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All Forums >> RC Airplanes >> Pylon Universe - RC Pylon Racing >> Club 40 >> Club 40 Minimum Weight?
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Club 40 Minimum Weight? - 8/7/2008 11:43 PM   
DonStegall


 

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Status: offline 		While this is a question for the RCPRO Club 40 Committee, I'm posting it here because...

Long time racers are used to having a minimum weight requirement. I've been getting this question locally, and right now we don't have a minimum weight established.

An absolutely stock Sky Raider Mach II with TT Pro 40, standard Futaba Servos, standard flat battery pack, standard Futaba 127DF receiver, a stock tank, and no additional covering is right at 4 pounds and 12 ounces. But if someone uses a lighter receiver, lighter battery pack, or even a mini servo on throttle, it goes under that. I don't think you can specify 4 pounds 10 ounces. Maybe you can. If someone uses mini servos, a DSM receiver, and a NiMH pack, they might come in at 4 1/2. So I think that is a reasonable minimum.

An LA Racer 40 weighs a few ounces more than a Sky Raider Mach II. They seemed faster before the nose changes in the latest SRM2, but most people feel the SRM2 turns tighter. Maybe it is the weight. Maybe it is less surface area on the SRM2 fuselage even though the LA Racer 40 "looks" more aerodynamic.

It would be good to have people list their configuration and the dry weight.

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RE: Club 40 Minimum Weight? - 8/7/2008 11:54 PM   
cwesh



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Status: offline 		On my ARF SkyRaiders I came in at 4lb 10oz using standard size flight pack, in fact the same one you have.

On my Clone Raiders, using the same setup, they are weighing in at 4lb 9oz. All of my 'Raiders use an 8oz fuel tank, either a Sullivan RST 8 or the tank that comes with the ARF.

I agree that 4lb 8oz would be a good choice for a minimum.

Later!



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RE: Club 40 Minimum Weight? - 8/7/2008 11:57 PM   
rcpilot32


 

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Status: offline 		I am using a 2.4 receiver, NIMI flat pack, standard servos, and my SR comes in at 4lb 12.

Did I get one that is heavy?

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RE: Club 40 Minimum Weight? - 8/8/2008 12:18 AM   
cwesh



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Status: offline 		I wonder if the newer ARFs are heavier, my ARF is almost 2 years old, it does not have the reinforced gear and other mods that WM may have made since then. It has been recovered with Ultracote.

Humm.......

Later!

Chuck...

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RE: Club 40 Minimum Weight? - 8/8/2008 12:53 AM   
DonStegall


 

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Status: offline 		The planes vary. That is why I posted the message here. To get maximum input.

ToughLon varies by color. I weighed some unwrapped rolls and got this:

Red: ~24 grams
Orange: ~25 grams
Yellow: ~26 grams
White: ~28 grams
Transparent Red: ~20.7 grams
Transparent Yellow: ~21 grams
various checkerboards: 26-28 grams

Even with 2 rolls of covering that is only about 1/4 ounce difference.

I think the balsa and light ply vary enough that the planes vary by 1-2 ounces. Plus I have stressed using enough glue to ABM and TWM. Structural integrity is high on my list. Planes aren't worth racing if the glue joints don't hold up.

One place you can easily add 1/4 to 1/2 ounce is joining the wing. I usually use epoxy and microfibers for the strength. I could save weight by using microballoons with a little cab-o-sil to thicken it and save a little weight. Using straight epoxy can be the heaviest.

Even with the weight variances, the racing is still close and fun. I like seeing the decorative trim schemes. All I carry anymore are the solid colors, except when stocks get low. Planes like Dave Glasscock's Menacing Molar and Terry Hickey's Hooters plane are just fun to see at the field.

I plan to do an ARC up in transparent and I don't want to have to add weight to it.

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RE: Club 40 Minimum Weight? - 8/8/2008 2:28 AM   
gunfighter


 

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Status: offline 		At one event last year, we did a full technical inspection to see what every one was running. We also weighed all planes.

The lightest one I have ever weighed used mini digital servo's, a 350 mah batt and small receiver. It had also been re-coverred with Ultracote. It weighed 4 pounds 7 oz. Most of the planes were around 4 pounds 10 oz. (sky Raiders) and 4 pounds 13 - 15 oz for LA Racers.

I think 4 pounds 8 oz would be a good min. weight.

I will poll the committee.

Chuck

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RE: Club 40 Minimum Weight? - 8/9/2008 5:18 PM   
DonStegall


 

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Status: offline 		My brain wasn't working when I weighed the ToughLon. I was not feeling well and somehow I saw a decimal point on the scale that was not there. So the difference in weight of the colors is actually huge.

