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RE: Environmental Awareness Day... - 6/13/2008 9:42:03 PM   
brett65



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quote:

ORIGINAL: hands without shadows

My little brother's 80cc Honda dirtbike gets me up to 75 km/h, accelerates just as fast as car, and probably gets over 150 mpg. Why are we (Americans) driving cars with engines over 2L?


Because we want to! Americans like big horsepower and big comfy vehicles. I don't want us to look like saigon with a billion mopeds tooting around. I believe driving is more than just a means of transportation. Its something to enjoy, which u can't really do with a 2L w/o spending lots of money on it. Even then it would have to be in a little turd of a car that only 2 people can ride comfortably in, maybe.

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       Post #: 101

RE: Environmental Awareness Day... - 6/13/2008 10:12:29 PM   
dsales



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^^^Couldnt have said it better myself except most people want masses of horsepower.
Most commuters spend over 1/4 of their lives driving so it should be done in comfort and style.

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       Post #: 102

RE: Environmental Awareness Day... - 6/13/2008 11:10:16 PM   
Foxy



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quote:

ORIGINAL: brett65


quote:

ORIGINAL: hands without shadows

My little brother's 80cc Honda dirtbike gets me up to 75 km/h, accelerates just as fast as car, and probably gets over 150 mpg. Why are we (Americans) driving cars with engines over 2L?


Because we want to! Americans like big horsepower and big comfy vehicles. I don't want us to look like saigon with a billion mopeds tooting around. I believe driving is more than just a means of transportation. Its something to enjoy, which u can't really do with a 2L w/o spending lots of money on it. Even then it would have to be in a little turd of a car that only 2 people can ride comfortably in, maybe.


People like you are why I made this thread. Bravo.

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       Post #: 103

RE: Environmental Awareness Day... - 6/13/2008 11:28:32 PM   
snowbl!nd



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quote:

ORIGINAL: brett65
ts something to enjoy, which u can't really do with a 2L w/o spending lots of money on it. Even then it would have to be in a little turd of a car that only 2 people can ride comfortably in, maybe.


Never driven a European vehicle then?

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       Post #: 104

RE: Environmental Awareness Day... - 6/13/2008 11:50:03 PM   
AutoXMan



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Not all American's are like Brett.


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RE: Environmental Awareness Day... - 6/13/2008 11:57:25 PM   
ThunderbirdJunkie



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quote:

ORIGINAL: AutoXMan

Not all American's are like Brett.


You're right. And thankfully, not all Americans are like you and use a possessive apostrophe when there is none because the word you typed should've been plural.

European cars are hit and miss, for me. I like Volkswagens and Audis...Alfas...well, the spiders are cool...but their front-drive offerings remind me of...well...I'm not sure what.

Foxy, just because somebody chooses to drive a car that doesn't SUCK doesn't mean we don't care about the environment. Truth is, we want our planet to be healthy so we can enjoy it, yes? Why take care of our planet to enjoy it if we don't enjoy everything ELSE we do?

I, for one, am not going to drive some piddly little eunick (sp?) car so I can get a thumbs up from some morons that suck Al Gore's toes. That would be an Inconvenient Choice

And if you REALLY cared about the environment, it wouldn't be just ONE DAY you'd care about...and you wouldn't have missed it if it were one you actually DID care about.

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RE: Environmental Awareness Day... - 6/14/2008 12:15:54 AM   
AutoXMan



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Thunderbird, I made a minor spelling mistake. It's funny how you take that so personally. Really, it's people like you...


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RE: Environmental Awareness Day... - 6/14/2008 1:19:54 AM   
Anomie



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quote:

ORIGINAL: AutoXMan

Not all American's are like Brett.


Thank you! That is so true.

It's amazing how simple 300+ million can be lumped together into one generalization.

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RE: Environmental Awareness Day... - 6/14/2008 1:52:25 AM   
ThunderbirdJunkie



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Reiko, generalizations exist for a reason.

Like:
Redheads are hot
Blondes are dumb
Brunettes are smart if they wear glasses

etc etc and so forth.

There are reasons (and I'm not saying they're all accurate) that there are generalizations such as this.

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       Post #: 109

RE: Environmental Awareness Day... - 6/14/2008 5:41:37 AM   
Anomie



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Oy.

