What is my liability if I do damage with an RC airplane not at a sanctioned AMA field?  
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All Forums >> RC Airplanes >> AMA Discussions >> What is my liability if I do damage with an RC airplane not at a sanctioned AMA field?
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What is my liability if I do damage with an RC airplane... - 6/16/2008 3:22:29 PM   
Bijan999


 

Posts: 184
Joined: 5/4/2003
From: Lexington, KY, USA
Status: offline 		I'm thinking of joining the AMA but I live quite far from the local flying field. I live in a neighborhood and we each have 5 acres of property. I'd be flying a 40 size trainer and I'm sure at some point flying would involve flying over neighbor's houses. In the event of a crash, if I did damage to a neighbor's property or god fobid injured someone, would the coverage the AMA provides cover this? Or does AMA coverage only pertain to flying at santioned club fields?

Does anyone know if my homeowners insurance would cover something like this? Sorry if this question is a repost.

Thank you!
       Post #: 1

RE: What is my liability if I do damage with an RC airp... - 6/16/2008 3:51:57 PM   
littlecrankshaf



Posts: 2135
Joined: 12/9/2001
From: here
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Bijan999

I'm thinking of joining the AMA but I live quite far from the local flying field. I live in a neighborhood and we each have 5 acres of property. I'd be flying a 40 size trainer and I'm sure at some point flying would involve flying over neighbor's houses. In the event of a crash, if I did damage to a neighbor's property or god fobid injured someone, would the coverage the AMA provides cover this? Or does AMA coverage only pertain to flying at santioned club fields?

Does anyone know if my homeowners insurance would cover something like this? Sorry if this question is a repost.

Thank you!


Of course questions like that are hard if not impossible to answer but AMA insurance does work at places other than chartered fields… even private property. Either way, no matter what, having insurance isn't an excuse to take unacceptable risks. If you feel it is somehow particularly unsafe, please refrain... AMA membership or not...insurance or not.

_____________________________

Wow! Another epiphany…that is why the suckups suckup. Super sucking protection power. Yea baby.

(in reply to Bijan999)
       Post #: 2

RE: What is my liability if I do damage with an RC air... - 6/16/2008 4:01:27 PM   
mtwister


 

Posts: 700
Joined: 11/3/2005
From: Salem , OR, USA
Status: offline 		One thing people most often forget, AMA is supplemental insurance, it covers what your home or privately aqquired insurance wont. So, maybe that helps answer your question?

(in reply to littlecrankshaf)
       Post #: 3

RE: What is my liability if I do damage with an RC air... - 6/16/2008 5:06:19 PM   
KidEpoxy



Posts: 3414
Joined: 10/14/2004
From: San Antonio, TX, USA
Status: offline 		OP-
You are probably scaring a lit of folks with the talk about a 40 Trainer flying in 5ac.

To learn about insurance here, try asking it as a 2part question.

What is the Secondary insurance situation if you were flying a little electric Slow Sick at your house with 5ac.
Part 2: How would that change if you then flew a 40 trainer there.

The theory is that it wouldnt change,
unless you did something deemed "unsafe" or "reckless" (Read SafetyCode#3) with the .40Trainer.
<"unsafe" or "reckless" is the subject of many debates, but not this particular post>


So to all us forum guys,
let him know how the secondary insurance works when he flies a SlowStick/AirHog at his 5ac home.
Then, if you want, you can give Part2 a shot.

_____________________________

Optional MA is part of AMA history, we can go optional AGAIN if we just say so

(in reply to mtwister)
       Post #: 4

RE: What is my liability if I do damage with an RC air... - 6/16/2008 5:12:52 PM   
MetallicaJunkie



Posts: 1048
Joined: 9/17/2006
From: donna, TX, USA
Status: offline 		i thought it only covered accidents that occur at AMA flying sites................. so if i go fly in a big open field in a rural area and happen to cause property damage, then im covered there too?

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Freestyle Junkie
Revver Bro #217

(in reply to mtwister)
       Post #: 5

RE: What is my liability if I do damage with an RC airp... - 6/16/2008 5:16:33 PM   
Bob Mitchell


 

Posts: 555
Joined: 3/23/2008
From: Lexington, KY, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Bijan999

I'm thinking of joining the AMA but I live quite far from the local flying field. I live in a neighborhood and we each have 5 acres of property. I'd be flying a 40 size trainer and I'm sure at some point flying would involve flying over neighbor's houses. In the event of a crash, if I did damage to a neighbor's property or god fobid injured someone, would the coverage the AMA provides cover this? Or does AMA coverage only pertain to flying at santioned club fields?

Does anyone know if my homeowners insurance would cover something like this? Sorry if this question is a repost.

Thank you!


As someone else has said, the AMA insurance is secondary to your homeowners insurance. No one here is qualified to answer questions about your specific insurance coverage.

I can imaging the conversation, though. "Let's see now......you want to know if we will provide liability coverage when you choose to fly your airplane over other people's homes. An airplane that weighs maybe 5 pounds, that's going 40-50 MPH with a 10 inch knife on the front spinning at 9000 RPM? Would we pay the medical bills for the poor sap grilling hotdogs that you hit in the head? Or the 5 year old on his back yard swing who looses an eye?

