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RE: Flyeagle F18F - 7/6/2009 11:07 AM   
olnico



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From: dubai, UNITED ARAB EMIRATES
Status: offline 		Hi Rex,

Congratulations !
I am glad that you did a nice maiden.
For the takeoff and landing roll into cross winds, never forget to apply some ailerons into the wind.
The less flaps you'll use for takeoff, the less jump you'll get, but the longer the takeoff run will be.

On landing, if you see the plane starting to bank on one side, just apply full brakes. It will sit her on the ground.
Now I always apply full brakes very soon after landing to avoid having too many problems with tilting her.
I have made up a stock of sheer pins since these ones are here to work as a fusing device. DO NOT make them with hard steel or you'll brake the wood structure than holds the gear plates...

Regarding the elevators, as I wrote here before, this plane needs much less throw than expected. Avoid using any exponential since it increases the auto-pitchup characteristics.
Also treat this bird with a lot of respect when you'll start doing aerobatics: the handling radius is very big and the plane DOES snap stall if you pull too much on her...
Never forget that she is heavy...

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RE: Flyeagle F18F - 7/6/2009 11:10 AM   
olnico



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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kmarks

Thanks Olivier,

Had only one flight this morning at the field, the temp was a little hot at 105 degree F, sunny and hot with a slight cross wind. I wanted to try the 30 degree flap setting with speed break, and yes indeed the F18F came in really nice. I porpoised slightly till I got the speed and AOA right on and then she just slowly with a nose high angle glided across the landing strip with mains touching down so nice.

That is the ticket.


Kevin


Hi Kevin,

I am glad that you liked this tip.
You can try to pull her on a final approach to see how resistant she is to the auto-pitchup with the speed brakes deployed.

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RE: Flyeagle F18F - 7/6/2009 4:29 PM   
rbxbear44


 

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Status: offline 		Oliver,
I am having a local flying buddy of mine make up some more sheer pins...NOT from hardened steel, I agree totally. I was speaking with a former F-18 pilot and he was telling me the flight characteristics of the real bird and it was pretty close to some of the things I was experiencing as I made control inputs too.

I am seeing why the CG can go back further too, these planes seem to love to be tail heavy. I will dial the Elevators to a lower expo setting. and slowely take them to 0 (I believe +18 is 0 on JR 12x radios)

I'll keep you posted on more flights as I progress.

Kevin, Thanks! Yea, the only real video I think he got was when he thought I was going to crash when the engine flamed out! It was so funny...I landed it and rolled it right to the entrance of the tarmack! I think he was disappointed.

Rex

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RE: Flyeagle F18F - 7/6/2009 4:43 PM   
David Jackson


 

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Status: offline 		Rex,

Good to hear the maiden flight went well. I look forward to seeing it fly at Kentucky Jets, that will be just the motivation I need to start assemblying my hornet.

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RE: Flyeagle F18F - 7/6/2009 5:00 PM   
olnico



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quote:

ORIGINAL: rbxbear44

Oliver,
I am having a local flying buddy of mine make up some more sheer pins...NOT from hardened steel, I agree totally. I was speaking with a former F-18 pilot and he was telling me the flight characteristics of the real bird and it was pretty close to some of the things I was experiencing as I made control inputs too.

I am seeing why the CG can go back further too, these planes seem to love to be tail heavy. I will dial the Elevators to a lower expo setting. and slowely take them to 0 (I believe +18 is 0 on JR 12x radios)

I'll keep you posted on more flights as I progress.

Kevin, Thanks! Yea, the only real video I think he got was when he thought I was going to crash when the engine flamed out! It was so funny...I landed it and rolled it right to the entrance of the tarmack! I think he was disappointed.

Rex


Could you post the video of the deadstick landing ?
That would be a great help for everyone of us since you're the only guy on the planet who deadsticked this bird safely to the ground...

