RE: ***** New E Flite F16 400 DF (Thunderbird Scheme) *****

RE: ***** New E Flite F16 400 DF (Thunderbird Scheme) *****
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RE: ***** New E Flite F16 400 DF (Thunderbird Scheme) ... - 11/2/2008 1:41:15 PM

Posts: 106
Joined: 2/28/2002
From: Clanton, AL, USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: David Eichstedt

quote:

ORIGINAL: bearcatf8

Dave; you say the motor is a in runner 400. Is this a E-Flight motor painted black ? I have a T-28 and it says that it is a 480 ,but is black.What is the Kv of this motor? I know E-Flight list a 4200 Kv motor ,would this make the performance better ? I'm in line to get a F-16 and want it to have good vertical as well as good take off ooompf ! Has sanyone done any mods to the power system ?

The ParkZone T-28 motor is a different motor than the E-flite Park 480, as you have discovered. The F-16 motor is not a Park 400 inrunner, but it's very, very similar. Much more similar to the Park 400 than the T-28 motor is to the Park 480. Regarding power system upgrades, I'm sorry but we don't have any recommendations at this time. Perhaps in the near future

David

DAve ,you think you could get a list of motors /fan that we could bolt into the fuselage of the F-16 ? Even a drawing that shows the blot patern or something like that !

(in reply to David Eichstedt)

RE: ***** New E Flite F16 400 DF (Thunderbird Scheme)... - 11/2/2008 10:42:27 PM

Posts: 106
Joined: 2/28/2002
From: Clanton, AL, USA
Status: offline

Never mind ; all did not go well with the first flight. First it was difficult to get a rolling start off grass , I think I had the CG in the wrong place because it seemed very nose heavy and was diving as soon as the stick pressure was relaxed. Did not want to turn very well ,as soon as it went into a bank ,it would tend to roll over too far and the nose would drop. As i banked every so slightly around the field I got into the sun and was blinded and lost sight of it. Rolled over onto it's back and went straight in . One . thing it seemed slow and just barely flying ,on the verge of a stall. anything less than full throttle ,drop the nose and look out.And I could see some fan tip rub on the shroud . I think the elevators were blanked out by the wing ? No damage to radio or battery ,but the fuselage from the wing fwd is gone. Im going to double check where i had the CG and ....well im out of the ducted fan buisness for now >

(in reply to bearcatf8)

RE: ***** New E Flite F16 400 DF (Thunderbird Scheme)... - 11/2/2008 11:21:56 PM

Posts: 31
Joined: 12/20/2006
From: Concord, CA, USA
Status: offline

I didn't have any controll issues with mine but you are right that you have to keep full throttle on all the time just to maintain flight. The book said not to keep it full trottle but you can't gain any altitude or stay level unless it was.

(in reply to bearcatf8)

RE: ***** New E Flite F16 400 DF (Thunderbird Scheme)... - 11/3/2008 12:19:29 AM

Posts: 106
Joined: 2/28/2002
From: Clanton, AL, USA
Status: offline

CG was right on 2 3/16 I remember where it was. after looking at the wing again, It could have been futher back from what I saw and recall now ,but you have to be conserned about being tail haevy. The Elevators were set zero straight with the stab . It nosed down a little after the hand launch ,but I let it build some speed and then climbed out shallow and thats when I knoticed it didn't want to turn very well. And it seemed to not keep a steady speed ,it was slowing down ,thats when it got in the sun ,turned toward me which I didn't see ,then rolled over on to it's back and spin in . well I'm done with it I'll try something else . Maybe a F-86 Hobby Lobby ?

(in reply to wtmcgehee)

RE: ***** New E Flite F16 400 DF (Thunderbird Scheme)... - 11/3/2008 12:20:45 AM

Posts: 106
Joined: 2/28/2002
From: Clanton, AL, USA
Status: offline

sorry duplicate Squawk !

< Message edited by bearcatf8 -- 11/3/2008 1:08:08 AM >

(in reply to wtmcgehee)

RE: ***** New E Flite F16 400 DF (Thunderbird Scheme)... - 11/3/2008 1:12:20 AM

29904

Posts: 52
Joined: 5/19/2004
From: ROA, VA, USA
Status: offline

Thanks for your suggestions however I use a balancing charger and that is not the source of my problem. I did try to change the timing of the E-flite 30 Pro speed controller but an old fellow like me I soon got lost in all the beeps so gave up. Eflite needs to get a simpler way to make changes to their speed controllers. I replaced the E-flite with a Turnagy 40 amp and the pulsing issue is now gone and she seemed to have plenty of power. Thankfully the Turnagy has a program card that makes changes so simple that even I can manage to do it right.
E-flite, are you listening?

Also I have experienced the nose drop issue in a turn for landing and considered that the CG is too nose heavy. I have been reluctant to change the CG because I have it at the rear most recommend point.
Also considered adding a working rudder to help keep the nose from diving in a turn. Has anyone flown their F-16 with a working rudder and if you have what was your experience like?

Thus far I can say this has not been a fun airplane to fly and I am now wishing I had saved the $170 for some thing else. Can you offer any suggestions Dave?

Larry

< Message edited by 29904 -- 11/3/2008 1:24:21 AM >

(in reply to wtmcgehee)

RE: ***** New E Flite F16 400 DF (Thunderbird Scheme)... - 11/3/2008 1:22:08 AM

Posts: 106
Joined: 2/28/2002
From: Clanton, AL, USA
Status: offline

I changed the timeing on my ESC and it is hard to understand the beeps, but I got it correct. It stopped the surging . If you have seen the video of the F-16 on the Horizon web site and heard the sound of the fan, Mine was nothing like that and was not performing anywhere close to that. and was not that stable. Not Bashing it just telling what I saw and felt on mine !