What do you think the answer will be?

Think "contributory negligence" or perhaps even "wanton endangerment". Can you guess which of these is a civil liability term and which is a criminal liability term?

I don't even think I'd bother to ask my agent that question for fear that my policy would be cancelled for lack of good judgement on my part.

Bob


_____________________________

Bob Mitchell AMA 903015
H9 Alpha 60/Evolution 61NT, Sig 4* 60/OS 75AX, Futaba 7C 2.4GHz

(in reply to Bijan999)
       Post #: 6

RE: What is my liability if I do damage with an RC airp... - 6/16/2008 6:00:12 PM   
Scar



Posts: 2277
Joined: 10/1/2002
From: Peoria Hts, IL, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Bijan999

I'm thinking of joining the AMA but I live quite far from the local flying field. I live in a neighborhood and we each have 5 acres of property. I'd be flying a 40 size trainer and I'm sure at some point flying would involve flying over neighbor's houses. In the event of a crash, if I did damage to a neighbor's property or god fobid injured someone, would the coverage the AMA provides cover this? Or does AMA coverage only pertain to flying at santioned club fields?

Does anyone know if my homeowners insurance would cover something like this? Sorry if this question is a repost.

Thank you!


It's okay to revisit these questions. Usually the threads get clogged with personalities.

1. It is important to fly where you have adequate flying area, without overflying people or dwellings. That's why you find club sites outside populated areas.

2. If you damage your neighbor's property, it is you who are liable. That's why you buy insurance.

3. AMA coverage is secondary to your homeowner's.

4. AMA coverage is good anywhere you have permission to fly from the land owner. That means, if you don't have permission from your neighor to fly over his property, AMA won't add to your coverage. I don't know what your Homeowner's calls for.

5. A suggestion : Fly where there's at least a half mile between you and people or dwellings.

Best wishes,
Dave Olson

< Message edited by Scar -- 6/16/2008 6:02:53 PM >

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(in reply to Bijan999)
       Post #: 7

RE: What is my liability if I do damage with an RC airp... - 6/16/2008 6:23:18 PM   
kid chuckles


 

Posts: 774
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Granbury, TX, USA
Status: offline 		Your liability is the same as if you were at a Club flying field that is AMA. If your flying on your own land you have permission. And if you have HO it is a mute question anyway. AMA will do nothing for you at all if you have Home Owners.

< Message edited by kid chuckles -- 6/16/2008 11:21:41 PM >

(in reply to Scar)
       Post #: 8

RE: What is my liability if I do damage with an RC air... - 6/16/2008 6:44:37 PM   
-pkh-



Posts: 2392
Joined: 5/28/2004
From: Emmaus, PA, USA
Status: offline 		Sure, 5 acres is plenty for a landing strip, but it's much too small for a fly-over area. You should not be flying over your neighbors property without permission from them, and you should certainly avoid flying over their houses, even if you have permission to fly over their property. In general, you should never be flying over other people, so even if you are allowed to fly over their properties, you should be able to see that there are no people in the area that you are flying over. Here's the list of rules the AMA suggests for park flyers, and I believe they apply well to flying any RC aircraft at non-club locations:

1) Inspect your model before every flight to be certain it is airworthy
2) Be aware of any other radio frequency user that may present an interference problem
3) Always be courteous and respectful of other users of your selected flight area
4) Choose an area clear of obstacles and large enough to safely accommodate your flying activity
5) Make certain this area is clear of friends and spectators prior to launching your aircraft
6) Be aware of other activities in the vicinity of your flight path that could cause potential conflict
7) Carefully plan your flight path prior to launch
8) Abide by any and all established AMA National Model Aircraft Safety Code

_____________________________

Paul - Helis: Two Raptor 50V2s, Venture 30CP, Blade CX2
Planes: Twist 150, Twist 60, Tribute 36, GP .40 Mustang

(in reply to kid chuckles)
       Post #: 9

RE: What is my liability if I do damage with an RC air... - 6/16/2008 6:56:43 PM   
Red Scholefield



Posts: 4980
Joined: 12/8/2001
From: Newberry, FL, USA
Status: offline 		5 acers. That would be 467 feet square. At 40 mph, the speed of an average trainer, you would cover that distance in less than 8 seconds. I would suggest you go to a nearby club filed, mark off a 500 feet square and see if you can fly within that space - better yet see if you can set up an approach and land in that space.

Corrected typo, 457 should be 467.

< Message edited by Red Scholefield -- 6/16/2008 10:30:25 PM >

_____________________________

Red S.
AMA 951 Leader Member

(in reply to -pkh-)
       Post #: 10

RE: What is my liability if I do damage with an RC air... - 6/16/2008 7:06:24 PM   
KidEpoxy



Posts: 3414
Joined: 10/14/2004
From: San Antonio, TX, USA
Status: offline 		Ok, so without getting into speculation,

If your neighbors also have acres of property,
if they gove you permission to fly over their property, then you are covered with the AMA Secondary insurance if you damage a flowerbed or sprinklers or fence or tractor or Sunbathing Nudists. They want money from you, you use whatever insurance you have to pay them, and if you still owe money then the Secondary AMA insurance steps in.