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RE: Flyeagle F18F - 7/6/2009 11:17 PM   
rbxbear44


 

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Status: offline 		Oliver,
Will do. I think I can get Jim to do that before we head out to KY Jets. FYI, I went NO FLAPS and gear down AFTER I new I could make the runway for sure. Made sure I kept the nose down all the way through to the point of landing flare. Elevators remained extremely responsive all the way through the event. Actually, need to give lots of credit to Joe Rafalowski...whom was cheering me on and giving me good advice all the way through.

I'll talk with Jim this afternoon about getting the video to post here.

Rex

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RE: Flyeagle F18F - 7/7/2009 12:29 AM   
olnico



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Status: offline 		Thanks

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RE: Flyeagle F18F - 7/7/2009 1:40 AM   
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quote:

ORIGINAL: rbxbear44

Oliver,
Will do. I think I can get Jim to do that before we head out to KY Jets. FYI, I went NO FLAPS and gear down AFTER I new I could make the runway for sure. Made sure I kept the nose down all the way through to the point of landing flare. Elevators remained extremely responsive all the way through the event. Actually, need to give lots of credit to Joe Rafalowski...whom was cheering me on and giving me good advice all the way through.

I'll talk with Jim this afternoon about getting the video to post here.

Rex


Congrats Rex!

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RE: Flyeagle F18F - 7/7/2009 3:58 PM   
jclittle


 

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Status: offline 		Here is the link to the video Rex was referring to. This was the 2nd flight and I had already shut my camera off thinking it will be just another uneventful flight, then the silence! Turned it back on to get the last few seconds of flight followed by a nice recovery and landing. Rex is certainly one lucky guy! It really slowed down very nice w/o flaps. Rex forgot to mention that that it was a down wind landing as well, albeit light winds. It was shot in HD...http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i3kIyHO1iVc

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RE: Flyeagle F18F - 7/7/2009 4:01 PM   
olnico



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Status: offline 		Well done Rex.
The trees were pretty close !
Your elevator is definitely too sensitive. How much throw do you have ?

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RE: Flyeagle F18F - 7/7/2009 5:53 PM   
rbxbear44


 

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Status: offline 		Oliver,
The trees...they look closer than they really are. My flameout occurred at that end of the runway so I was pretty far, actually into the wind on that leg of the flight. When I realized I had a Flameout, I turned immediately back to the runway and kept the nose down all the way till I knew I had it made. It was a downwind landing, winds were anywhere from calm to 10 mph, quartering towards me.

Anywho, Elevators...I had full rates at that point with 70mm of throw and +30 on expo. Remember, for the 12x, 0 or linear is +18.

I had the plane set up with 70mm for high, 60mm for mid, and 50mm for low. Since it was my first day on the plane, I hadn't had time to dial things in as I want. Suggestions????

I did notice Ailerons have tons of authority and so do rudders. Dialed rudders waaaay down and flew Ailerons at low rates with 15mm travel.

Andy, Kevin...thanks!!!

Rex

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RE: Flyeagle F18F - 7/7/2009 6:02 PM   
olnico



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Status: offline 		Yes, the elevator was way too high.
Start with 55 mm/ 48 mm/ 40 mm on the 3 DR settings with no expo.
Should be fine with your CG setting.

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RE: Flyeagle F18F - 7/7/2009 6:23 PM   
rbxbear44


 

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Status: offline 		Thanks Oliver, I will make the adjustments for the next flight.

Rex

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RE: Flyeagle F18F - 7/7/2009 7:17 PM   
olnico



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Status: offline 		25 flights reliability report.

Hello guys,
Here are my findings after the 25th flight ( 35 landings ).
The main gear plate system and retract do have serious weaknesses.

I saw the gear taking more "angle" from looking at the ground posture. So I decided to do a small inspection.
Good on me because the gear wouldn't have taken more landings.

The glass fiber plate is broken in the middle.



The rear main former ( the one that holds the rear wing tube joiners ) is broken:



The front gear former is broken as well (1) and unglued from the fuselage (2):



What happens is that the landing efforts ( 1 ) create a momentum that pushes the upper part of the formers out (2) and the lower part in (3)
So the formers flex and brake at the weak point.
Note that I anticipated this and reinforced the main former with a carbon/balsa sandwich plate (4), and harwood blocks across the gear plates but this was not enough.
Also note that this flexing momentum cracks the lower fuselage skin. When you see this crack appearing (5) this means that your formers are cracked as well...