(in reply to 29904)

RE: ***** New E Flite F16 400 DF (Thunderbird Scheme)... - 11/3/2008 1:34:51 AM

Posts: 31
Joined: 12/20/2006
From: Concord, CA, USA
Status: offline

It is not a CG problem. Every ducted fan plane I own has to have have a slight amount of up elevater. If you have them stright with the horizontal stab you need to trim it up alittle.

(in reply to 29904)

RE: ***** New E Flite F16 400 DF (Thunderbird Scheme)... - 11/3/2008 1:35:29 AM

29904

Posts: 52
Joined: 5/19/2004
From: ROA, VA, USA
Status: offline

Thanks for your answer and me not getting the timing right is probably part of the problem. I guess I am spoiled since I started using Turnagy speed controllers they have made reprogramming so easy with their little card.

I just hope the E-flite fellows work on a simpler programing method for their controllers.
Thanks again,
Larry

(in reply to bearcatf8)

RE: ***** New E Flite F16 400 DF (Thunderbird Scheme)... - 11/3/2008 2:15:13 AM

29904

Posts: 52
Joined: 5/19/2004
From: ROA, VA, USA
Status: offline

Thanks for your reply but to me that would appear to be a nose heavy situation if you have to trim the elevator up. I have maximum elevator movement but the nose still dives steeply in a turn and the only way to recover is full throttle and hope you have the altitude. That makes for a very tricky approach for landing because of the excess speed necessary to keep control of the bird in the turn for final.

I have considered making a working rudder but that really messes up the Thunderbird decal on the rudder but I guess that would be better than loosing the airplane to a crash because you couldn't keep the nose up in a turn for final.
Thanks again guys,
Larry

(in reply to wtmcgehee)

RE: ***** New E Flite F16 400 DF (Thunderbird Scheme)... - 11/3/2008 7:34:43 AM

huycao

Posts: 4
Joined: 4/27/2007
From: , TX, USA
Status: offline

i wonder if the f-16 in the vid from horizon hobby using stock set up .
my f-16 way tooooo under power . i had to use 100% throtle all the time just to keep it in the air ...
took out the motor and fan to day ....
E-FLITE NOW USING ART-TECH FAN AND MOTOR IN THERE PRODUCT.....i had nothing to say to e-flite ....i just throw away $170 and not very happy with this ...
anyway the jet look nice but can not fly right ...30-35 mph that what i can get for $170 arf jet ....
i'm using phoenix 35 esc and thunder power extreme 3s 2200mah ...
i removed the rocket and rail . make 2 cheater hole on the jet .. still can't make it faster ...
may be need a upgrade motor ....

i had some wemotec 480 fan and mega 16/15/2 ready to install.. but still had some problem with where i can put a 4s 3300mah battery ????
headage ......

< Message edited by huycao -- 11/3/2008 7:37:21 AM >

(in reply to 29904)

RE: ***** New E Flite F16 400 DF (Thunderbird Scheme)... - 11/3/2008 1:52:48 PM

Posts: 106
Joined: 2/28/2002
From: Clanton, AL, USA
Status: offline

I too wished I'd save my money for something else. It's a good looking plane if you dont handle it much . I would rather had waited for the BAe Hawk . I think it would have been a better choice . Better fan unit and a lot more money spent ! Well I got a extra battery and a 30 amp ESC that I cant use right now ,well I can use the battery in the T-28. All I got is a pile of styrofoam that use to be the nose section and the rest I could stick to the wall like it ran into it. 170 bucks up a wild hogs .............but ! THANKS H H or should I say E-F

< Message edited by bearcatf8 -- 11/3/2008 1:54:37 PM >

(in reply to huycao)

RE: ***** New E Flite F16 400 DF (Thunderbird Scheme)... - 11/3/2008 2:38:09 PM

Posts: 347
Joined: 6/7/2006
From: cleveland , OH, USA
Status: offline

I do hope that Dave weighs in because he has a chance to turn this thing around if he can.

I am glad that this information is surfacing and at the same time saddened that the posters here have dropped the coin on standard setups that are performing in this fashion.

I walked by both the HL and EF versions at the LHS this weekend and kept walking for now. Still looking to get into EDF, but I will continue to wait and see what comes back from Horizon, as well as seeing what might come out in January from SAPAC. I guess if I get desperate (from waiting) there is always the Phase 3 F16

(in reply to bearcatf8)

RE: ***** New E Flite F16 400 DF (Thunderbird Scheme)... - 11/3/2008 5:44:34 PM

Sam77

Posts: 41
Joined: 11/29/2007
From: Hood River, OR, USA
Status: offline

Ugh. I just got mine put together this weekend - but it's not sounding like I'm going to have a great go at a decent maiden flight. It sounds like I'd be best served by gutting the Art-Tech crap out and putting in a hotter motor and fan.

To the folks that are using the landing gear - any issues with landing at all? Gear breaking/foam breaking/etc?

-Sam

(in reply to wedgewing)

RE: ***** New E Flite F16 400 DF (Thunderbird Scheme)... - 11/3/2008 6:34:01 PM

Posts: 347
Joined: 6/7/2006
From: cleveland , OH, USA
Status: offline

I would give it a whirl Sam.. Dave from Horizon stated that they have some favorite planes around the office like the T28 and the Corsair. He stated that this plane was one of them too. One of these has to fly as advertised

I am really hoping to hear a report that a successful maiden went off with stock equipment set up and flew as nicely as the Horizon website video... There has to be someone who has the plane fly better than if they just attached the motor to the box it came in....which is what it starting to sound like....

still very little video out there other than the Horizon clip.....maybe too much swearing on the ones filmed

(in reply to Sam77)