Since it was such a windless night before dark, i decided to take the heli outside again for a little more fun flying that I can't do inside... It was flying great and even in the smallest breezes, wasn't a problem... One of the neighbors kids showed up with one of those Air Hogz havoks and we were flying around with that as well... The 4#3B isn't that much bigger than the cheapo ones, but what a night and day difference in flight.. we were running circles around the Havok and the Blade wash was sending the Havok all over the place... I almost bought out the 22E but with all the fun we were having I didn't feel the need to wreck it.. the 22E is so much larger that it would eat up the 4#3B... flew until dark and the pack were spent.. have it trimmed really well and it would just hover for about 5-8 seconds completely hands off...

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RE: WALKERA 4#3B 2.4Ghz Metal Upgraded Edition Helicopter - 9/21/2008 5:03 PM

gnaras

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Thanks joizeex for taking the time to reply to my post.
Oiling the tail rotor bearings helped and now the tail does not go anti-clockwise during take off.

1.) I have the flybar paddles in palce, but I have not accurately measured their distance from the main rotor shaft. I will get a vernier capplier soon to measure this. To what accuracy should they be adjusted from teh main rotor shaft?

I would like to know if we can control this heli when the servo throws are at minimum or do we have to keep them at maximum?

I will apply your suggestions and update you on my progress.

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RE: WALKERA 4#3B 2.4Ghz Metal Upgraded Edition Helicopter - 9/21/2008 7:28 PM

joizeex

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glad to be of help.
considering how tiny this heli is, i would keep accuracy to 0.1mm. i doubt that if you're off even by full 1mm that it'll make any significant impact, BUT you want more precision just to eliminate any possible culprits.
initially i was able to fly it with minimal servo throws, but i noticed that if i had to "save" it from going hard in one direction, the minimal throws made the direction reversal take longer and made it feel less responsive. since then i set it to almost completely clockwise and also put the ball links on the servo horn to 1 more hole to the outside. the downside of doing this is that if you're still new, you'll be tempted to make really big stick motions and overcorrect it. so for now, just increase the throw screw and learn to control it in small inputs. once you're comfortable with it being all the way CW and want even quicker response, put the ball links out 1 hole.

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RE: WALKERA 4#3B 2.4Ghz Metal Upgraded Edition Helicopter - 9/21/2008 7:41 PM

gnaras

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Is it possible to change the angle of the flybar paddles ?
If yes how to do that and what angle makes it more stable ?

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RE: WALKERA 4#3B 2.4Ghz Metal Upgraded Edition Helicopter - 9/22/2008 12:12 AM

joizeex

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you should be able to loosen the screw on the paddle weight and then twist the paddle. someone said earlier in the thread that pitching them up a lil bit makes it more stable. i haven't really messed with them, but i know that just twisting them with a lil bit of force will change the angle.

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RE: WALKERA 4#3B 2.4Ghz Metal Upgraded Edition Helicopter - 9/22/2008 2:04 PM

taman76

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gnaras,

One thing I noticed in an previous post is that you have fixed wing experience. I am a pretty good plane pilot and even instruct fixed wing, and I am also learning helicopters. I went with a 450 size CP to learn on. Might not have been the smartest move, but I am getting there.

One thing I have learned quickly is, everything I know about flying a plane really doesn't apply. Learning to hover first is key. If you know somebody who can fly helicopters, get them to trim it out for you. If not, you will have to get it off the ground a couple of feet and see what it does, set it back down, make the adjustment you need, then try again.

Keep just doing short hops. Take it up and then set it down. Before long you will start getting control of the helicopter instead of it controlling you.

Don't use thumbs on the transmitter. Fly using fingers. This will help keep you from over controlling it.

Fly the nose of the helicopter, keeping the tail toward you all times. Start by making that your primary focus. You will find that it makes the right hand much easier to fly.

Don't give up. Know you will crash often no matter how good you get. But keep at it and before long you will find you can fly it.

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RE: WALKERA 4#3B 2.4Ghz Metal Upgraded Edition Helicopter - 9/22/2008 6:44 PM

gnaras

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Thanks tanman. I'll keep your tips in mind. I'm expecting my vernier tomorrow. So I'll be able to make some accurate measurements and adjustments and hopefully make some progress. I'll keep you guys posted.