I am going to redo the whole thing and put the new FEJ gear upgrade kit at the same time.
I strongly advise everyone to keep a close eye on this area and do an inspection every 20 flights.
I also strongly recommend a good reinforcement strategy. I will come back soon with suggestions.

The retract is also almost dedad as well.
The trunion sliding pin clearance has gone enormous ( 1,6 mm at the down lock ):


Here is the other side of the trunion groove ( up lock ):


The trunion rotation axis is also completely ovalized.

So I am in the process of making new retract side walls with my favorite Alumec 89 from Alcoa. I will also make a new larger titanium trunion axis stopped by a set screw fastening in the trunion.

BTW I did not have any hard landing with this plane.



< Message edited by olnico -- 7/7/2009 7:24 PM >

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RE: Flyeagle F18F - 7/7/2009 10:32 PM   
jetnuno


 

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Status: offline 		Your mods intentions sound really good Oliver.

I have always expected that the alu quality is good enough for a 25Lb aircraft, but defenetly not good for a 50-60Lb

The former woods and the aluminium gear are soft. The wood quality of the gear upgrade kit that FEJ sent for the gear mods have a MUCH better ply quality.

Hope they are learning......keep us posted on your mods, please

Congratulations on your maiden Rex

Regards

Nuno

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RE: Flyeagle F18F - 7/14/2009 2:08 AM   
rbxbear44


 

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Status: offline 		Well guys,
Just returned from Jets Over KY and had a darn good time! Lewis did it good and did it right, for sure! Got three more flights on the F-18. Had a bad landing and broke a main gear rail but my builder had it fixed and I was up the next day! Well, should have checked closer on the left main gear...lower strut was loose and pivoted on take off and it caused me to veer left and I had no nose steering to the right at all. Had to choose to kill the engine and hit the trees for a total loss OR...stay with full power and pull up...which happened and I missed a runway light by about 3 feet!!!! The Rhino is definitely enought to fly this bird because I was able to climb out at 30 degrees with 12 degrees of flaps, gear down and only about 500ft. of runway rollout before I rotated THANK GOD!

Anyway, Nothing hurt and landed it perrrrfect and got a standing O from the crowd. They probably did that because they figured I was a "newby" with the ugly takeoff I did

Anyway, the plane was very impressive and very stable. Really had a chance to wring it out for a few 7 minute flights. Just need to get the approches down better. Had a perfect landing on Thursday morning and then a crappy one on Friday late morning. Builder, Johnny worked to get her flying again and took it up again on Friday afternoon and greased it in again. Saturday winds were a howling crosswind up to 25 and just hung out with Eric Clapp and company.

Rex

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RE: Flyeagle F18F - 7/14/2009 4:38 AM   
Kmarks


 

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Status: offline 		Rex,

Glad that it turned out OK. I love the way my F18F flys but the landings have such a narrow window to grease it in. I had a beautiful flight and a perfect approach only to set her down just a tad bit to heavy and broke a sheer pin that protects the gear I have from breaking. I have allready installed new pin and she is ready to go.

Congrats on a great weekend of flying, and keep us posted on your success.



Kevin

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RE: Flyeagle F18F - 7/14/2009 10:01 AM   
olnico



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ORIGINAL: rbxbear44

The Rhino is definitely enought to fly this bird because I was able to climb out at 30 degrees with 12 degrees of flaps, gear down and only about 500ft. of runway rollout before I rotated THANK GOD!


Rex


Well Rex I'd say that if you would have had the FEJ pipe, you might not have made it considering the amount of thrust lost into it.
The Rhino is enough with the Tamjets pipe...

So on that respect I'd say that your investment in a Tamjets pipe just paid back...