A roll of red weighs 247 grams versus a roll of white at 271 grams. That is 24 grams just for one roll. and it takes more than one roll for a complete airplane. So a red ARF has at least a one ounce advantage over a white ARF.

This would also explain part of the weight difference between the LA Racer 40 and the Sky Raider Mach II planes, as the LA Racer is covered completely in white, plus it has trim in heavy checkerboards.

The difference in transparents is even more dramatic with transparent red coming in at 207 grams. That is a 64 gram difference. Over 2 ounces for one roll !!!

The Sky Raider Mach II ARC's should become much more popular with this info.

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RE: Club 40 Minimum Weight? - 8/9/2008 9:41 PM   
gunfighter


 

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Status: offline 		The RCPRO Club 40 committee has agreed on 4 pounds 8 oz as a minimum weight.

Don - please add to the rules as appropriate.

Chuck

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RE: Club 40 Minimum Weight? - 9/18/2008 6:30 PM   
458ronnyb


 

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Status: offline 		We ammended our club 40 rules to help alleviate the weight variances by restricting servos to Standart size servos. If our opinion, as a new club to Club 40 racing, this will prevent newbies from the delima of buying new equipment for their Worlds Models. In addition, we added a Spec class for any and all aircraft with minimal wing, fuse, and maximun stock engine specs. Our purpose was to allow anyone to race without having to buy a specific airplane. I think it will help grow the sport by allowing someone to race with what they already have. No added expense for the people who have never tried pylon racing but would like to try it out before spending more money. We are running a 3 pylon course, to help promote the flying skill for newcomers. Most clubs in our area only fly 2 pylon, and the likelyhood of mid air collisions is very tantamount in the new fliers. Our first scheduled race is Sept 28th. We'll see if the Spec class works.

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RE: Club 40 Minimum Weight? - 9/19/2008 5:32 AM   
skull1971



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Status: offline 		I'd say for first time racers, go 2 pole. This puts everything in front of the pilots, like their already use to. 3 pole is lots of fun but takes some getting use to, it's different. Just my 2 cents, have fun and be safe!!! Post results and pic's if you get them.

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RE: Club 40 Minimum Weight? - 1/29/2009 3:10 AM   
mdwpylonracer42h


 

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Status: offline 		Doug,

When I first entered into Club 40 racing, I had been a reasonably long time racer in the NMPRA 422 and 428 series. I live in Texas, so I asked Jim Duda about weight. He said don't modify the airframe, but build it as light as you possibly can. Also, the servos must have 4 bolt mounting. So I did and I came out with a Sky Raider that weighed less than 4lbs 3 oz. The way I acheived that was using two mini servos for the ailerons and elevator and JR micro servos for the throttle and rudder. JR makes micro servos that are 4 bolt, unlike the equivalent Hitec, etc. I also used carbon fiber pushrods for the elevator and rudder. I cut out the existing "nyrod" system. I used a 4 oz. Tetra bladder tank as well for reduction in weight, and mounted it as far to the top as possible for better fuel distribution to an upright engine. The battery pack I used was a Radical RC 400 mah NiMh pack. The receiver was a Spectrum 6 channel long range receiver.

Anyway, the point of all this is that you can build the Sky Raider and the LA Racer a lot lighter than 4-1/2 lbs with careful management of what you put in them. I agree that the minimum weight should be 4-1/2 lbs. Therefore I have an outlaw plane.

I have built another Sky Raider with all standard size servos and with the other modifications as described above and it comes in at 4 lbs. 7 oz. Close, but need another oz of weight.

Just for fun, I built an LA Racer with a Sport Jett 46, all standard servos except with two minis for the ailerons, and a Tru Turn Spinner (Tru Turn spinners are OK except their adapter is heavy, MPI makes a lot lighter spinner because the adapter is much lighter) and it came in at 4 lbs 9 oz.

I am in favor of a minimum weight limit of 4-1/2 lbs. I have prooved to myself that less weight is possible without sacrificing airplane integrity, but don't won't to do so to keep everything relatively cheep and obtainable and fun!

Thanks,

Mike W

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RE: Club 40 Minimum Weight? - 1/29/2009 7:58 PM   
DonStegall


 

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Status: offline 		Thanks for bringing this topic back up.

I had forgotten to update the rules on the RCPRO web site. I have updated the page and anyone who goes to www.Club40Racing.com will now see the minimum weight of 4 pounds 8 ounces.

We had instituted a 4 screw per servo restriction early on as that eliminated the small two screw servos and it complied with the AMA general R/C Pylon Racing requirements.

But the minimum weight is now online.

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