Ok so i finally got my vernier and the measurements were accurate,but still no luck. I don't know how to practise. I tied a rope at the bottom of the heli and powered it up, but it went all the way on the side and crashed. If I try to keep the tail boom pointed towards me,then it starts rolling and before you know it crashes again :

< Message edited by gnaras -- 9/25/2008 7:04 PM >

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RE: WALKERA 4#3B 2.4Ghz Metal Upgraded Edition Helicopter - 9/26/2008 12:05 AM

joizeex

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there's really no other tricks for getting through the initial learning phase. it's something you'll just have to develop, provided that the heli is not completely out of trim. i guess the best thing would be to try those free RC sims with a dual joystick controller.

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RE: WALKERA 4#3B 2.4Ghz Metal Upgraded Edition Helicopter - 9/26/2008 2:05 AM

HeliStyle

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agreed, if you have some sort of flying experience the helicopter pretty much flies out of the box

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RE: WALKERA 4#3B 2.4Ghz Metal Upgraded Edition Helicopter - 9/27/2008 7:37 AM

HansV

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Hi guys. Had visitors for a couple of weeks so didn't do much flying.

gnaras, just a couple of hints trimming your 4#3B before taking it into the air.

If you look carefully at the flybar rod you can will see that there are 4 "flat spots" to keep the it from rotating. This means that if you have installed it right so that the two screws in the rotor assembly and the flybar collar screws are tigthened on these flat areas you should not have to do a lot of adjustemnt. I just replaced a bend flybar rod and it took me 5 minutes to get into the air again. You need to hold the heli and spin it up a little to check that the paddles are aligned and that the blades are tracking. Also make sure that the tail rod is pushed all the way in and the gears are aligned. This will save you from a lot of crashes and only takes 10 seconds after pligging in the battery.

When I started flying this beast I took it just out of the ground effect (10-20 cm) and learned to do small stick corrections. In the beginning I was constantly over compensating so that I had to compensate my too aggressive stick movements usually resulting in an evil circle and finally crash. If you have enough space you can try to keep it level 10-20 cm above the ground and ignore the drift (it will drift). When you get the feeling for it you can start to compensate for the drift by small adjustments. If you keep it on the ground for too long or if you fly below 10cm you will see that it will change directions pretty fast and is harder to control. It is good practice but probably not the fastes way to learn how to hover.

Hang in there and let us know how it goes. If you rotor and paddles are aligned, the tail is spinning and the CG is in center your heli should not be way off. But it takes a lot of practice and patience, so remember to enjoy the progress you are making instead of getting frustrated. Believe me, it is a lot of fun the first time you can hold it in the air for more than a few seconds. And the more time you spend the more fun you will have and soon you will find yourself flying around.

Hope it helps,

Hans.
PS: Still having trouble flying CCW. It looks ugley and the gyro put up a good fight. Did anyone have luck doing this?

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RE: WALKERA 4#3B 2.4Ghz Metal Upgraded Edition Helicopter - 9/28/2008 5:38 AM

HansV

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Just ordered a bunch of spare parts in the best HeliStyle-style

Around 100 bucks worth of parts so that should keep me flying for a while. Does anyone know how to change the tail motor? I think mine is close to die so I ordered a new one. Also had to replace the aleron servo again. It worked fine but suddenly it got stocked during the flight so that the heli kept going sideways causing a lot of "funny" landings

Luckely nothing broke but after the fifth time I got tired of it and stole a servo from the one with the bent main shaft.

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RE: WALKERA 4#3B 2.4Ghz Metal Upgraded Edition Helicopter - 9/28/2008 9:57 AM

joizeex

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replacing tail motor:
pull the 2 small heat shrink tubes along the wires on the tail motor to expose the solder joints.
desolder both wires using a low power <40W soldering iron.
cut the super long wires on the new motor to match the lengths.
make sure the heat shrink tubes are on the wires before you solder the new motor's wires.
pull the hear shrink tubes back over the solder joints.
pull the old motor out trying not to break anything.
pop the new one in.
badabing!

has anyone seen an airwolf body for this thing yet? that would be fo' shizzle my nizzle.

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All Forums >> RC Helicopters >> Electric RC Helis >> Walkera Helis - Dragonfly, etc.. >> RE: WALKERA 4#3B 2.4Ghz Metal Upgraded Edition Helicopter
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