T-Bird, you're a classic. If anyone can put the kibosh to my statement, it's you. To be clear, I understand your point to the fullest. Statistics can be harsh, but they will stand head and shoulders above the simple assumptions.

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RE: Environmental Awareness Day... - 6/14/2008 9:15:49 AM   
Foxy



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quote:

ORIGINAL: ThunderbirdJunkie


quote:

ORIGINAL: AutoXMan

Not all American's are like Brett.


You're right. And thankfully, not all Americans are like you and use a possessive apostrophe when there is none because the word you typed should've been plural.

European cars are hit and miss, for me. I like Volkswagens and Audis...Alfas...well, the spiders are cool...but their front-drive offerings remind me of...well...I'm not sure what.

Foxy, just because somebody chooses to drive a car that doesn't SUCK doesn't mean we don't care about the environment. Truth is, we want our planet to be healthy so we can enjoy it, yes? Why take care of our planet to enjoy it if we don't enjoy everything ELSE we do?

I, for one, am not going to drive some piddly little eunick (sp?) car so I can get a thumbs up from some morons that suck Al Gore's toes. That would be an Inconvenient Choice

And if you REALLY cared about the environment, it wouldn't be just ONE DAY you'd care about...and you wouldn't have missed it if it were one you actually DID care about.


Huh? What did I do? lol, whoa there TB.

I like cars that handle, I never said american cars suck, or that you should ride in a 1l. Gimme strength.

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RE: Environmental Awareness Day... - 6/14/2008 2:39:17 PM   
AutoXMan



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What did you do Foxy? You cared (care) about the environment. That angers people for some reason.


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RE: Environmental Awareness Day... - 6/14/2008 3:12:12 PM   
Longhair



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From: NA, , NETHERLANDS
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quote:

ORIGINAL: AutoXMan

What did you do Foxy? You cared (care) about the environment. That angers people for some reason.


People get angry because all of the unwanted extra costs that are being passed on to them.

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RE: Environmental Awareness Day... - 6/16/2008 3:36:05 AM   
SAVAGEJIM



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quote:

ORIGINAL: dsales

Firstly a dirtbike is a very light vehicle compared to a car, so it gets a good power to weight ratio and milage. Its like saying my Kyosho Fazer is fast and efficient with a .15 but that engine just wont work on a MGT or Savage as they are too heavy.

SavageJim, the reason there are no hybrid-diesel cars around at the moment is because a diesel engine is much heavier than a petrol one and diesel is a much dirtier fuel for the enviroment, so the electric motor pulling the diesel car around will find it very difficult to and wont go very far without running out of power due to the extra weight of the diesel motor and the electric one itself and as diesel fuel burns much less cleanly the car just wont benefit the enviroment.


In yes, liter for liter (or ci for ci), diesel engines of the same displaemnt as its gasoline counterpart will be heavier. But diesel engines have a serious advantage: torque. So, design a diesel engine of a smaller displacement such that it makes the same ft-lbf (or N-m) as its gasoline counterpart, and you will literally mitigate the weight.

Additionally, there are new cleaner diesel technologies in the US now, and these things, to meet much stricted US Federal laws, put out 15PPM or sulfur than before. All diesels sold in the US starting at 2008 must meet these standards, and these engines still put out gobs more torque than their counterpart gasoline engines.

Yes, diesel engines are heavier, but hopefully the car makers will sopn have beter electric tech coming up, such as AC driven traction motors and traction motors that are totally independedt of the engine (i.e. the engine does not drive the wheels in any manner, the drivetrain is powered solely by the traction motor (or motors). The engine only has the job to turn the alternator to power the entire car. Batteries also have a long ways to go, but Li-Ion is starting to hit the scene if I remember correctly. Most hybrids use NiMH now, but I will not be surprised for carmakers to offer Li-Ion upgrades. Also, as the capacity of batts go up, I will not be surprised to see the standard batt capacity seeing several hundreds of amphers (that would be 100,000 of mAh). Batteries that can boost the range of a hybrid's traction motors to about at least 200mi would actually open the door to full electric vehicles that are viable for dirving out of town. But mate an engine to turn on and recharge the bats and turn the alternator to power the traction motors, and that car probably can see a 500mi + driving range before having to plug in again or fuel up again.





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