< Message edited by olnico -- 7/14/2009 10:37 AM >

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RE: Flyeagle F18F - 7/14/2009 10:03 AM   
olnico



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Status: offline 		Very well done guys.
I am finishing the gear plates mods ( removable carbon/plywood flex plates for the mains ) and will return to you with the pictures.
I am also waiting for a quote from my metal supplyer for Alumec 89 corners to make new stronger retract walls.

< Message edited by olnico -- 7/14/2009 10:38 AM >

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RE: Flyeagle F18F - 7/14/2009 6:08 PM   
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Status: online 		Nice job Rex. Wish I could have made KY jets this year. Looks like you had a blast.

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RE: Flyeagle F18F - 7/19/2009 10:49 AM   
olnico



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Status: offline 		Hello guys,

I had a very nice flying session yesterday in a massive 15 kts crosswind ( I consider this as the maximum allowable crosswind for this plane with the wide stance ).
I did two flights with only landing practice, touch and goes, and go arounds.







I have finally pushed the CG back to 180 mm. The main reason is that when pushing the flight times to 14 minutes, the plane becomes unstable during approach ( the auto-pitchup effect comes back again ) with flaps 30.
The cure is to use flaps 15 for landing.
However at 180 mm the plane does not show this behaviour. I think that when at 190mm, the planes comes very close to the rear limit with an empty front tank.

The flex plates are doing a great job. They work a bit like blade spring suspension.
They are made of three layer ( from retract to top ): 3 mm aviation ply, 2 mm carbon plate, 6 mm aviation ply NOT GLUED TOGETHER
Similarly, the plates are not glued into the formers. Just inserted. This allows them to slide one to the other and act as a suspension system.



Note the former reinforcements made of 6 mm aviation grade ply on the rear one and 3 mm on the front.



I have not used the formers provided by FEJ because I don't like the new geometry. The angles are good but I find the retract placed way too low ( almost 1 inch lower ). This gives a massive negative angle ( -2°) on the ground.
So I have made the new plate with the modified geometry I used before: same gear position as the original but tilted outward by 20°.
This works really great with smooth-like-silk takeoffs and a nice wide stance that really helps in crosswind or during taxi.

I had to stop after the second flight because I am starting to get slop in the right elevator. I think that a bearing is going south there. I'll keep you informed.

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RE: Flyeagle F18F - 7/19/2009 2:29 PM   
olnico



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Status: offline 		Elevator system feedback:

The bearings are fine. In fact the elevator system rear mounting screws ( al 44 of them ) were loosing up. It appeared that I forgot to put thread locking liquid on these ones...
No arm anyway since I do my routine inspection after each flight.

However to all F-18F users: check these screws and MAKE SURE that they are loctited.
They are extremely solicited during the flight and WILL unscrew if not properly fastened with possibly dramatic consequences.

Now I have to go flying again...

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RE: Flyeagle F18F - 7/19/2009 2:40 PM   
salibaj


 

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Status: offline 		Oliver,

Are you using the aluminium round servo arms to drive the elevator? If yes please, can you give me a website link from where to buy them? Earlier in this thread I have read that the links for push-pull action must be offset on the servo arm to eliminate any binding issues.

Regards

Joseph

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RE: Flyeagle F18F - 7/19/2009 3:08 PM   
olnico



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Status: offline 		Hi Joseph,

Here is the product:
http://www.airwildpilotshop.com/MoreInfo-1.asp?title=product&id=288

The best thing to do to have a precise offset is to check the geometry on paper, then try it on a plastic wheel, and only then drill the aluminium hub.
When you do the test, install both pusrods onto the elevator dual arm , but hook up only one to the servo hub and check if the opposite hole stays fixed regarding its corresponding ball link.

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RE: Flyeagle F18F - 7/19/2009 3:37 PM   
salibaj


 

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Status: offline 		Oliver,

Thank you so much for the link. I noted that there should be an arm bolted to the Uni-Hub. What did you use? Or it comes a complete kit and then one can modify to his needs? Sorry for all these questions, but would like exactly what to order.

Regards

Joseph

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