This still doesnt grant permission to fly unsafe or reckless.
That is where opinion & speculation come into these threads. Some folks say something is reckless, while others say it can be done safely. I am not here to argue that <again>. You have to ask yourself, regardless of insurance, "Can I fly this safely here?"

So, you could approach your neighbor,
and say you would have millions of dollars of insurance if they gave permission to overfly the non-house area of their property in a safe manner, but you MIGHT not have any AMA insurance for accidents on their land if they dont give permission.

I'm not going to speculate on just how MIGHT it might be.

_____________________________

Optional MA is part of AMA history, we can go optional AGAIN if we just say so

(in reply to -pkh-)
       Post #: 11

RE: What is my liability if I do damage with an RC air... - 6/16/2008 7:36:53 PM   
-pkh-



Posts: 2392
Joined: 5/28/2004
From: Emmaus, PA, USA
Status: offline 		In addition to having memberships at two large clubs about 30mins away, I also belong to a very small AMA charter club near my house. That has about as small of a field and fly-over area that I'd care to fly .40-.60 sized nitro planes at. In fact, I only fly my 3D/Sport planes there, since they are relatively easy to land on the short landing strip.

The landing strip is about 300ft x 100ft, and we have about 36 acres or so of fly-over area (all corn/soy fields with a few trees here and there). As Red implied, it can be very challenging to land on a small strip, especially if you are just starting out, and/or are used to having 600+ feet to roll out your landings.

< Message edited by -pkh- -- 6/16/2008 7:39:18 PM >

_____________________________

Paul - Helis: Two Raptor 50V2s, Venture 30CP, Blade CX2
Planes: Twist 150, Twist 60, Tribute 36, GP .40 Mustang

(in reply to KidEpoxy)
       Post #: 12

RE: What is my liability if I do damage with an RC airp... - 6/16/2008 9:39:53 PM   
Hossfly



Posts: 3850
Joined: 12/3/2001
From: New Caney, TX, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Bijan999
I'm thinking of joining the AMA but I live quite far from the local flying field. I live in a neighborhood and we each have 5 acres of property. I'd be flying a 40 size trainer and I'm sure at some point flying would involve flying over neighbor's houses. In the event of a crash, if I did damage to a neighbor's property or god fobid injured someone, would the coverage the AMA provides cover this? Or does AMA coverage only pertain to flying at santioned club fields?

Does anyone know if my homeowners insurance would cover something like this? Sorry if this question is a repost.

Thank you!


Bijan, the question is not about insurance. Your question should concern safety and the possibility of what COULD happen. You ask this question so I surmise you are a very inexperienced RC flier.
Unfortunately so many things can happen with a RC model that every minute you are airborne from pushing the throttle forward to shutdown, you should be prepared for the unexpected, especially when close to people or even property. Therefore I suggest that you don't even think about using that small space for RC airplane activity other than perhaps small electric foamies and stay over YOUR property, and only fly when the wind is very light.


_____________________________

Horrace Cain.
AMA Life L-93, Leader and CD for 45 years
Official Candidate: AMA Ex. Vice Pres. Vote H. Cain. Help move AMA into 21st Century
The only source of knowledge is experience. Albert Einstein

(in reply to Bijan999)
       Post #: 13

RE: What is my liability if I do damage with an RC air... - 6/16/2008 11:14:52 PM   
LANNYBOB



Posts: 872
Joined: 7/6/2003
From: defuniak springs, FL, USA
Status: offline 		Im qualified to answer your question. THE AMA WILL NOT PAY YOU A DIME FOR ANYTHING. END OF STORY. my dad had claim years ago and they said. AND I QUOTE " DOES THE PERSON'S VEHICLE YOU HIT HAVE AUTO INSURANCE? IF SO THEY WILL HANDLE IT ,OR YOUR HOME OWNERS INSURANCE POLICY MIGHT BE AN ALTERNATIVE". END QUOTE. (this is a true story 2003)

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ITS NOT THE END OF THE WORLD BUT YOU CAN SEE IT FROM HERE

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       Post #: 14

RE: What is my liability if I do damage with an RC air... - 6/17/2008 12:11:42 AM   
kid chuckles


 

Posts: 774
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Granbury, TX, USA
Status: offline 		Lannybob has it right. That should be the answer the man is looking for. Same thing they told me more or less. My HO his ins. my car, health, borrow it, steal it anything but AMA pay it. Yes Home Owners pays in most cases. Like the man said about his club having a small field ours is less than an acre of actual field and we fly very close to a school, home, and a church, all are less than 3/8 mile away. But man at that we have plenty room. If you get any further than a couple hundred yd. you can't see them anyway lol.
I have asked before if anyone on here has actually been paid on a claim? Think i will start a poll to see how many has and how many have tried but turned down.

(in reply to LANNYBOB)